[House Hearing, 116 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
AN UPDATE ON THE ROHINGYA CRISIS
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HEARING
BEFORE THE
SUBCOMMITTEE ON ASIA, THE PACIFIC AND NONPROLIFERATION
OF THE
COMMITTEE ON FOREIGN AFFAIRS
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
ONE HUNDRED SIXTEENTH CONGRESS
SECOND SESSION
__________
August 3, 2020
__________
Serial No. 116-125
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Printed for the use of the Committee on Foreign Affairs
[GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Available: http://www.foreignaffairs.house.gov/, http://
docs.house.gov,
or http://www.govinfo.gov
__________
U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
41-944 PDF WASHINGTON : 2021
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COMMITTEE ON FOREIGN AFFAIRS
ELIOT L. ENGEL, New York, Chairman
BRAD SHERMAN, California MICHAEL T. McCAUL, Texas, Ranking
GREGORY W. MEEKS, New York Member
ALBIO SIRES, New Jersey CHRISTOPHER H. SMITH, New Jersey
GERALD E. CONNOLLY, Virginia STEVE CHABOT, Ohio
THEODORE E. DEUTCH, Florida JOE WILSON, South Carolina
KAREN BASS, California SCOTT PERRY, Pennsylvania
WILLIAM KEATING, Massachusetts TED S. YOHO, Florida
DAVID CICILLINE, Rhode Island ADAM KINZINGER, Illinois
AMI BERA, California LEE ZELDIN, New York
JOAQUIN CASTRO, Texas JIM SENSENBRENNER, Wisconsin
DINA TITUS, Nevada ANN WAGNER, Missouri
ADRIANO ESPAILLAT, New York BRIAN MAST, Florida
TED LIEU, California FRANCIS ROONEY, Florida
SUSAN WILD, Pennsylvania BRIAN FITZPATRICK, Pennsylvania
DEAN PHILLPS, Minnesota JOHN CURTIS, Utah
ILHAN OMAR, Minnesota KEN BUCK, Colorado
COLIN ALLRED, Texas RON WRIGHT, Texas
ANDY LEVIN, Michigan GUY RESCHENTHALER, Pennsylvania
ABIGAIL SPANBERGER, Virginia TIM BURCHETT, Tennessee
CHRISSY HOULAHAN, Pennsylvania GREG PENCE, Indiana
TOM MALINOWSKI, New Jersey STEVE WATKINS, Kansas
DAVID TRONE, Maryland MIKE GUEST, Mississippi
JIM COSTA, California
JUAN VARGAS, California
VICENTE GONZALEZ, Texas
Jason Steinbaum, Staff Director
Brendan Shields, Republican Staff Director
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Subcommittee on Asia, the Pacific and Nonproliferation
AMI BERA, California, Chairman,
DINA TITUS, Nevada TED YOHO, Florida, Ranking Member
CHRISSY HOULAHAN, Pennsylvania SCOTT PERRY, Pennsylvania
GERALD CONNOLLY, Virgina ANN WAGNER, Missouri
ANDY LEVIN, Michigan BRIAN MAST, Florida
ABIGAIL SPANBERGER, Virginia JOHN CURTIS, Utah
Nikole Burroughs, Staff Director
C O N T E N T S
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Page
WITNESSES
Schwartz, The Honorable Eric, President, Refugees International.. 7
Nu, Wai Wai, Executive Director, Women's Peace Network........... 17
Neville, Allyson, Associate Director for International
Humanitarian Response Policy and Advocacy, Save the Children... 23
Enos, Olivia, Senior Policy Analyst, The Heritage Foundation..... 30
INFORMATION SUBMITTED FOR THE RECORD
Information submitted for the record from The Honorable Eric
Schwartz....................................................... 51
APPENDIX
Hearing Notice................................................... 65
Hearing Minutes.................................................. 67
Hearing Attendance............................................... 68
STATEMENT SUBMITTED FOR THE RECORD
Statement submitted for the record from Representative Connolly.. 69
AN UPDATE ON THE ROHINGYA CRISIS
Monday, August 3, 2020
House of Representatives,
Subcommittee on Asia, the Pacific, and
Nonproliferation
Committee on Foreign Affairs,
Washington, DC
The subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 2:03 p.m., via
Webex, Hon. Ami Bera (chairman of the subcommittee) presiding.
Mr. Bera. The Subcommittee on Asia, Pacific, and
Nonproliferation will come to order. Without objection, the
chair is authorized to declare a recess of the committee at any
point. And all members will have 5 days to submit statements,
extraneous materials, and questions for the record subject to
the length limitation in the rules. To insert something into
the record, please have your staff email the previously
mentioned address or contact full committee staff. Please keep
your video function on at all times, even when you are not
recognized by the chair. Members are responsible for muting and
unmuting themselves. And please remember to mute yourself after
you finish speaking.
Consistent with H.Res. 965 and the accompanying regulations
staff will only mute members and witnesses as appropriate when
they are not under recognition to eliminate background noise.
Seeing that we are a quorum, I will now recognize myself
for opening remarks. Pursuant to notice, we are holding a
hearing to discuss an update on the Rohingya crisis.
I want to thank the ranking member, Mr. Yoho, the members
of this subcommittee, and our witnesses, members of the public
for joining us today. While COVID-19 has had many harmful and
negative consequences, one benefit is we are still able to
continue to conduct our committee work, even if we have to it
as a virtual hearing. This topic is as timely as ever.
Later this month will mark 3 years since the Tatmadaw, the
Burmese military, began what they called clearance operations
against the Rohingya in the Rakhine State. In reality, what we
witnessed was ethnic cleansing and what should be considered a
genocide. According to the U.N. Independent International Fact-
Finding Mission on Myanmar, what took place was actually the
killing of thousands of Rohingya civilians, as well as forced
disappearances, mass gang rapes, and the burning of villages in
the hundreds.
We decided to hold this hearing because although our Nation
and the world is grappling with a pandemic and massive economic
recession, we have to continue to remain vigilant and watch
what is happening around the world. What we have seen is these
actions against the Rohingya are egregious and repulsive. But
they are not without precedent. We would like to say that these
are inhuman acts, but these types of actions have unfortunately
shown them to be depressingly regular and familiar in the 20th
and 21st century. They should not be in this modern world.
It is the role of this subcommittee to provide oversight of
this region, and we need to get back it our regular duties when
we are not engaged in COVID responsiveness. What the hearing
will look at, you know, it is that, clear 3 years later, Burma
is still not respecting the basic human rights of the Rohingya.
Three years later, the victims in Burma and Bangladesh and the
international community are still dealing with the
consequences. That is what this hearing will examine. What is
the current status of those who have fled to Bangladesh and
were placed in Cox's Bazar? How is COVID-19 shaping the
situation on the ground? And how have Burma's neighbors
welcomed or not welcomed the Rohingya refugees.
This hearing will also examine the role of the United
States and the international community. What additional steps
should the U.S. Government and the international community take
to help the Rohingya people and assist Bangladesh in caring for
them? How should we ensure justice and accountability for the
victims of this brutal campaign against the Rohingya
perpetrated by the Burmese military? And, finally, this hearing
will examine prospects for peace and the return of the Rohingya
State--or of the Rohingya to the Rakhine State.
With that, I look forward to the testimony of our
witnesses. Have we been joined--I do see the ranking member,
Mr. Yoho, on the call. And, with that, let me turn it over to
the ranking member, Mr. Yoho, for his opening remarks.
Mr. Yoho. One, two, three, four, five. Can you hear me?
Mr. Bera. We can.
Mr. Yoho. Thank you, Chairman Bera.
And thank you for each of our witnesses for joining us
today to discuss this important and timely issue facing the
Rohingya. I look forward to this hearing--from hearing from
each of you in how the United States can better save this
population and hold the government of Myanmar accountable for
its abuses. We are gathered here today due to the continued
mistreatment of the Rohingya minority in Burma, a situation
that has persisted since the early 1960's where the Rohingya
have been stripped of their citizenship, basic human rights,
and fundamental freedoms.
Conditions for the Rohingya worsened to a horrific extent
several years ago when the region erupted into full-scale,
State-sponsored violence, killing tens of thousands and forcing
over 700,000 to flee to neighboring countries like Bangladesh.
During my time in Congress, my colleagues and I have
repeatedly striven to hold the government of Myanmar
accountable for its ethnic cleansing of the Rohingya. I was
proud to be a cosponsor of the BURMA Act of 2019, which passed
the House late last year and have led multiple efforts to usual
the Treasury Department to hold Myanmar accountable through
sanctions, which has led to the Trump Administration imposing
visa and economic sanctions on nine Tatmadaw military officers
and two military units for their involvement in extrajudicial
killings in the Rakhine State.
While some actions have been taken, it has clearly not been
enough to stop the violence. Despite many condemnations and
sanctions from the United States, the international community,
the Rohingya continues to face discrimination, violence,
murder, rape, torture, and death from their own government. The
approach our country and the international community has taken
to resolve this crisis has failed.
Part of solving the crisis of this magnitude rests in
definition, which some have been too cautious to act on. Let's
be clear: what is happening in Myanmar toward the Rohingya is
State-sponsored genocide, period. It has been our commitment
since the Holocaust to resolve and to say ``never again.'' Yet
the cleansing of the Rohingya in the concentration camps in
Xinjiang province in China with the Uighurs, the East Turk
population, it is as if the world has forgotten the words and
the promises made to stand strong against these types of
injustices. Therefore, we must consider stronger measures than
we have before, including the possibility of suspending aid to
a government that has taken the lives and the livelihoods of an
entire ethnicity within its borders. American tax dollars
should not fund any kind of foreign assistance going to regimes
responsible for disenfranchising over a billion of its own
people, much less conducting a coordinated campaign of ethnic
cleansing. The arrival of this pandemic has only worsened the
conditions facing the Rohingya, as many find themselves in
either overcrowded refugee camps with little access to medical
attention and equipment.
As we move toward developing a reliable vaccine for COVID-
19, the international vaccine organizations like Gavi and CEPI
must play an active role in helping deliver lifesaving medical
treatment to the Rohingya, many of whom find themselves without
a government willing to provide for their wellbeing.
I look forward to hearing from our witnesses and my fellow
colleagues on how we can change these goals. And thank you. And
I apologize; I am on a cell phone, and I cannot read my notes.
Thank you.
Mr. Bera. Thank you, Ranking Member Yoho.
In a moment, I am going to introduce our witnesses and
recognize them for their statements, but I would like to take 1
minute to yield a minute to my good friend Mr. Chabot, who has
been a leader on speaking out on behalf of the Rohingya and
introduced with Chairman Engel the BURMA Act, which the
committee and the House passed last year.
Mr. Chabot.
Mr. Chabot. Thank you very much, Chairman Bera, and also
Ranking Member Yoho. And I will be brief.
We all know the tragic story about what happened here, how,
beginning in August 2017, the Burmese military carried out a
systematic, premeditated campaign of murder, rape, and terror
amounting to genocide against the Rohingya.
Since then, I have worked with my colleagues on both sides
of the aisle. And I want to especially thank Eliot Engel and
also Joe Crowley, who was instrumental in working on this
during his time in Congress, trying to raise awareness in our
country and around the globe on this issue and hold the
perpetrators accountable. The House overwhelmingly voted in
favor of proclaiming these atrocities a genocide and in
sanctioning the perpetrators. Yet despite the outrage, not much
has really changed over the last 3 years.
The humanitarian situation remains frozen with a million
Rohingya in refugee camps in Bangladesh while international
pressure has had little impact on the behavior of the Burmese
Government or on the Burmese military.
With this in mind, we must not let the passage of time nor
fatigue numb our horror at what happened in 2017 and what is
happening to this day, nor our resolve to achieve a solution.
So thank you for holding this, and I yield back.
Mr. Bera. Thank you, Mr. Chabot.
I will now introduce our witnesses. Our witnesses for
today's hearing are The Honorable Eric Schwartz, Ms. Wai Wai
Nu, Ms. Allyson Neville, and Olivia Enos. I would like to thank
all of our witnesses for being here today.
The Honorable Eric Schwartz is currently president of
Refugees International. He previously served as U.S. Assistant
Secretary of State for Population, Refugees, and Migration from
2009 to 2011.
Ms. Wai Wai Nu is the founder and executive director of the
Women's Peace Network in Myanmar. Nu is currently serving as a
fellow at the Simon-Skjodt Center for the Prevention of
Genocide, U.S. Holocaust Memorial Museum. She spent 7 years as
a political prisoner in Burma.
Allyson Neville is the associate director for International
Humanitarian Response Policy and Advocacy at Save the Children,
where she focuses on education in emergencies and the
protection of children in conflict, as well as the Rohingya
response in Afghanistan.
And, finally, Ms. Olivia Enos is a senior policy analyst in
the Asian Studies Center at the Heritage Foundation, where she
focus on human rights and national security challenges in Asia,
including democracy and government challenges, refugee issues,
and other challenges.
I will now recognize each witness for 5 minutes. And,
without objection, your prepared written statements will be
made part of record.
I will first call on The Honorable Eric Schwartz for your
testimony. Mr. Schwartz.
STATEMENT OF THE HONORABLE ERIC SCHWARTZ, PRESIDENT, REFUGEES
INTERNATIONAL
Mr. Schwartz. Thank you, Chairman Bera and members of the
subcommittee for holding this hearing and for your important
efforts surrounding Rohingya. I will summarize my written
remarks submitted for the record.
August 25th will mark 3 years since the start of the
expulsion of more than 700,000 Rohingya from Myanmar, also
known as Burma. Nearly 900,000 are in camps in Bangladesh.
Hundreds have recently been stranded at sea after being turned
back from Malaysia and Bangladesh, and many have certainly
drowned. Some 600,000 Rohingya remain in Burma, facing ongoing
abuses.
I am going to address challenges in the refugee camps in
Bangladesh, ongoing abuses in Burma, and the question of
genocide and the global humanitarian imperatives around COVID-
19.
I will begin with the challenges in Bangladesh. While small
numbers of Rohingya in the camps have tested positive for
COVID-19, testing is limited and the worst is yet to come.
Access restrictions and other indirect effects of the pandemic
have worsened conditions, and we are very worried about COVID-
19's negative impact on gender-based violence in particular.
Misinformation about COVID-19 is pervasive in the camps and
compounded by Bangladesh Government restrictions on
communication. And we remained alarmed by government plans and
early efforts to move Rohingya to Bhasan Char, an island in the
Bay of Bengal in light of serious questions about safety and
voluntariness of such movements. In Rakhine State in Burma,
conditions remain unacceptable. And it bears mention that
abuses in Burma are not restricted to the Rohingya, but extend
to several ethnic minority groups throughout the country.
I will now turn to the question of genocide and the
requests of a broad coalition that the State Department declare
Burma responsible for genocide. This request of course is
consistent with the December 2018 House Resolution that also
called attacks on the Rohingya genocide.
As reflected in the Refugees International statement on
genocide, the State of Burma is indeed responsible for killing
thousands of Rohingya among other abuses specified in the
Genocide Convention with the intent to destroy in whole or in
part this population. I ask that the Refugees International
statement on genocide be included in the hearing record.
A declaration would recognize the crime for what it is and
promote accountability. It would bring global attention that
could help prevent further atrocities. It could rally
international pressure. It would signal solidarity with both
the Rohingya and with Bangladesh and other countries that are
hosting Rohingya.
Finally, I would be remiss if I did not return to the
broader global response to COVID-19, especially as it
implicates the Rohingya. In a webinar in which the chairman
participated, the U.N.'s Emergency Relief Coordinator, Mark
Lowcock, recently said that COVID-19 could conceivably infect
over 600 million people in the world's most vulnerable
countries. Mark estimated that the cost to protecting the most
vulnerable 10 percent of the world's population from the worst
effects of COVID-19 was about $90 billion. He added that this
would represent less than 1 percent, less than 1 percent of the
amount devoted to COVID-19 stimulus packages by wealthy
countries of world. A $90 billion figure is reasonable; in
fact, it may be low. And we and others are urging a $20 billion
U.S. contribution reflected both in moral imperative and the
simple fact that this virus knows no borders.
Let me also emphasize the importance of broad access to
affordable treatments, access to a vaccine, and our concern
that governments are pursuing what the U.N. Secretary General
has expressed concern about: vaccine nationalism.
To conclude, I urge members to press the Administration to
continue U.S. leadership in this humanitarian response to
Bangladesh, to request administration progress reports on
funding and on critical implementation issues involving the
government of Bangladesh that are highlighted in my written
testimony. I urge that you press the Administration to issue a
finding of genocide.
And, finally, on the COVID-19 response globally, which
impacts the Rohingya so dramatically, I hope you will press for
supplemental assistance of $20 billion, as well as for
equitable access to treatment and to vaccines.
Thank you.
[The prepared statement of Mr. Schwartz follows:]
[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Mr. Bera. Thank you, Mr. Schwartz.
I will now call on Ms. Wai Wai Nu for her testimony.
STATEMENT OF WAI WAI NU, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, WOMEN'S PEACE
NETWORK
Ms. Nu. Thank you, Chairman Bera, Ranking Member Yoho, and
members of the subcommittee for the opportunity to update you
today. I want to thank the U.S. House of Representatives for
demonstrating a strong commitment to end mass atrocities in
Myanmar.
Distinguished members, I was just 10 years old when Myanmar
military regime put me and my family in prison in 2005. My
father was a political leader allied with Daw Aung San Suu Kyi
during the democracy movement. But unlike other politicians, my
father was targeted because he is Rohingya. My entire adult
life has been dedicated to fighting this persecution. I knew
from an early age that we were targeted because of our
ethnicity and religion. Imagine our excitement and hope when we
were able to join a country in the beginning of democratic
transition in 2012 after 7 years of imprisonment. But our hope
was quickly shattered when Myanmar military ravaged the Rakhine
State that same year, running villages to the ground, and
displacing tens of thousands of my people. Many of whom still
live in destitute camps today.
In August 2017, the military unleashed a campaign of
clearance operations, which resulted in mass destruction,
killing, and expulsions of over 850,000 people to flee across
the border to Bangladesh. The U.N. Fact-Finding Mission on
Myanmar and the Holocaust Memorial Museum determined this purge
to be a genocide.
The violence--sexual violence primarily against women and
girls and also men and boys was used as a weapon and left a
trail of trauma. And that will last generations. Now 3 years
on, over 1 million Rohingya people living in limbo in squalid
refugee camps in Bangladesh as you described, barely surviving
with a few donations items from NGO's. In countries like
Malaysia, Thailand, India, Rohingya are targeted for hate
speech, and many live in fear. And still remains too unsafe for
the Rohingya to return to Myanmar, where over 600,000 Rohingya
remaining in the country face systemic persecution and living
under the threat of genocide.
Dear distinguished members, all of this was preventable.
This was the failure to address root causes of persecution
against Rohingya. Similar tactics used against ethnic
minorities in Myanmar for decades continue today as military
inflict abuses on civilian in Rakhine, Shan, and Koran States
while the peace process has been stalled. So far, impunity has
reigned for much atrocities in Myanmar.
Despite of the dire situations of the Rohingya, I have been
deeply inspired by the sheer resilience and the unwavering
spirit of my people, your leadership and interest in Myanmar is
critical to success. Here are seven key demands from the
Rohingya community in Myanmar, Bangladesh, and the diaspora on
how you can support us. First, my people want to return to our
homeland with the restoration of full citizenship rights and
equal rights, and restitution of the damage to our land and
livelihood. We cannot be relocated to the internment camps or
segregated Muslim zones to be forced to identify ourselves as
Bengali via a national verification card.
Second, I want to thank the U.S. for imposing sanctions on
Myanmar military officials and ask that you also impose
financial sanctions on military owned businesses since the
income generated from these businesses enable the military to
continue its brutal acts.
Third, the U.S. Congress must pass the BURMA Act.
Fourth, the U.S. must support international criminal
accountability efforts as it is clear that Myanmar lacks both
the political will and independent judiciary to deliver
justice.
Fifth, the Rohingya people still being denied the right to
vote, despite of our long history of political participation
and leadership in Myanmar. The U.S. Congress must strongly urge
the Myanmar Government to hold free, fair, and fully inclusive
elections on November 2020. Without the participation of
Rohingyas, these elections cannot pass as a democratic act.
Sixth, the U.S. Government should call the crimes what they
are: genocide. Refusing to do so helps the Myanmar government
in its aim to deny our identity and existence as Rohingya
people.
Finally, it is imperative that every government and agency
consult the Rohingya people in all decisions impacting our
lives.
I appreciate you inviting me here today, and you must push
Myanmar government to work with the Rohingya people to address
root causes and bring about a long-term solution. I would like
to thank Chair Bera, Ranking Member Yoho, and members of the
subcommittee one more time for giving me this opportunity to
brief you all and I look forward to your questions.
Thank you.
[The prepared statement of Ms. Nu follows:]
[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Mr. Bera. Thank you, Ms. Nu, for your testimony.
I will now call on Ms. Allyson Neville for her testimony.
STATEMENT OF ALLYSON NEVILLE ASSOCIATE DIRECTOR FOR
INTERNATIONAL HUMANITARIAN RESPONSE POLICY AND ADVOCACY, SAVE
THE CHILDREN
Ms. Neville. Chairman Bera, Ranking Member Yoho, and
distinguished members of the subcommittee, thank you for the
opportunity to testify on the Rohingya crisis. Since our
founding more than 100 years ago, Save the Children's work has
changed the lives of more than 1 billion children in the United
States and around the world. Specific to the Rohingya crisis,
we support the needs of children and their families in the
refugee camps and host community in Bangladesh, as well as in
the camps for displaced communities in the central part of
Myanmar's Rakhine State.
I will be summarizing my written testimony, which speaks in
more detail of the humanitarian needs and challenges across
these contexts. First, I want to express appreciation for the
work of this subcommittee and all those in Congress and the
executive branch, who have remained committed to addressing the
needs and rights of the Rohingya. Even as this month marks the
solemn 3-year anniversary of the atrocities that occurred
against the Rohingya and other Muslim minorities in Rakhine
State, new challenges have emerged. These include the COVID-19
pandemic that has threatened lives in and around the camps in
Bangladesh, the ongoing conflict in Myanmar's Rakhine and Chin
States that continues to kill and displace civilians and
increasing stress factors that have led hundreds, including
higher percentages of children, to take dangerous journeys by
sea, seeking refuge.
I would like to take a few minutes to speak directly to the
conditions for the tens of thousands of children and
adolescents we serve in Bangladesh for temporary learning
centers and child-centered programing. There have been laudable
efforts to buildup the refugee camps and provide services.
However, when I was on the ground in December, one of most
notable things I heard was of the current situation, quote,
``could be the best things get.'' This already was an
unacceptable scenario, and with the spread of COVID-19, the
situation was predictably deteriorated.
Our job protection staff was already concerned about
increasing reports of child marriage, child labor, and
trafficking. Many children still live the with the effects of
their exposure to rights violations in Myanmar. Psychological
distress and negative coping mechanisms are increased by
factors like the inability to access livelihood opportunities,
limited access to education, and the lack of progress on the
ground in Myanmar to allow for voluntary and safe returns. It
is estimated that nearly 70 percent of Rohingya children in the
camps require access to mental health support.
Despite the educational services that we and others
provide, when you walk around the camps, you will see many
children out of school. This occurs due to a variety of
factors, including the need to accommodate multiple 2-hour
classroom shifts due to space constraints and the limited
availability of the approved learning curriculum. The loss of
education is most profound for girls. Their attendance drops
off significantly as they get older and increasing the risks of
child marriage and adolescent pregnancies. This was the reality
before the pandemic required a shutdown of 80 percent of the
services in the camps. Even as we work alongside other
humanitarian actors to support the needs of refugees, there is
a crucial opportunity for the United States and the broader
international community to ensure that the post COVID-19
environment does not return to the status quo or worse.
The immense generosity and ongoing engagement of the U.S.
Government has been important and necessary. We urge the
continuation of efforts to prioritize the immediate needs and
long-term interests of the Rohingya. One, the U.S. Government
should take additional action to hold the perpetrators of
violence against the Rohingya to account and encourage other
countries to do so. This should include additional targeted
sanctions on both individuals complicit in atrocities as well
as military-owned companies.
Two, U.S. Government should build on the diplomatic
engagement with the governments of Myanmar and Bangladesh and
other regional actors to support improved conditions on the
ground and to ensure safety and protection for the Rohingya at
sea. Three, U.S. Government should maintain its generosity in
supporting humanitarian assistance on both sides of border.
Related, Congress should fund and invest in the
international COVID-19 response by providing no less than $20
billion in the next legislative package to address the
pandemic.
Life in a refugee or displaced person's camp should never
be considered an acceptable long-term solution, especially for
children. There are approximately 75,000 Rohingya who have been
born as refugees since 2017 and an estimated 32,000 have been
born in displacement settings in Rakhine State since 2012. An
entire generation of Rohingya children risk growing up confined
in camps.
The Rohingya want to be able to return home safely, access
their rights and freedoms, and live in peace. With your help,
it is our hope that, by this time next year, much will have
been improved. For the children who deserve a healthy start to
life, access to education and freedom from violence and harm
every day matters.
Thank you, and I look forward to answering your questions.
[The prepared statement of Ms. Neville follows:]
[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Mr. Bera. Thank you, Ms. Neville.
And now I will recognize Ms. Olivia Enos for her testimony.
STATEMENT OF OLIVIA ENOS, SENIOR POLICY ANALYST, THE HERITAGE
FOUNDATION
Ms. Enos. Thank you, Chairman Bera, Ranking Member Yoho,
thank you for inviting me testify before the subcommittee.
Rajuma, a young Rohingya woman clutched her baby boy as she
fled the Burmese military's brutal treatment of her Muslim
community. It was then that her fragile world shattered. A
soldier clubbed her on her head while others tore her baby from
her arms and threw him into the fire. The violence did not stop
with her child's death. The soldiers then proceeded to gang
rape Rajuma. Before the day was through, she had seen her
mother and her three siblings killed. Rajuma is far from the
only Rohingya scarred by the Burmese military. Countless women
and girls faced sexual violence, including rape. At least
10,000 men, women, and children perished at the hands of
Burmese military during August 2017's clearing operation. And
now at least 1 million Rohingya remain displaced in the world's
largest refugee camp in Cox's Bazar, Bangladesh.
Salt is now being poured on the wounds of their suffering
as the Rohingya who endured these atrocities are now
experiencing COVID-19. While, thus far, the rate of COVID-19
infections is seemingly quite low--62 cases according to the
United Nations Refugee Agency and only a handful of deaths--
social distancing is a near impossibility, access to testing
limited, and provision of medical care is few and far between.
Some have called it a potential tinderbox for an outbreak.
The present is an opportune moment for Secretary Pompeo to
declare that the United Nations, the U.S. Holocaust Memorial
Museum, and PILPG, the group the State Department commissioned
to do an atrocity report on the Rohingya, and many, many others
have already said to be true. That Rohingya endured genocide
and crimes against humanity.
On August 25th, it will have been 3 years since the
atrocities took place. The Secretary should consider issuing an
atrocity determination to commemorate the anniversary and to
bring justice to Rohingya.
There are five reasons to put into the record for why the
U.S. Government should issue an atrocity determination. I will
cover three now. No. 1, a designation counters the narrative,
that the U.S. does not care about human rights. Atrocities
committed against Rohingya are among the most significant human
rights violations committed during the Trump Presidency. A
strong U.S. response would telegraph to other countries that
the U.S. continues to support freedom and human rights. Failure
to do so has the potential to embolden bad actors who will
believe that there are little to no negative consequences for
engaging in human rights violations while maintaining a
diplomatic relationship with the U.S.
No. 2, a designation demonstrates a U.S. commitment to
preventing atrocity. Atrocity determinations transcend
administrations and ensure that survivors receive the help they
need, like in the case of ISIS genocide determination during
the Obama Administration. While the Obama Administration took
limited follow-on action, the Trump Administration did. Its
Genocide Recovery and Persecution Response Program, which
allocated nearly $350 million toward assisting victims of ISIS
genocide, tangibly alleviated suffering.
Should the Trump Administration issue a determination of
its own on the Rohingya, it would demonstrate moral and
political leadership, and serve as an opportunity for the
Administration to highlight its burgeoning atrocity prevention
efforts.
Three, a designation is likely to increase burden sharing
among countries. Credit should be given where credit is due.
U.S. is the top single country donor to Rohingya, giving just
over $820 million since atrocities took place. Now donor
fatigue is setting in. This is compounded by the COVID-19 era,
where country's attentions are drawn inward as they battle
their own COVID-19 crises.
Current donations are not even scratching the surface of
the immense needs. United Nations 2020 Joint Response Plan
requested an estimated $877 million for Rohingya just for this
year, a year where the U.S. has so far only supplied an
additional $59 million. The needs are great, and they cannot be
met by a single, albeit highly generous, donor country.
An atrocity determination now may serve as a catalyst for
other countries to provide aid. I recommend that Congress and
the executive branch pursue the following: first, make an
official public legal determination on crimes committed against
Rohingya; second, evaluate relevant financial tools to craft an
overarching sanctions policy toward Burma, one that targets
Burmese military owned enterprises like MEC and MEHL; three,
press the Bangladeshi Government to lift restrictions on access
to information inside of the camps; four, grant priority 2
refugee status to Rohingya refugees; and, five, reevaluate the
need for aid both in the midst of the COVID-19 crisis, as well
as in the aftermath of the atrocities.
An atrocity determination can be issued at any point in
time. Secretary Pompeo has the authority and discretion to
issue such a determination at whim. But should he choose not
to, Congress also has the option to press the Administration to
do as it did in the case of ISIS genocide, which I am happy to
address more during Q&A. Perhaps this method could be
successful again. Issuing a genocide determination now would be
win for the Administration. The administration should do so now
before it is too late.
Thank you.
[The prepared statement of Ms. Enos follows:]
[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Chairman Engel. Thank you, Ms. Enos. I will now recognize
members for 5 minutes each. And pursuant to House rules, all
time yielded is for the purposes of questioning our witnesses.
Because of the virtual format of this hearing, I will recognize
members by committee seniority, alternating between Democrats
and Republicans. If you miss your turn, please let our staff
know, and we will circle back to you. If you seek recognition,
you must unmute your microphone and address the chair verbally.
I will now start by recognizing myself.
Ms. Nu, thank you for your advocacy on behalf the Rohingya
people and a truly democratic and inclusive Burma. I think it
is an understatement what started with much promise and
admiration for Aung San Suu Kyi has led to disappointment in
recent years. I know this subcommittee, as well as the House in
a bipartisan way, has expressed that disappointment. Can you
enlighten us as to what accounts for her failures? And is it
that she just simply does not care about the Rohingya or
considers them Burmese, and how we should approach this?
Ms. Nu. Thank you, Chairman Bera for your questions and the
opportunity to address you once again.
Yes, as you said, it is very disheartening to see how
responses in this crisis before she become the head of
government and now under her administration. We--the community
the Rohingya community and all other ethnic minorities in
Myanmar expected that she is the one who will bring equality
and justice for all other minorities. Instead, she turns away
and sides with the perpetrators, the military dictators and
stands with them in front of the International Court of
Justice. It is clear that her intention is not to protect the
country's minorities, but to protect the powers. With that,
even after the International Court of Justice provisional--the
orders--the provisional measures orders, there is nothing has
changed on the ground, the life of the people on the ground,
and the policies that by the government itself, the State
policies for the Rohingya population.
Now she has the power to change the policies, for example,
removing restrictions of the movement and allowing students to
go to the universities. Now, since 2012, our students are not
able to go to the university. In her administration with her
authority, she can change this, you know, minor changes. And
her government officials continue using--denying our identity
as Rohingya and using--referring us as Bengali. At the same
time, her government is implementing a discriminatory
citizenship process, which will eventually lead the Rohingya
people to become noncitizens and lose of all our rights,
including our birth right to the land and rights protections. I
think some of the specific acts and policies that have not been
addressed or continue imposing by her all administration can be
pushed by your committee and U.S. Government. So, in terms of
policy, change in policies, implementation, and practical
changes in the grounds are essential. And we want to see her
taking leadership to return to--like, to basically make
necessary arrangements for the return of the refugees and
restore the full citizenship rights and the equal rights of the
Rohingya in Myanmar.
Mr. Bera. Thank you, Ms. Nu. In the short time I have
remaining, I am obviously putting my doctor hat on and public
health hat on. We are very worried that, in Cox's Bazar, if
COVID-19 were to start spreading, that this would be well a
humanitarian disaster.
I am also very worried about the secondary and tertiary
impact this in terms of food and security, starvation and the
like. Maybe Mr. Schwartz or some other members, if you could
just give us a sense of how challenging things are right now
and some policies. I agree if we can get the $20 billion in the
next supplemental, that would be a good first step. And I think
that is incredibly important to help support folks. If any of
the witnesses want to give us life on the ground in Cox's
Bazar.
Mr. Schwartz. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman. I will be very
brief and say that today, since we have not seen the very worst
of COVID-19 infections, that, to a great extent, the principal
challenges that we are confronting, that humanitarians are
confronting are the indirect impacts of this pandemic. In
Bangladesh, it has to do with a decrease in the number of
humanitarians who are in the camps, restrictions on
communication, difficulties with supply. And worldwide, that
problem is arising in many different places. The media reported
some weeks ago on the Sahel. The focus of that report was not
the direct impact of COVID-19, but rather significant food
insecurity challenges based on restrictions and access, which
just underscores the importance not only of a very generous
COVID-19 supplemental globally but also the need to continue to
focus on not only the COVID-19 response but the indirect
impacts of COVID-19.
Mr. Bera. Thank you, Mr. Schwartz.
And I realize my time is out. So let me recognize the
ranking member, Mr. Yoho, for 5 minutes.
Mr. Yoho. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And I appreciate all the
witnesses' testimony.
What is the key--and I think I am going to ask this of Eric
Schwartz. Mr. Schwartz, what is the key economic driver of the
economy in Myanmar?
Mr. Schwartz. Well, I am not an economist, but I will say
that I think, at this point, the most effective tool for, you
know, pressure against the government of Burma would be to
target military and military-owned enterprises.
Mr. Yoho. All right. Well, let me ask you this: What is
their biggest product or export product? And who is their
largest trading partner? Is it China? And what is that product
that brings in the most money for their economy or anybody on
the panel?
Mr. Schwartz. Right. Please, I would believe that China
would almost certainly be their major trading partner, but in
terms of the products, I think I would defer to others.
Mr. Yoho. Allyson, Ms. Neville, do you know?
Ms. Neville. I am sorry. That is unfortunately not really
something we can speak to given our humanitarian------
Mr. Yoho. Well, let me just go with this because we see
this over and over again. We see it in China in the Xinjiang
Province. We see it elsewhere in the world. And we say ``never
again,'' but yet it happens over and over again. And without
having a direct did conflict, the best thing I think we can do
as a Nation is economic pressure. I would assume that China is
their largest trading partner. But what other nations are
coming to the table outside of the U.S.? What other developed
nations? Are we seeing the E.U.? Are we seeing Japan? Are we
seeing any other country? And then, particularly, since the
majority of the Rohingya are Muslims and they practice their
Muslim faith or they try to, what Muslim countries are coming
to the table to be actively engaged, or is this the U.S. alone?
Because if we can get these other countries engaged, we can put
that economic pressure on there and squeeze them there, in
addition to the sanction that we are doing? Does anybody want
to community on that.
Mr. Schwartz. Sure. I would be happy to. I think key
interlocutors, economic interlocutors for Burma include not
only China but India, Japan, Indonesia, the E.U. And the
challenge is to marshal an international effort and there
really has been an absence of leadership in that effort to
marshal, you know, a truly international effort. The Muslim
world has--governments with Muslim majority populations have
been regularly supportive of declarations against what the
Burmese military have done, but that has not really translated
into genuine political and economic pressure.
Mr. Yoho. Okay. Let me bring this up then: We know in
January 2020 the U.N. reported genocide going on and called
their commander in chief and five generals to face charges of
crimes, but yet the U.N. Security Council has yet to issue such
a designation. This is just something I am going to say is that
we as a Nation need to invoke these other nations. And we need
to have this at the U.N. to where they bring this up and then,
from that, move that coalition to put that economic pressure on
anybody that is trading with them. And, again, what we see is
China is the bad actor. China could come to the table and help
us resolve so many issues around the world, yet they are on the
opposite end, fuming and working against us. Until we get
agreement in countries working in the same direction, this will
not end.
And, Allyson Neville, you were saying living in a refugee
camp should never be normal, that should never be normal. But
yet we have refugee camps that have been going on for 20-plus,
30 years because we cannot get together as a world community
and bring this stuff to an end.
I do not really have any other comments. But I do know that
if we do not work with some of these organizations, like Gavi
and the NGO's, and get treatments and vaccinations for other
diseases, the comorbidity are going to open up this population
for the pandemic, and we have got some challenges on our hands.
And I hope America comes to the table and pleads and brings
other partners.
Mr. Chairman, thank you for putting this meeting on. And I
thank our witnesses. And I yield back.
Mr. Bera. Thank you to the ranking member. Let me now
recognize the gentleman from California, Mr. Sherman, for 5
minutes.
Mr. Sherman. I think there should be a general recognition
that we need to appropriate money in the next COVID bill to
focus worldwide on the problem this is causing. And believe it
or not, I will commend the Republican Senate bill that has $4
billion in it to deal with the foreign policy aspects of COVID.
I know we Democrats in the House have provided for money, but
we have that not in the COVID bill but in the appropriations
bills that will not become effective until October 1st at the
earliest, and we clearly need to respond internationally
sooner.
I met with on Aung San Suu Kyi more than once. She had
become such a hero to all of us who were concerned about human
rights. And to have her play this role, presiding over and
apologizing for this genocidal regime, is just disheartening to
everyone who has put their time and effort into human rights.
Last year, I had a chance to preside over this
subcommittee. We had three hearings dealing with the Rohingya
in part. We had our hearing on Southeast Asian human rights,
where we focused on Burma, Myanmar; South Asia where we focused
on the effect on Bangladesh; and, finally, the budget hearings.
I want to commend Chairman Bera, though, for having a hearing
entirely focused on the Rohingya. It is clearly deserving of a
hearing by itself.
The Rohingya need to go home. They need to go home safely.
They need to go home with full citizenship rights. Several
years ago and as recently as last year, I pointed out that
perhaps the international border would need to be changed. If
the government of Burma, Myanmar, will not protect the people
of north Rakhine State, then maybe that State should be part of
another nation or independent. Now, I do not think a change of
international borders is anything close to an optimal solution,
but I will point out to those in the Burmese Government that
America has favored and facilitated only once this century a
change in international borders, and that was the creation of
South Sudan. And we did it because of our abiding efforts to
prevent genocide. And there was genocide there in South Sudan,
and there has clearly been a genocide attempted to be
perpetrated against the Rohingya people.
We could be looking at a temporary safe zone inside the
Rakhine State with international U.N. peacekeeping troops, but
that would just be a first and inadequate step because we need
the people of Rakhine State to be full citizens of Burma. A
number of people have pointed out the importance of BURMA Act.
We passed it through the committee. We need to pass it on the
floor. And I see on my screen Ms. Wagner, who joined with me
when I introduced the Safe Return of Rohingyas to Burma Act.
And this would go further in revoking Burma's GSP preferences.
I know Mr. Yoho focused on the economic. We may not easily
control what China does economically, but we certainly have
control over what we do. And we have given Burma extraordinary
GSP preferences that we do not provide to a host of other
countries, and, clearly, that should not go on. And that would
have an immediate economic effect on Burma. We would not have
to wait for a determination. It would not be just aimed at one
or two individuals, but would affect the regime.
There is a--Mr. Yoho and others have brought up China.
China has signed 33 major economic agreements with this regime.
It oppresses its own Uighur Muslims. It has offered cash to
Rohingya to return to their homes, but without any guarantees
of safety, they are not going to do it. And now China has its
eyes on the Rakhine State as a place for a port that would
support the Chinese economy.
I would hope that, for the record, our witnesses would tell
us what we can do to illustrate to the entire Muslim world what
China is doing not only to the Uighurs but in support of the
Burmese regime. I will point out that, in contrast, the United
States gets criticized as somehow being anti-Muslim. Not only
do we stand up for the Rohingya and the Uighurs, but we took
military action against Serbia to support the Kosovars and
Bosnian Muslims.
How much additional assistance do we need to provide to
support the Rohingya in addition to the I am told it is as high
as $660 billion we have provided so far? Do we have a witness,
perhaps Mr. Schwartz.
Mr. Schwartz. Yes, let me address three points that you
have alluded to.
Mr. Sherman. I have limited time. So perhaps you can
address the A question.
Mr. Schwartz. Well, yes. I would say that the United States
has been a very generous contributor to the humanitarian
response in Bangladesh. But the global appeal, at last report,
was funded at far less than 50 percent. So much more can and
should be done.
But I do need to comment on your reference to a safe zone.
As someone who wrote an op-ed in The Washington Post urging
that any return be accompanied by a U.N. monitoring team, so I
think the phrase ``safe zone'' makes me nervous, because safe
zones is a general matter, you know, whether it is been in
Bosnia or other parts of the world, are not safe. And so I
think we have to be certain that conditions are right for safe
and voluntary return with monitoring, but I get very nervous
when I hear the phrase ``safe zone.''
Mr. Sherman. Maybe a different term is called for, but
international monitoring I think would be helpful.
I will also ask our witnesses to comment on the record
about the International Criminal Court, which held that Myanmar
must take steps to prevent further genocidal acts. I want to
commend The Gambia for bringing the case and focusing on human
rights so far from The Gambia.
And I want to pick up where Ms. Wai Wai Nu's comment about
the elections. I will point out that some 850,000 Afghan
refugees in 2004 were able to participate in the Afghan
elections. You have called for Rohingya to be able to
participate in the Myanmar elections. I know Myanmar
authorities have detailed records and household lists. And it
seems that, as a practical matter, the Rohingya could
participate should the world--if the Myanmar Government refuses
to allow them to participate, should the world regard this as a
legitimate election?
Mr. Bera. Knowing that we have gone over time, if the
witnesses perhaps could answer some of those questions and
submit them for the record, that would be great. Thank you.
With that------
Mr. Sherman. I would ask that the witness be given just one
or two sentences.
Mr. Bera. Okay. I will grant that to Mr. Sherman, if the
witness want to.
Mr. Sherman. Just the one, Ms. Wai Wai Nu.
Mr. Bera. Ms. Nu.
Ms. Nu. Thank you. Thank you, Congressman Sherman. I think
you are very, really right. Our populations want to be able to
have our rights, political rights to vote and to participate in
the elections. And there are precedents in the past that could
have happen. As you rightly said, Burmese Government has our
family registration, a list and cut as well as the voting list
from the 2010 elections. So it is not difficult if there is a
will and a plan to arrange this to happen, and it does not take
much long.
And second------
Mr. Sherman. Thank you.
Mr. Bera. Let me recognize the gentlewoman from Missouri,
Mrs. Wagner, for 5 minutes.
Mrs. Wagner. Thank you, Mr. Chairman for hosting this
hearing on an issue that is extremely bipartisan. And I thank
our witnesses for their time and for their expertise today.
My heart breaks for the Rohingya who have suffered
unimaginable atrocities at the hands of the genocidal Burmese
regime and now face an incipient coronavirus outbreak in Cox's
Bazar, Bangladesh. Along with Congressman Levin, who I know is
joining us today, I co-led an amendment to the State and
Foreign Operations Appropriations Act that ensures--ensures--
that U.S. funds will not be used to support the forced
relocation of Rohingya refugees to Bhasan Char, an
uninhabitable strip of silt off the coast of Bangladesh. So
Bangladesh has already begun to detain refugees on Bhasan Char
and has refused to allow U.N. officials access to the island.
Mr. Schwartz, how can we ensure Rohingya on Bhasan Char are
receiving the humanitarian aid that they need?
Mr. Schwartz. Well, I think we have to, Members of
Congress, and the Administration has to continue to press the
authorities in Bangladesh, No. 1, not to be moving refugees to
Bhasan Char until there is an independent assessment of safety
and voluntariness. And I would urge that Members of Congress
and the Administration press the government of Bangladesh on
the issue of access now. And I think the 300 or so who are on
the island, if they do not--if access is not permitted, then we
need to press to those people to be returned to camps. It is--
the issue is clear and straightforward. If the government of
Bangladesh believes, as it says, that is a habitable island,
the conditions are good for the refugees, then there should be
no problem with an assessment, an independent assessment of the
safety of the island prior to moving people to it. It is really
that simple.
Mrs. Wagner. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Schwartz.
In November 2019, as Congressman Sherman has referenced,
Gambia filed a genocide case against Burma at the International
Court of Justice, or ICJ, beginning a very long overdue effort
to designate the atrocities committed against Rohingya as
genocide and punish the perpetrators for their crimes. While
consideration of the case continues, the ICJ has ordered Burma
to take actions to prevent further acts of genocide.
Ms. Enos, how well is Burma complying with the ICJ's order
to actively prevent additional acts of genocide? And how can
the international community pressure Burma into compliance?
Ms. Enos. Thank you for that question. You know, I think
that, to the best of my knowledge, they are not taking steps to
comply, and, critically, I think what we need to be watching
for is the fact that the Burmese military has been engaging in
activities that seem very similar, in fact, to what happened in
August 2017. They have even used the language of ``clearing
operations'' in some contexts.
We know that there have been civilians that have been
targeted and tortured in Rakhine State, and so we know that the
Burmese military is continuing to be emboldened to act in these
ways. So any sort of effort by the civilian government or
otherwise to say that they are confined are simply not true for
many Rohingya, as well as other religious minorities inside of
Burma. And I think this is why we need the U.S. Government to
call a spade a spade and finally say that this is genocide,
this is crimes against humanity, echo what the United Nations
has said, echo what the ICJ has found, echo what even the U.S.
Holocaust Memorial Museum, I think the U.S. Commission on
International Religious Freedom, so many bodies, including
civil society, have been saying that this is genocide and
crimes against humanity, but thus far, the U.S. refuses to say
that it is what it is, and------
Mrs. Wagner. And the fear------
Ms. Enos [continuing]. The genocide, it is crimes against
humanity.
Mrs. Wagner. The fear and uncertainty also caused by the
pandemic are exacerbating tensions between Rohingya refugees
and local communities in Bangladesh. Ms. Nu, briefly, how can
aid groups and partner countries protect Rohingya refugees from
being scapegoated for the coronavirus outbreak? Ms. Nu?
Ms. Nu. Thank you. Thank you for your questions. Yes, I
think aid groups and the partner countries, the first thing
that we need is that the consultations and talking to the
people on their needs and their--assessing their situation
morally, not just ticking box on what they need and what their
situations are.
What we have been seeing throughout the last, you know, 7
years is that many donor organizations, countries, and the
partner--implement organizations are not necessarily discussing
with the community, with the refugees, on their needs and on
their situations.
For example, the women that I have talked to, women that I
have been working on, has--from the rape in Burma, she has
endured physically terribly now. She cannot work because of her
backbone has broken. So, for her, and during the COVID-19, she
cannot even go out. And during the lockdowns, there is no--for
her, it is impossible that she can get any assistance during
this kind of--during this lockdown and COVID-19.
So that is why I think the most important thing is to
consult and to listen to the community as much as possible.
That is the first thing.
Second, about, you know, your questions around the ICJ's
and international criminal accountability, one of the--a few
things that U.S.--your committee can concretely do is that--the
first one, action Facebook and Twitter to provide their
evidences to the Gambia, to the ICJ. That is the most important
thing.
And, second, you know, calling--supporting Gambia processes
and International Court of Justice and International Criminal
Court processes at the U.N. General Assembly and at the
Security Council.
Mrs. Wagner. Thank you. I am way over time, Mr. Chairman,
my supreme apologies and--but thank you to all our witnesses.
They have so much to offer, and these virtual things are a
little clunky to do.
So I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Bera. Thank you, Mrs. Wagner.
Let me now recognize the gentle lady from Nevada, Ms.
Titus.
Ms. Titus. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The testimony has been
quite interesting.
I was reading recently, from the last issue of Foreign
Affairs, an article called ``The Myanmar Mirage: Why the West
Got Burma Wrong.'' It is primarily a review of a book called
``The Hidden History of Burma,'' and it makes the argument that
a lot of the vacillating international perceptions of Myanmar,
from pariah State to positive, possible democratic success
story, now back to pariah State again, have more to do with our
hopes than with Burmese realities.
It goes on to quote a journalist, Peter Popham, who has
argued that Aung San Suu Kyi's mystique has really originated
from her absence, and she has been a blank screen on which we
have painted what we hoped would be her characteristics, her
demeanor, her approach to politics, not necessarily what her
background is.
So I am wondering if you all would address maybe the
question of how we got it wrong and how we might reassess what
our policy is going forward based on this notion of Myanmar's
history, its culture, its structural problems, its racial
tensions, that maybe we need to reassess our own policy.
Anybody.
Ms. Enos. Sure. I will take that first if you do not mind.
I think that one of the challenges with U.S. policy toward
Burma has been its inconsistency, as you pointed out, and one
of the things that happened toward the tail end of the Obama
Administration is what I would argue was a premature lifting of
sanctions on the Burmese military at a very critical moment.
We saw this potential opening toward democracy that Burma
was taking, and I think we did get our hopes up, and so we
lifted those sanctions. I think slowly but surely, we have
started to see the reimplementation of many of those sanctions,
including the notable sanctions against Senior General Min Aung
Hlaing and others, as well as against the 33d and 99th Light
Infantry Divisions, all of which happened under the Trump
Administration.
And these are welcome changes, but they do not demonstrate
a reset of U.S. policy toward Burma, which is something I have
advocated for in several of my papers at Heritage. And I think
one way to reset and retask U.S. policy toward Burma would be
to go ahead and issue an atrocity determination, whether that
is genocide or crimes against humanity, and then to bring the
sanctions policy in line with that in such a way that it
actually targets the military-owned enterprises that are truly
enabling the Burmese military to step on any possibilities for
democratic reform that we might see under a civilian
government.
Ms. Titus. Thank you. Somebody else might respond to, how
do we do this without pushing Burma further and further into
the arms of China? Right now, that relationship is fairly
tenuous, but they are only too willing to be an economic
supporter and a friendly ally.
Mr. Schwartz. Let me comment on that, and I share the view
that I think there was what I might call a little bit of
irrational exuberance about where this political situation was
going and excitement about Aung San Suu Kyi. I think there is
much to what you have said about, you know, we sort of create
our own images and perceptions about people treating them as
foreign leaders, treating them as blank slates, but I do not
think that altered.
And, second, I would say the situation is very complex.
Your comment about China demonstrates that, and so--but it does
not change the fact that we should be promoting basic decency
and basic respect for human rights on the part of the
authorities in Burma. And what that means is a concentrated,
coherent strategy that recognizes complexity.
You are not going to get the government of China to support
a genocide declaration or support a Security Council
condemnation, but sticks, strong measures by likeminded
governments have got to be part of an overall strategy,
including a genocide determination, while, at the same time,
U.S. diplomats should be engaging Chinese leaders, Indian
leaders, who are more reluctant to take strong measures, and
see what we can achieve with respect to movement on these
issues.
Two minutes in a hearing is not a forum in which to
describe what a strategy is. What a strategy requires, American
leadership, which is not there right now, in terms of a
coherent, concerted, diplomatic effort that recognizes that, in
some cases, you have got to be really--you have got to really
implement and utilize sticks, and, in other cases, with
governments that are far more reluctant to take strong
measures, you have got to engage diplomacy. And I think both
are critical to an effective strategy, if the goal is to
improve the well-being and the lives of the Rohingya people in
particular and ethnic minorities throughout Burma.
Ms. Titus. Thank you.
Ms. Nu. If I may--can I------
Mr. Bera. Go ahead briefly, Ms. Nu.
Ms. Nu. Thank you. I echo both Olivia and Mr. Eric. I would
like to just want to say that we should go back to the U.S.
policy and strategy before, you know, so-called democratic
transition. We need to go back to the strategy during the
military dictatorship. Since we can say this is the failed
democracy, the civilian government is not upholding any
democratic principle and not protecting the minorities and, you
know, letting the genocide happen--continuing the genocide at
its own country. So that is my main, like, suggestions for us.
And, also, the situations in Rakhine State, the suffering
of Rohingya is not now just the issue of Myanmar. It has become
international issue. Our people have been suffering in
Bangladesh, Malaysia, India, and elsewhere. So it cannot be
addressed unilaterally, and it has to come up with a very
constructive strategy, and going back to your leadership, you
know, as multinational, like, responses, I think that is the
critical thing.
And also talking about the sanctions and economic economy,
and I think it is important that not only sanction individuals
but also targeting the institutions itself, and, you know, I
would like to request the committee to submit my written
submissions on our partners on the businesses and military's
businesses and misconducts in Myanmar. Thank you.
[The information referred to follows:]
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Ms. Titus. Unfortunately, we have an administration right
now that does not believe in much cooperation with other
international partners.
Just briefly, I was in Myanmar, with part of the House
Democracy Partnership, and that group works with new
democracies, and we were optimistic. And we work with USAID and
NGO's in the countries who make such a difference with that
soft power or diplomacy. And at some point in the future, I
would like to hear you all tell me more about your access
currently under this administration and also under the
conditions of the COVID virus.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. Bera. Thanks, Ms. Titus. Now, let me go ahead and
recognize the gentle lady from Pennsylvania, Ms. Houlahan.
Ms. Houlahan. Thank you, Chairman, and thank you to the
panelists for coming.
I wanted to followup on a couple of things that my
colleagues have said.
First off, Mr. Sherman ought to re-emphasize, and I believe
Mr. Bera as well, the importance of federally funding our
foreign affairs in this COVID package that we are working on. I
think it is essential. I think we are seeing on the Senate side
at least an appetite for that, and I would like to see on the
House side an appetite as well to include it in our next
package. So I just want to associate myself with those remarks.
I also wanted to followup on something that Mrs. Wagner
talked about, which has to do with what we are seeing that
looks a lot like 2017 played over again, and would like to
understand from possibly Ms. Enos or Ms. Nu, what you are
seeing now, what you saw in 2017, what can Congress do in terms
of lessons learned from 2017 until now.
You touched a little bit on some of those, ticked them off,
but is there anything further that you can add to that, and can
we ask you all for the record to submit some ideas of what
lessons we can learn from the 2017--from 2017 for now? So maybe
Ms. Enos?
Ms. Enos. Okay, great. Thank you for your question. Yes, I
do think that we are starting to see an uptick in violence, and
honestly there has been consistent targeting from the Burmese
military of various minority communities, including in Shan and
Kachin State, but
[inaudible] In Rakhine State. And happy to submit, you
know, additional materials that go into great detail about
that.
But beyond lessons from, you know, 2017, I think that there
are also lessons from the election previously because we are
going to have an election in Burma here in, you know, November
potentially, and, again, we are seeing Rohingya being excluded
as being able to vote. And we cannot consider it a free and
fair election when Rohingya and other minority groups are not
permitted to vote.
And so I think that this election actually presents an
opportunity for U.S. advocacy and U.S. diplomacy to really up
the ante and put pressure on Burma on both the civilian and the
military governments to respect the fundamental rights of all
of its citizens, minority or not, to be able to participate in
the democratic process. So I think that is maybe something also
to keep in mind.
Ms. Houlahan. That would be terrific too. That would be
terrific too.
Ms. Nu, do you have anything that we can maybe put into the
congressional Record in this area?
Ms. Nu. Yes. Thank you very much. I would like to add some
more points. And one of the main thing that--the lesson learned
during the 2017 is that I think the impunity of the
perpetrators. So the violence against the Rohingya happened
in--started in 2012, and it goes on in 2013, 2014, 2015, and
2016. While the attack happened, the U.S. Government lifted the
sanctions from Myanmar, and that is the worst thing that could
happen, and that let them larger, you know, five time larger
atrocities in 2017, and I think that is the lesson learned for
me.
We have been advocating and telling the U.S. Government and
many others, policymakers, around the world, that we need to
end impunity of the perpetrators, and there were little actions
or little interest from the U.S. Government, and that is the
one--the main thing that led to the 2017 now. We cannot wait
any longer because the more we wait, the longer injustice will
be and the--the suffering of the communities will prolong, not
just the Rohingya but also the Rakhine and other ethnic
communities.
From--only from January to May, there are about--one of our
partners, from one of our partner's recall, 410 attacks against
the civilians happened, more than 300 civilians have been
killed, and the continuous abuses and violations by the
security forces, such as extrajudicial killing, arbitrary
arrests, has been ongoing. And Rohingya are stuck in the middle
of--caught up in the middle of the war zone without protections
from any parties in Rakhine State. So we need to end impunity.
Ms. Houlahan. Thank you.
That was very helpful. And with whatever is left of my
time, I am really dubious about the report of only 62 cases of
COVID. Here in my community, we had a nursing home that had 62
deaths of COVID, and so it is really hard to imagine that that
is true. Can anybody give me any insight into whether or not
this is just an issue of testing, or really is there some sort
of something else going on there? And, also, are you seeing an
increase or spike in cases of other kinds of diseases, and,
finally, is the WHO still even at all able to be helpful, and
what can you comment if anything about us withdrawing from the
WHO during all of this situation?
Ms. Enos. I will just briefly address the issue of 62
cases. I think that this is, in part, an issue of testing and
access to testing. It is also a lack of access to medical care.
As I understand it, there have been limits placed on the number
of humanitarian agencies that can work during the COVID-19 era,
in part, to help stop the spread, but also that means that a
lack of access to medical care, in general, is fading.
And I think we are seeing this especially affecting women
and girls, especially those who are pregnant. There have been
reports of women not being able to get access to maternal
healthcare for labor, birth, and delivery that are
extraordinarily concerning. Some of this has to do with some of
the more male-dominated structures within the camps that are
limiting and restricting their access.
But some of it also has to do with misinformation that is
running rampant in the camps that women are, in fact, the cause
of COVID-19 in these camps. And I think that the spread of
misinformation is easily preventable simply by the Bangladeshi
Government lifting those restrictions on access to internet and
telecommunications that they put in place. This is a very
preventable problem and something that I think strong diplomacy
coming from U.S. State Department and otherwise would be able
to help to address. So I think that, you know, in part answers
your question.
Ms. Houlahan. Thank you. I think my time is well past
expired. I do not see a clock, but I apologize, and I yield
back.
Mr. Bera. No worries. Thank you, Ms. Houlahan.
Let me recognize the gentleman from Michigan, Mr. Levin,
for 5 minutes.
Mr. Levin. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman, and I want to
thank you and the ranking member for holding this important
hearing.
I had the privilege of traveling to Bangladesh last year
and to spend 2 full days in and around the Rohingya refugee
camps and the host communities and rural areas around Cox's
Bazar.
And while I by no means at all want to downplay the horror
of the situation, I want to take a moment to recognize the
common humanity we share with the Rohingya people. When we sat
down and talked with mothers, they said they wish they could
offer us a meal as their guests. When we asked parents what
brought them joy, they said seeing their children happy.
Our lives are very different, but at the end of the day, we
are talking about families like yours and mine who want to have
a warm and happy home where their kids are safe and can thrive.
And it breaks my heart that, for those families I met, that
home and that peace are still very far, far out of reach.
So I want to talk first about what it would mean for
Rohingya refugees to return to Burma. I spoke with one man who
had fled Burma three times in his life. This was his third time
as a refugee, but he still considered it home and wanted to go
back and spoke about the smell of his farm animals and the
water and so on.
And, in fact, most of the people we spoke with hope to go
back to Burma. So let's talk about this. Mr. Schwartz, there
have been actually been multiple spikes in violence against
Rohingya in Burma over decades, going back to the 1970's, and
so multiple cases of Rohingya people fleeing to Bangladesh. In
those past cases, what allowed for Rohingya people to return to
Burma?
Mr. Schwartz. Well, not--I mean, what--the situation for
Rohingya in Rakhine State, in recent memory, has never been
acceptable. They have been subjected to denial of their right
to political participation and other abuses, but the truth of
the matter is, what we saw in 2017 was unprecedented, in terms
of the concentrated nature of the mass expulsion, the numbers
of people who moved in such an extraordinarily short period of
time, hundreds of thousands.
When I was there in mid-September, which was just about a
month into the crisis, I think the numbers were several hundred
thousand already. The fact that an estimated 6-to 7,000 people
were killed in the context of that expulsion. I mean, the
virulence of the government's actions and the military's
actions in that case was of a different order of magnitude
and------
Mr. Levin. No question, no question, but what I am trying
to ask is, is there a history of truly voluntary repatriations
and folks being able to go back in peace and actually reclaim,
you know, their possessions, their land, and so forth?
Mr. Schwartz. There has been movement back and forth, some
movement back and forth in the context of prior, you know
violations of the rights of the Rohingya, but I think you are
testing the limits of my historical knowledge. I think------
Mr. Levin. Okay. Well, so I guess what I want to say is
that, I am very concerned that any repatriations would have to
be, you know, truly voluntary, and I think they are going to
require a kind of multilateral foreign policy that the ranking
member expressed eloquently but that I have to say to my
brother, this administration has no interest in carrying out
and working with our allies as a team, you know, to deal with
this, with a situation like the--you know, the Rohingya, this
horrible genocide that we have watched and that they have had
to deal with.
Let me just ask quickly more about Bhasan Char, which I did
work on a bill with Congresswoman Wagner that she mentioned. I
am very worried about more people being forced onto this
island. It is dangerous. I do not see it being a truly safe
place. You spoke to this, that they should allow independent,
you know, evaluations, but what more can the U.S. do to stop
forced relocations to Bhasan Char? What specific steps do you,
Mr. Schwartz, or others, think we could take--again, if it has
multilateral, fine--but to prevent this from happening?
Mr. Schwartz. This is a perfect example of what I would
call the ``carrot and the stick'' approach. I mean, I think, on
the one hand, our diplomats, you know, need to be talking very
sharply to the government of Bangladesh, about the critical
importance of an independent assessment before people are moved
to the island.
At the same time, we are thanking the government of
Bangladesh for providing refuge to the Rohingya and, at the
same time, that we are rallying support for additional
financial assistance for the humanitarian effort in the camps.
And, in addition, I think part of that is movement on a
genocide determination because it signals to the government of
Bangladesh that we recognize that the problem is in Burma and
that we are--it is an expression of solidarity with a country
that has expressed deep concerns about the burdens, the
responsibilities, that they have taken on with respect to the
Rohingya.
So I would say it has got to be--as I said before, you
know, it is a complex issue, and I think we have to talk tough
Bangladesh, on what they should and should not be doing with
respect to Bhasan Char, while at the same time, I think we need
to be continuing to support their efforts to play host, you
know, to this beleaguered population.
Mr. Levin. Thank you.
And, Mr. Chairman, I think my time is well expired. So,
again, I appreciate your leadership on this issue and that of
the ranking member, and I yield back.
Mr. Bera. Thank you, Mr. Levin.
Let me now recognize the gentleman from Tennessee, Dr.
Green, and welcome to the subcommittee hearing.
Mr. Green. Thanks, Chairman.
I really appreciate it. I am honored to be here, and thanks
too to the ranking member.
I also should probably thank Chairman McCaul and Chairman
Engel for just honoring me and letting me be on the House
Foreign Affairs Committee.
International relations have been a passion of mine since I
took the oath to defend the country in 1982 on the plane at
West Point, a long time ago, and been enhanced, of course, from
my trips all over the world and my two deployments to Iraq and
Afghanistan.
I believe that foreign policy and foreign affairs right now
are probably the most challenging ever in the United States'
history, far more complex than ever before, multiple domains,
interactions where we connect and interact with our friends and
foes and allies. And layer over that climate and COVID and all
these other things, it just makes it harder.
And Myanmar is an excellent example of that, where we face
an Asian nation undergoing this humanitarian, human rights
crisis. But as in the past, when Americans fight for other
nations and people's human rights, we bring security to our own
world and, thus, ourselves.
When we have to stand with these people who are--this is an
atrocity, as it has been called already in the committee
meeting, genocide, in some ways. However, we also have to
consider--and I think it was Representative Titus who mentioned
this--China continues to grow its malign influence throughout
the world. Relationships in that region are clearly have to be
considered and how it empowers their actions.
As a new member today, I just have one question, and I will
not take nearly all of my time. And let me also say, I did have
to step out. So I may be asking a question that has already
been asked. If that is the case, then just move on, and I will
get it from the transcript.
But, Ms. Enos, I believe there was an international court
ruling earlier this year, and I wondered if that court ruling
has made any difference, and if so, you know, in what way, and
what else can the courts do here to help us?
Ms. Enos. Thank you for that question. We did briefly touch
on it, but I am happy to address it in more depth. So I think
the case that the Gambia brought at the International Court of
Justice against Burma was a significant one, and not only did
it raise the profile of issue of genocide and the atrocities
that Rohingya face, but I think it also made it so that there
was a greater desire for international pressure, and it put
Aung San Suu Kyi, in fact, on the spot, where she was actually
defending the Burmese military and the atrocities that they
committed.
And so I think it revealed that there is a much deeper need
for reform inside of Burma, for political reform in general,
that recognizes the fundamental rights of all individuals,
minorities, or otherwise, inside of Burma. And so I think this
is a very important case indeed, but I think that there is even
a further need for the U.S. Government to just go ahead and
issue that atrocity determination because I think that we have
seen other international bodies, in fact, pursuing forms of
accountability.
But the U.S. decision not to call it genocide, not to call
it crimes against humanity, I think, has really hampered
international aid efforts, and I think if you were to have such
a determination, you have the potential to really galvanize
much needed aid and assistance during a time when needs are
ever increasing with COVID-19.
And I would just add, very briefly, that any sort of
atrocity determination that is issued does not require any sort
of new case before the ICJ or the ICC. It actually does not
have any sort of legal requirements to pursue international
justice, but I do think that the Administration would be wise
to pursue alternative legal and judicial mechanisms for holding
the Burmese military accountable in addition to targeting and
levying the much needed sanctions, you know, and continuing
that sanctions pressure against the Burmese military,
especially against Burmese, military-owned enterprises.
Mr. Green. Thank you. Did I produce your name correctly, by
the way?
Ms. Enos. That is right. Olivia Enos, yes.
Mr. Green. Okay. I am sorry if I got it wrong.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I yield.
Mr. Bera. Thank you, Dr. Green.
And thank you to the Members for their questions and to the
witnesses for their responses.
With member questions now concluded, I am going to
recognize myself for some closing comments and then also
recognize the ranking member for closing comments, and then
give our witnesses an opportunity, maybe 30 seconds or a minute
if there are any closing remarks that they would like to make.
Again, you know, what we discussed today really highlights
the urgency and the importance of Congress, along with the
Administration, taking actions. And just as a number of members
highlighted, we had hopes of the burgeoning democracy, we had
hopes with Aung San Suu Kyi that Burma might move in the right
direction. But as we realized, you know, what the actions taken
in 2017 and the continued actions of the military government
and the lack of response from Aung San Suu Kyi, we have to now
step up and reset the clock and, you know, go back to, you
know, some of the sanctions and efforts that were placed.
And as multiple members, as well as the witnesses also
suggested, that this is something that would be much stronger
if we do it in a multilateral way, using the institutions and
organizations that are available to us, including the United
Nations. You know, the urgency is now because each day we wait,
you know, is continued suffering. Each day we wait allows the
government to continue to get away with these atrocities and,
you know, perpetrate additional atrocities.
You know, it is not just limited to what we are seeing with
the Rohingya. We are seeing these atrocities throughout the
world. And, you know, the urgency of now in the midst of this
pandemic, knowing that we have to deal with the pandemic but
the real worry of secondary and tertiary impacts of, you know,
massive starvation, food insecurity, the other infectious
diseases that will be emerging because of the focus on the
pandemic, all of these are in urgent need of a global response
with wealthier nations coming together to help those that are
less fortunate.
And the important first step--and, again, a number of the
witnesses touched on it--is, as we do negotiate this next
COVID-19 bill, we do need to have global health funding in
there, and, you know, we need to keep that in there because
there is an urgency of now.
I appreciate the generosity of the appropriations bill and
the resources that were in that appropriations bill, but as
Congressman Sherman pointed out, you know, that is not coming
until October and perhaps even later than that.
So, with that, you know, let me recognize the ranking
member, Mr. Yoho, for any closing comments.
Mr. Yoho. Ami, I really appreciate what you are doing as
chairmanship. Again, I think you are doing just a fantastic
job. I appreciate everybody participating, especially our
witnesses.
But I have got to make a few comments here because I saw
this administration being attacked and not doing enough,
dropping the ball on this. But we have had two witnesses talk
about, you know, under President Obama, the sanctions got
released. Hillary Clinton, as Secretary of State, was bragging
about the democracy she helped form in Burma when it was a
shell game, we find out now.
And these atrocities were going on way before this, and
they continued all the way through this, but the work that
happened in the State Department allowed for the sanctions to
be released. And so these attacks are tawdry. I mean, they are
just cheap shots that aren't going to solve any problems, and I
really do not appreciate this.
If we do not come together, like we did with the BUILD Act
that created the DFC in this administration, I would encourage
my colleagues that do not think this administration is doing
enough, look at what the USAID has done, look at what the DFC
has done, you know, getting ventilators and equipment out
around the world.
There has been over $6 billion in DFC alone to fight the
pandemic--$3 billion was, I think, directly from the U.S.
taxpayers, and they brought in $3 billion from outside
organizations.
So, if you want to focus on politics, that is great. This
is not the place to do it. We need to come together with
policies that we can pass in a bipartisan manner that we can
get and work through the Senate, so that we can get these
policies enacted so that we can bring this genocide, which is
ultimately what this hearing is about, to an end, and we can
only do that if we are working bipartisanly together.
Mr. Chairman, thank you for what you do, and again, I
appreciate our witnesses.
Mr. Bera. Since I see Congressman Sherman still on--Brad,
would you like to make any closing comments or------
Mr. Sherman. I just want to thank you for having this
hearing and focusing our attention on the Rohingya, and that
is--and for doing an outstanding job with the subcommittee.
Mr. Bera. Great. Thank you, Mr. Sherman.
I will give the witnesses an opportunity to make brief
closing comments, and let's go in reverse order, and we will
start with Ms. Neville.
Ms. Neville. Thank you, Chairman.
Thank you, Ranking Member. I just want to close by saying a
couple of things. One, there is this immediate issue now with
needing to address the COVID-19 pandemic. I really appreciate
everyone who has highlighted those needs. I would be happy to
followup on some questions for the record if we can talk a
little bit more about what we have been seeing on the ground.
But a couple of things. Following on from Mr. Schwartz, I
would say there is an absolute need to appreciate everything
that the government of Bangladesh has done welcoming, you know,
what amounts to nearly 1 million refugees into their country,
while at same time, there certainly continue to be challenges.
There is always going to be challenges in any humanitarian
context, but a few things like, sort of, restrictions on mobile
access, internet access, which--Chairman Bera, I know you have
weighed in on as well--those things affect two different areas.
One is just access to information and being able to combat
misinformation about the virus and which is incredibly,
incredibly important given, you know, the need for limited
access in the camps to avoid further spreading the virus to the
Rohingya refugees.
And then second--Chairman Bera, you also highlighted this
as well--is just the need--the ways in which mobile data access
would actually help humanitarian programming, that needs to be
remote and just--at this point in time. So not having the
ability to carry things out via mobile and internet really does
create a lot of challenges for us as we are responding.
And I just want to really make sure we connect the
situation in Bangladesh, these refugees, because as we have
been highlighting, this is not an ideal long-term solution by
any stretch of the imagination.
So truly the only real solution is for the Rohingya to be
able to return home, which is what they want to do, but the
conditions have to exist for them to be able to do so. So these
two countries and the situations on the ground in these two
countries are intimately tied together. I mean, we really do
need to be putting emphasis on what is happening on the ground.
And there are opportunities, especially in central Rakhine
where, you know, we do a lot of programming. There are so many
opportunities to make progress toward security, toward, you
know, improving rights and other conditions for the Rohingya,
and I think that is a place where we also need to have a great
deal of emphasis.
So thank you, I really appreciate you having this hearing.
I am happy to answer further questions.
Mr. Bera. Great. Thanks, Ms. Neville.
Let me recognize Ms. Enos.
Ms. Enos. Thank you. I will be brief. I think there is no
greater moment than the present to make a decision to issue an
atrocity determination. This is something that Secretary Pompeo
can do at any moment in time, and Congress can certainly call
on him and press on the Administration to go ahead and issue
that determination.
I think, at a moment in time when the needs are being
amplified and deepened even more during COVID-19, this is a
great time for Congress to up the ante and put pressure in
order to have this happen. It would also be a great time for
the Administration to just go ahead and issue that
determination, whether that is genocide or crimes against
humanity or both.
So that is my, you know, sort of spiel, but thank you so
much for the opportunity to be able to come here and to speak
to you all.
Mr. Bera. Thank you, Ms. Enos.
Ms. Nu.
Ms. Nu. Thank you, Chair. First of all, I would like to say
my gratitude and thanks for your consistent bipartisan support
on Burma and, you know, really supporting Burma human rights
and democracy.
And now I would like to remind everyone, and ourselves,
that we are now here dealing with the genocide, crimes against
humanity, and war crimes--international crimes. We need your
leadership more than ever.
When the first crisis happened in 1978, the first refugee
crisis, the late Senator Edward Kennedy took leadership and
facilitated the return of the refugees. But then the
international community, and the world, has failed to address
root causes. Now we are seeing recurrence and repeating the
crimes again and again up to where we are now, you know,
dealing with the genocide.
So, therefore, I would like to say we need your leadership
more than ever at this point, and you can do a couple of
things. First, we need to end impunity. You can take
leadership--ask the U.S. Government to take leadership at the
Security Council to call for the meeting on Burma and to issue
the resolutions on ending impunity, supporting International
Court of Justice or International Criminal Court, or creating
even ad hoc international tribunals to hold all the
perpetrators accountable and bring in justice for the Rohingya.
And, second, the United States really need a coherent and
consistent and constructive strategy to address the overall
bigger picture of Burma democracy and human rights and
protecting the Rohingyas rights.
And assessing the funding and donations, everything, the
effectiveness of those are essential and key.
And I would like to say, thank you again for giving me this
opportunity to address you today.
Mr. Bera. Thank you.
And Mr. Schwartz.
Mr. Schwartz. I thank members of the subcommittee for
holding this important meeting and for your commitment on this
issue. I would just ask that Members of Congress and all of us,
do not make assumptions about so-called lost causes. When I
joined the staff of the subcommittee that you now chair, the
Subcommittee on Asian and Pacific Affairs, in April 1989, the
idea that a Latvia, a Estonia, a Lithuania, would ever have its
freedom was unimaginable.
When Indonesian troops invaded East Timor in the mid-
1970's, the idea that Timor would ever be an independent
country was also almost unimaginable. And what sustained that
flicker of hope and the potential for the human rights and
freedom was a willingness of some governments of the world and
nongovernmental organizations and activists to sustain a degree
of illegitimacy for what governments--what governments that had
violated human rights had done. And I just ask that, when you
think about the Rohingya as a potential lost cause, you think
about those historical examples.
And for us, at this point, I think, a single--a singular
effort, you know, to have the Department of State, the
Secretary of State, recognize these crimes as genocide, would
help to sustain that degree of illegitimacy for what that
government has done.
And, you know, we are--we heard from Refugees
International. And 80 nongovernmental organizations--more than
80 nongovernmental organizations, legal experts, human rights
experts, thousands of individuals have engaged in a campaign to
encourage the Secretary of State to make that determination, to
make that designation, and I would just ask that Members of
Congress join us in that effort because I think it is very
important and will indeed--could indeed make a difference.
Mr. Bera. Thank you, Mr. Schwartz.
And I want to thank all of our witnesses for all the work
that you do and the advocacy that you do on behalf of people
around the world that may not have that ability to advocate for
the humanity.
I also want to thank the members who participated in this
hearing, as well as thank the ranking member for his
partnership here.
With that, this hearing is adjourned.
[Whereupon, at 3:48 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]
APPENDIX
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