[House Hearing, 116 Congress] [From the U.S. Government Publishing Office] OVERSIGHT OF THE SMITHSONIAN INSTITUTION: OPPORTUNITIES FOR GROWTH BY HONORING LATINO AMERICANS AND ASIAN PACIFIC AMERICANS ======================================================================= HEARING BEFORE THE COMMITTEE ON HOUSE ADMINISTRATION HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES ONE HUNDRED SIXTEENTH CONGRESS SECOND SESSION __________ FEBRUARY 5, 2020 __________ Printed for the use of the Committee on House Administration [GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Available on the Internet: https://govinfo.gov/committee/house-administration __________ U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE 41-334 PDF WASHINGTON : 2020 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- C O N T E N T S ---------- FEBRUARY 5, 2020 Page Oversight of the Smithsonian Institution: Opportunities for Growth by Honoring Latino Americans and Asian Pacific Americans 1 OPENING STATEMENTS Chairperson Zoe Lofgren.......................................... 1 Prepared statement of Chairperson Lofgren.................... 3 Hon. Rodney Davis, Ranking Member................................ 30 Prepared statement of Ranking Member Davis................... 31 WITNESSES Hon. Jose E. Serrano, Fifteenth District of New York............. 6 Prepared statement by Hon. Serrano........................... 8 Hon. Will Hurd, Twenty-Third District of Texas................... 10 Prepared statement of Hon. Hurd.............................. 12 Hon. Grace Meng, Sixth District of New York...................... 15 Prepared statement of Hon. Meng.............................. 17 Mr. Lonnie G. Bunch, III, Secretary, Smithsonian Institution..... 18 Prepared statement of Mr. Bunch.............................. 21 Mr. Henry Munoz, Chair, National Museum of the American Latino Commission..................................................... 44 Prepared statement of Mr. Munoz.............................. 46 Dr. Beth Lew-Williams, Associate Professor of History, Princeton University..................................................... 57 Prepared statement of Dr. Lew-Williams....................... 59 Ms. Lisa Sasaki, Director, Smithsonian Asian Pacific American Center......................................................... 63 Prepared statement of Ms. Sasaki............................. 65 Dr. Eric Petersen, Specialist in American National Government, Congressional Research Service................................. 67 Prepared statement of Dr. Petersen........................... 69 SUBMISSIONS FOR THE RECORD Chairperson Lofgren and Ranking Member Davis to Chairperson McCollum and Ranking Member Joyce, letter...................... 24 An Important Story That Must Be Told, The Hill, Article.......... 79 OVERSIGHT OF THE SMITHSONIAN INSTITUTION: OPPORTUNITIES FOR GROWTH BY HONORING LATINO AMERICANS AND ASIAN PACIFIC AMERICANS ---------- WEDNESDAY, FEBRUARY 5, 2020 House of Representatives, Committee on House Administration, Washington, DC. The Committee met, pursuant to call, at 10:03 a.m., in Room 1310, Longworth House Office Building, Hon. Zoe Lofgren [Chairperson of the Committee] presiding. Present: Representatives Lofgren, Raskin, Davis of California, Fudge, Aguilar, Davis of Illinois, Walker, and Loudermilk. Staff Present: Sean Jones, Legislative Clerk; David Tucker, Senior Counsel and Parliamentarian; Daniel Taylor, Chief Counsel; Khalil Abboud, Deputy Staff Director; Jennifer Daulby, Minority Staff Director; Mary Sue Englund, Minority Director of Administrative Operations; Tim Monahan, Minority Deputy Staff Director; and Carson Steelman, Legislative Correspondent for Mr. Walker. The Chairperson. The Committee will come to order. I note that Mr. Davis will be slightly delayed, but we will recognize him for his opening statement when he arrives. I would like to say welcome to the Committee on House Administration as we focus on opportunities for growth at the Smithsonian Institution by honoring Latino Americans and Asian Pacific Americans. There are two proposals for new Smithsonian museums: H.R. 2420, a bill to establish the National Museum of the American Latino; and H.R. 4132, a bill to establish a commission to study the potential creation of a National Museum of Asian Pacific American History and Culture. This hearing is intended to inform our consideration of those measures as well as other matters related to overseeing the Smithsonian. And I would like to start by thanking the participants in today's hearing for providing us with your expertise. I recognize that some witnesses have traveled to Washington from places across the country for this hearing, and we are very grateful that you are here. I would like also to give special recognition to Representatives Jose Serrano, Will Hurd, and Grace Meng, sponsors of the two bills we are discussing today. I am very proud to represent San Jose and Santa Clara County in what is a very diverse district. San Jose has the largest concentration of Vietnamese Americans in the United States, and it is also home to northern California's largest Mexican American community. For years, I have seen firsthand how these communities are emblematic of the American experience, and I am looking forward to hearing from our witnesses as to how we can help tell the story of Asian Pacific Americans and Latino Americans through potential new Smithsonian museums. For those who may be unfamiliar with the process by which a new Smithsonian museum is created, it typically begins with a legislatively created commission tasked with making recommendations to the President and Congress as to whether a new museum should be established and what the process of standing up that museum would look like. H.R. 4132, if enacted, would establish such a commission to study the creation of a National Museum of Asian Pacific American History and Culture. This legislation is primarily referred to the Natural Resources Committee, but given its implication for future Smithsonian operations, this Committee will exercise its jurisdiction in planning carefully for the future growth of the Smithsonian. The National Museum of the American Latino has already had a commission, which has produced a report and issued recommendations, and H.R. 2420 is a bill that, if enacted, would authorize the establishment of this important museum. [The statement of the Chairperson follows:] [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] As I mentioned earlier, before I turned on the microphone, Ranking Member Davis is going to be slightly late, but he will give his opening statement when he arrives. I would now like to welcome our witnesses. Joining us this morning, as I mentioned, is our first panel: Representative Jose Serrano, who represents the Bronx in New York's 15th Congressional District. I think I speak sadly for all of us that this is his final term in Congress on behalf of his constituents in the Bronx. Over the course of his 15 terms, Jose Serrano has pursued an agenda that reflects his core values of equal opportunity and fair treatment for all. He is a tireless fighter for civil liberties, immigration reform, and many other initiatives that benefit the neediest and most vulnerable members of our society. As a former chairman of the Congressional Hispanic Caucus and its current dean, he has been a tireless advocate for the National Museum of the American Latino. Representative Serrano, I am so glad and grateful that you are able to be here with us today. And Representative Will Hurd has spent his entire career as a public servant, first as an undercover CIA agent and more recently as a Member of Congress. Since being elected in 2014, Representative Hurd has applied his expertise to his work on the Intelligence Committee and has worked to help keep our country safe. Representative Hurd is an original cosponsor of H.R. 2420. We also will miss him next year, as he has announced his retirement. We do thank you very much for being here in support of this important piece of legislation. Representative Grace Meng represents a district in Queens just a short drive over the White Stone Bridge from Representative Serrano's district in the Bronx. Representative Meng is currently serving her fourth term in Congress. She is the first and only Asian American Member of Congress from New York State, the first female Member of Congress from Queens since Geraldine Ferraro, and she has spent her time in Congress focusing on helping individuals in public housing and military veterans. She is a tireless advocate for children and a co- founder and co-chair of the Kids' Safety Caucus. And we thank you, Congresswoman Meng, for being here. At this time, before we hear from the witnesses, I ask unanimous consent that all Members have five legislative days to revise and extend their remarks and that all written statements be made part of the record. Without objection, so ordered. I will remind our witnesses, we do go by the five-minute rule, so please adhere to the lights. And we will turn to you, Congressman Serrano, first, for your statement. STATEMENTS OF THE HON. JOSE E. SERRANO, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF NEW YORK; THE HON. WILL HURD, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF TEXAS; AND THE HON. GRACE MENG, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF NEW YORK STATEMENT OF THE HON. JOSE E. SERRANO Mr. Serrano. Thank you. And first let me thank you for those kind words. Sixteen years in the State Assembly and 30 in Congress, probably enough. I leave as a chairman, I leave in the majority--I will leave in the majority. And so, like some ballplayers, I should leave on top before it is time to go. But I thank you for those words, and I thank you for your work. And I am glad to be here with my colleagues. Chairperson Lofgren, Ranking Member Davis, and members of the Committee, thank you for your invitation to testify on the importance of honoring the contributions of Latino and Asian Pacific Americans and ensuring their full inclusion within the Smithsonian Institution. I am proud to join my fellow New Yorker and colleague from Queens, Ms. Meng, as well as the Republican co-leader of our bill Mr. Hurd of Texas. As you know, Latinos have been part of this country since its foundation. Today, nearly 60 million Americans, or 18 percent of our U.S. population, identify as Latino or Hispanic. As a proud Puerto Rican, I am one of them. The U.S. Census reports that by 2060 this community will reach 111 million folks in this country, or nearly 28 percent of our population. In addition, Latinos make up a quarter of the Nation's 54 million K-through-12 students. We are the largest ethnic group in the United States and second only to Asian Americans in terms of growth. Latinos have left an indelible mark on our Nation's history and helped shape it in ways that most Americans and even many in our own community are unaware. We have served in every war since the American Revolution, fighting bravely and paying a heavy price on behalf of our Nation. We write award-winning Broadway plays and films. We are sports heroes and legends. We have been on the front lines of the fight for civil rights. We have shaped the music we all dance to, the food we eat, and countless other staples of American life. But Latino art and history is noticeably absent from recognition in many cultural institutions across this Nation, including the Smithsonian. To deny the telling of this story not only does a disservice to our contributions and sacrifices but also renders American history incomplete. There is no doubt that without the significant contributions of Latinos the country we know today would be much different. Last May, on the eighth anniversary of the Latino museum commission report to President Obama and the U.S. Congress, which laid forth a roadmap for creating a sustainable, world- class Latino museum, a bipartisan group of my colleagues joined me in reintroducing H.R. 2420, the National Museum of the American Latino Act, which, with 264--let me repeat that--with 264 cosponsors in the House, and counting, and 27 in the U.S. Senate, we are closer than ever to turning this dream into a reality. H.R. 2420 was modeled after a successful legislation that created other museums. It would authorize establishment of a Latino museum and use the commission's report's vision and recommendations to get us there. And it will be paid for just as other museums have been, with 50 percent of the cost coming from private donations and 50 percent from Federal funds. Next year, the Molina Family Latino Gallery will open in the American History Museum. This is a step in the right direction, but no matter how hard we try, hundreds of years of history, art, and culture cannot be contained in one 4,500- square-foot exhibit. We deserve a dedicated museum for our own in the heart of Washington, D.C. We need a Latino museum, and we need it soon. If you can do it before I leave Congress, I would be very, very happy. Thank you, Chairperson Lofgren and Members of the Committee, for having this important conversation and challenging the Smithsonian to be more vibrant, inclusive, and welcoming. With consideration of these bills, the Committee will continue honoring James Smithson's wish that the institution which bears his name will be ``an establishment for the increase and diffusion of knowledge.'' I am sure he would be proud if he were here today. Thank you. [The statement of Mr. Serrano follows:] [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] The Chairperson. Thank you very much, Congressman Serrano. Congressman Hurd, we would be happy to hear from you. STATEMENT OF THE HON. WILL HURD Mr. Hurd. Chairperson Lofgren, Mr. Walker, and to my other very, very distinguished colleagues, thanks for having me here today. As the lead Republican on H.R. 2420, the National Museum of American Latino Act, and as a representative of a majority- Latino district, I am proud to discuss the need for a Smithsonian museum of the American Latino right here in our Nation's capital. The National Mall in Washington, D.C., is our country's front yard. It has museums for miles telling our Nation's stories, stories of natural history, of air and space, of art, of buildings, of the American Indian, and, most recently, of African American history and culture. But there is one set of stories that is missing, the stories of the largest ethnic minority in the United States. The U.S. is home to almost 59 million Latinos and Latinas, and estimates: As Congressman Serrano said, by 2060, one out of every four people in the United States will be of Latino heritage. This bill would make the first strides towards establishing a permanent museum for the American Latino by instituting a board of trustees that will be responsible for finding a location, developing a long-term plan for construction, and advising the Smithsonian Board of Regents. Not only does this bill establish a leadership structure to make the idea of the museum a reality, but it authorizes a public-private partnership that will establish the 50-50 matching program to fund this project. Next year, the Smithsonian is opening within the Museum of American History a Latino center, the first gallery space to celebrate the experience of American Latinos and Latinas. The space will showcase the contributions of the American Latino, like how they have served in our Nation's uniform in every war since Revolution. But the space will pale in comparison to the existing museums, many of which have exhibition space well over 100,000 square feet. In just over four months, the National Museum of African American History and Culture hit the 1-million-visitors mark, and since its opening, the museum has welcomed more than 6 million tourists. This is an indication of how successful a museum of the American Latino can be. Our Nation's investment in displaying these stories that Americans and millions of tourists from around the world will want to hear will be more than worth it. Our bill, as my partner in crime on this has said, has more than 260 bipartisan cosponsors in the House, and my colleagues Senators Cornyn, Menendez, Rubio, McSally, and Capito are leading this bipartisan effort in the Senate. This isn't a Republican or Democratic issue; this is an American issue. This transcends each of us here today and will allow future generations of Americans from sea to shining sea to learn from our past, appreciate the progress made today, and work together to create a stronger future. Growing up in San Antonio, I was exposed to the rich Latino culture that is prominent in all aspects of American culture. From the music we listen to, the clothes we wear and the food we eat, to the gifted minds of our doctors, educators, and businesspeople, we see these accomplishments woven into our everyday lives and the very fabric of our Nation. I appreciate you all giving me the opportunity to do this. And I will end with an experience I had about 2 weeks ago. I am with a friend at the Native American museum, and as we are going through the displays, my friend, who was 30-ish, had never heard of the Trail of Tears. But because we were at a museum and were able to expose and be exposed to something that is so important to our culture, to our history, we had the opportunity to have that moment. And we need that opportunity when it comes to the impact Latino culture has had and is having in the United States. So I am glad to be a cosponsor of this. And I would like to also get this done before my friend and fellow Member, Mr. Serrano, leaves as well. Thank you all for the time. [The statement of Mr. Hurd follows:] [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] The Chairperson. Thank you very much. And now we will turn to our last witness on this panel, Congresswoman Meng. STATEMENT OF THE HON. GRACE MENG Ms. Meng. Chairperson Lofgren, Ranking Member Davis, and distinguished Members of this Committee, thank you for this opportunity to discuss my bill, H.R. 4132, the Commission to Study the Potential Creation of a National Museum of Asian Pacific American History and Culture Act, a bill that I have proudly introduced each of the past three Congresses. I also want to thank my colleagues Congressman Serrano and Congressman Hurd for being here to testify in support of their legislation, H.R. 2420, of which I am a proud supporter and cosponsor as well. And if you would like to move both of our bills before they leave, I would be very happy as well. I come before you today to emphasize the need to weave the narrative to the Asian Pacific American communities into the greater American story. After all, the past shapes who we are, just as it also strengthens how we move forward. There is no doubt that Asian Pacific Americans are the fastest-growing ethnic population in the U.S., and our community is becoming an increasingly powerful and visible force in all aspects of American life. From entertainment to medicine, from academia to entrepreneurship, from social justice to innovation, our community has made invaluable contributions to every facet of our Nation. But too often our community is excluded or forgotten in history--our American history. As long ago as 1850, men were recruited from the Asia- Pacific region to the U.S. to work in mines, factories, farms, and on the construction of railroads. Since then, APAs have immeasurably contributed to the advancement of our country. From the Chinese Americans who fought at the Battles of Antietam and Gettysburg during the American Civil War to the Japanese Americans who comprised the 442nd Regimental Combat Team during World War II and who became the most decorated unit in the history of the U.S. military; from the Chinese Exclusion Act to the Japanese American internment camps; and from the first wave of Southeast Asian refugees on our shores to the Filipino Americans who helped found the farm-worker labor movement, these events have left an indelible mark on our American story. Shamefully, too often, these stories are starkly missing. From these halls of Congress to every American classroom, we also cannot forget our APA heroes who fought for human and civil rights and social justice with their every breath, including Grace Lee Boggs, a human rights activist for seven decades; Larry Itliong, the quintessential leader for labor rights and justice; Colonel Young Oak Kim, the highly decorated U.S. Army combat veteran of World War II and the Korean War; Dalip Singh Saund, the first Asian American elected to Congress; and Patsy Mink, the first woman of color elected to Congress and whose name is synonymous with Title IX. Chairperson Lofgren, Ranking Member Davis, museums are gateways for Americans and the world to see our country's rich history, challenges it overcame, and potential for greatness. That is why a commission to study the potential creation of a national museum of Asian Pacific American history is the first step in elevating the APA experiences. Doing so would ensure that Americans of all ethnicities and generations can learn about the impact our community has had in our Nation's values, traditions, culture, and history. After all, the Asian Pacific American story is the American story. Thank you again for this opportunity to come before your Committee. I ardently hope we can work together to preserve the unique histories of all Americans, including Asian Pacific Americans, for future generations. Thank you. [The statement of Ms. Meng follows:] [GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] The Chairperson. Thank you very much. As is our practice, we will not subject our colleagues to questioning under the five-minute rule, but we would like to thank you for the vision that you have shown in working on these bills to make sure that the pride we have as Americans extends to every element of our beautiful country. And we thank you for taking time to be here today. We will call up our next panel. So we welcome, Secretary Lonnie Bunch. We are so pleased to have you here in our chambers again. As we know, Secretary Bunch is the 14th Secretary of the Smithsonian, and he now joins us for his second appearance before the Committee since he assumed the role of Secretary in June of last year. Though a relatively new Secretary, Mr. Bunch is certainly no stranger to the Smithsonian museum. From 2005 until 2019, Mr. Bunch served as the founding director of the Smithsonian's National Museum of African American History and Culture. Secretary Bunch took the idea of an African American History museum, he translated it into reality. Frankly, it is an amazingly good museum. Since it opened in 2016, the museum has welcomed more than 5 million visitors and compiled the collection of 40,000 objects in the first green building on the National Mall. Secretary Bunch is also an accomplished author, having written on topics such as the American Presidency to museum management. His most recent work, ``A Fool's Errand''--I love the title--is about his experience creating the African American History Museum. We are so fortunate to have you as Secretary of the museum and as a witness today. And, please, do give us your wisdom in about five minutes. STATEMENT OF LONNIE G. BUNCH III, SECRETARY, SMITHSONIAN INSTITUTION, WASHINGTON, D.C. Mr. Bunch. All right. Thank you. Chairperson Lofgren, Ranking Member Davis, Members of the Committee, thank you for the opportunity to testify before the Committee again today. When I was last before the Committee, we touched only briefly on the topic of creating additional museums within the Smithsonian, so I am grateful that you have decided to dedicate this time to explore the topic in greater depth. As the founding director of our most recent addition to the Smithsonian, the National Museum of African American History and Culture, I am happy to share the insights I gained creating a museum that began without a staff, without a building, without a collection. What the National Museum of African American History and Culture has demonstrated is that the experience of any community offers a lens to better understand our collective national identity. Its stories are the stories for everyone. It can teach any visitor something about themselves, about their history, and their country. By sharing the experiences of more communities, the better we can understand each other and our shared history. As new museum legislation is debated within Congress, it is essential that the Smithsonian not wait to provide its visitors with a broader, more inclusive history. We had hoped to be joined today by Eduardo Diaz, the director of the Smithsonian Latino Center, who was called away on family matters. But I am so pleased to be joined today by Lisa Sasaki, who is the director of the Smithsonian Asian Pacific American Center. Together, we can share how these centers make the Smithsonian more effective, more vibrant, and more meaningful by embracing an inclusive vision of our history and our culture. I know that you share our vision for telling a more complete and complex history of our Nation. While my memories of opening the National Museum of African American History and Culture are vivid, so are my memories of how difficult it was. I quickly realized that the opening was still just the beginning of a long journey. As the head of the Institution of the Smithsonian, we will be responsible for any new museums, and it is my obligation to ensure that Congress is fully aware what it means to place this responsibility on the Smithsonian. Any new museum must meet the expectations the public has for a national museum. This means appropriate size, programming, and collections. We must contemplate the needs of staff, and we must be comfortable in crafting an institution that has the right sight. There must also be a wonderful location, because these buildings are powerful symbols of how we as a Nation value the contributions of the people they represent. While I know everyone here would like to know how much a new museum would cost, we simply don't have enough information to provide a precise answer. The costs of construction are tied ultimately to the site and the challenges that location may present. Given expected construction cost increases and the challenges of preferred sites, a comparable new museum will likely exceed the cost of building the National Museum of African American History and Culture. It is so important to note that the costs do not end with construction. The annual operating costs of a museum alone are significant, but the true costs are also spread throughout the Institution. Many functions of the Smithsonian are centralized, such as maintenance, security, and a general counsel. We cannot let additional museums detract--but, rather, enhance--our ability to staff and tell the stories for all Americans. Finally, it is important that Congress understands the impact that new museums can have on our ability to maintain our aging infrastructure. Several of our iconic buildings are slated for or are currently undergoing extensive renovation. Others are in need. As this Committee is well aware, our backlog of maintenance costs has exceeded $1 billion, and many of our facilities continue to fall behind. I would like to thank you, however, for the bipartisan support you have shown in helping us manage this problem and supporting a more sustainable path for the Institution. We are continuing to look at new ways to assess and address this backlog. And Congress must understand that bringing a new museum to fruition will increase these challenges--but challenges that I think, together, we can overcome. When building the National Museum of African American History and Culture, I saw Congress as an essential partner. As Secretary, I will take the same approach. It is imperative that we work collaboratively to ensure we can meet all of our challenges, new and old. And I am sure that we can build museums worthy not only of the Smithsonian but worthy of the communities that the museum represents with the right support from Congress. I stand ready to answer any questions you have because I am excited about the opportunity to discuss the future of what may happen at the Smithsonian. Thank you very much. [The statement of Mr. Bunch follows:] [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] The Chairperson. Thank you very much, Secretary Bunch. I just wanted to put something in the record. I don't think everyone knew. I think you are aware. But Ranking Member Davis and I sent a letter to the Appropriations Committee last year asking that they fund the deferred maintenance backlog fully for the Smithsonian. This has been building over the years. It is not because of these proposals. I ask unanimous consent that the letter we sent on funding deferred maintenance be made part of the record. Without objection, so ordered. [The information is as follows:] [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Mr. Davis and I had discussed, back a long time ago--I think Mr. Davis was on the staff. I was a new Member when Vic Fazio decided it was time to get caught up, and that is when we did the maintenance and really renovated and saved the Botanic Garden; it is when we basically saved the old Library of Congress, which was falling apart. And we think it is time to do that with the Smithsonian, not to let maintenance deferred ultimately cost us more because we have not paid attention. We have not given up on this idea. And I want to recruit the other Members of the Committee, especially one Member who is on the Appropriations Committee, to see if we can't get that done. Because, in the end, it is going to cost us more. And these beautiful institutions really are in trust for us for the future and for the public, and we want to make sure that we are doing the right thing. Having said that, in a way, ``A Fool's Errand,'' your new book--hopefully that will not be the case with these two proposals. We are having this hearing because we do hope to move forward on these two. I was struck by something that you said at the last hearing where you were present, something to the effect of, if you never start, you never finish. And so I think it is important to start. That is not a guarantee that we get to the finish line, frankly. This is an authorization. But we will never know if we don't start and if we don't try. Let me just ask you this, Secretary Bunch. When you take a look at the Latino American museum as well as the Asian American museum--we have a very diverse Asian American community in the United States, a very diverse Latino community in the United States--how do you approach that, in making sure that, as we are inclusive, we are inclusive in the whole community? How would you do that? Mr. Bunch. I think it is important to realize that the key to success of any Smithsonian Institution museum is scholarship, and the scholarship allows us to understand the diversity within these communities. It is a challenge to figure out how to do that, but it is something that can be easily done with good scholars and with good curators. I think the most important thing for me, as I think about new museums, is to recognize that it is a two-sided coin, that on the one hand it is an opportunity to finally tell stories of communities, their own diversity, their impact, the challenges they face; but I think, to be the kind of Institution we really want, there will also have to be the other side of the coin that says, here is how you use Latino culture or the story of the Asian Pacific Americans to better understand what it means to be an American, to recognize that this is a story that shapes us all, not just the communities. So I think it can be done, but it is a challenge that needs good leadership and good scholarship. The Chairperson. Let me ask you this. I think back to some of the efforts that have been made just in my own little community, and I will just mention two examples. We have Norm Mineta, who was born in San Jose in what was then called and still is the oldest Japantown in the United States. A group of elders decided to open a little museum, and they did it with artifacts from their own community. And, you know, it is small, but it is really quite wonderful. They honor the Japanese Americans who walked out of the internment camps, volunteering to fight in World War II, and ended up being the most decorated unit in the entire history of the military service in World War II. And they have artifacts from the families of that unit and other things. The second museum--I have a large Vietnamese American community. Those refugees struggled. They came in little boats, fleeing from communism, and are so happy to live in this free country. And they have a little museum, again, made up of the artifacts from the people who fled in boats or who fled from the communists. Would you think about accommodating those types of activities that are sort of indigenous, in a way, but are very real? How would you deal with that? Mr. Bunch. Let me use the example of what we did with the National Museum of African American History and Culture. There are literally 150 small museums around the country that look at African American culture. And there was great concern that, if you create a museum, does that hurt us? Are we left---- The Chairperson. Well, they are not concerned in that way. Let me make that clear. Mr. Bunch. But I think what is important is that what we realized is that a national museum ought to draw people to Washington but then push them back to local museums. So let people understand that you can't build these national museums without recognizing that you are standing on the work that is done at these small institutions. So my goal would be to always celebrate those institutions as part of the foundation of creating any national museum. The Chairperson. That is really wonderful. Thank you so much, Secretary Bunch. And I will turn now to Mr. Walker. Mr. Walker. Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Bunch, let me say, you have done a great job. And I appreciate, as we were talking about earlier, the heart and energy that exists in the African American Museum, and I hope that that is something that continues to be part of our future in representing and honoring all cultures. A couple questions, though. The Women's History Museum Commission report indicated construction costs of the museum would be fully financed by private funds. In your opinion, is that model really possible? I just want to have kind of an answer in the sense of knowing what we are facing moving forward as we work bipartisan to try to get there. Is it possible? And if not, why isn't it? Mr. Bunch. I think that makes the hill a very steep hill to climb. I would argue that what is crucially important is a public-private partnership, that what that does, it allowed me, for example, building the African American Museum, to talk about how the support from Congress could be then leveraged from the private sector. And, in essence, many people in the private sector said, we want to help as long as we see that Congress is also part of the process. So can it be done without congressional support? Sure, it can, but it makes it a much, much more difficult task. I am so grateful that the legislation to create the African American Museum had a 50-50 split. Mr. Walker. Yes. It is very clear, as recently as Super Bowl Sunday, the incredible history and impact, musically and culturally, that Latinos have made on our country. The National Museum of American Latino Commission report laid out a plan of which no Federal funds would be required for the first six years of planning and pre-construction work for a new museum. Once again, just from a clarity standpoint, do you think that approach could work? Mr. Bunch. I think that one of the great successes of what would make any new museum work is to have some congressional support up front so that they can find the staff to help raise funds, they can plan better what this museum should be, which will get people excited. I just think that it really has to be a public-private partnership. Mr. Walker. I have one more question, but I want to get off the paper for just a second. Part of the attraction to the African American Museum is just the atmosphere and the energy that was captured in that. Do you think that can be duplicated in these other arenas as well? You don't walk through the African American Museum without being moved tremendously. Is that something that you foresee could be in other museums honoring different people, groups or women in general? Mr. Bunch. There is no doubt in my mind that the sense of intimacy, the sense of reducing history to human scale, the sense of drama that is at the African American Museum can be replicated, even done even better in these new museums. So my expectation would be that they would be places that you would revel in the past but you would feel an intimacy that would shape who we are today and maybe even point us toward who we can become as a Nation. Mr. Walker. Your answer was much more articulated than even my question, so thank you. So my final question here. The CBO prepared a recent cost estimate for H.R. 1980, the proposed Smithsonian Women's History Museum. Based on a 50-50 private Federal funding model, the total construction costs would be around $484 million. Do you believe this is a realistic funding level for construction of a new museum? In the past, frankly, we have seen lots of cost overruns and even delays. Does this cost estimate account for those items? And if not, should it? And why? Mr. Bunch. I think it is a reasonable estimate. I think that you have to realize that, if you are going to build a museum of a size that is credible, it means that you are going to spend $300 million to $400 million just to construct the building, but you also then need another $90 million to $100 million to do the exhibitions, to build the collections. So I think it is a number that is in the ballpark. My expectation would be that it would probably cost more than it cost to build the African American Museum. Mr. Walker. Thank you, Secretary Bunch. Your expertise is very valuable. I yield back. The Chairperson. Thank you. Mr. Davis has arrived and said that he is going to put his opening statement into the record, which we, by unanimous consent, will do. [The statement of Mr. Davis of Illinois follows:] [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] The Chairperson. And we will turn to Mrs. Davis. Mrs. Davis of California. Thank you very much, Madam Chair. And welcome, again---- Mr. Bunch. Thank you. Mrs. Davis of California [continuing]. To the Committee and bringing your expertise and your vision with you. You know, I picked up from your words a kind of cautionary tale, I guess, at this point. And I am just wondering if you could expand on that a little bit. One of the things that you mentioned, which was so critical here, is the scholarship and bringing together all the expertise and gathering that up, which was the job that you had with the National Museum of African American History and Culture. How do you see that then? Is that something that we have that is sitting there, ready to go? Or is that something that really is a process over the course of five years, ten years? Mr. Bunch. One of the great strengths of looking at the Latino museum or Asian Pacific American museum is that the Smithsonian has these two centers that are already doing a lot of this work, that are building the relationships with scholars, that are testing ideas and programs and education, which the African American Museum didn't have. So, in some ways, these centers are crucial whether we build the museum or not, but they will allow the process to move more quickly. I think the challenge is that, no matter what we do, it is going to take several years of planning, of really getting to know the audiences, understanding what people want and how to then translate that into a concrete form. But I think that what excites me is I listen to Eduardo Diaz or Lisa talk a little bit about the work they are doing, and I think what a wonderful foundation that is. Mrs. Davis of California. I wonder, though, whether there is a sense of--because they brought those elements together already, essentially, whether there is an impatience then. And how can you address that so that it is a standalone, which has a different feel to it? Mr. Bunch. As somebody whose whole career has been shaped by a desire to not erase history, to expand our understanding of who we are as Americans, I like the fact that there is a lack of patience--right?--that it is really important to make sure we tell these fuller stories. I think what is important is to recognize that the Smithsonian believes that we have to tell these stories regardless of whether there are museums or not. We are prepared, with the right leadership from Congress, with the right understanding, to craft museums that are full of wonder, that will enrich us as a community. But we are also prepared to make sure that we build on the work, that support you have given us, to be able to bring in curators who are transformative, to be able to do the kinds of programs to make sure that people see the Smithsonian as what it is: a place that helps us understand all of who we are, not just part of who we are. Mrs. Davis of California. Thank you. I appreciate that. And I am wondering, just in responding to the Chairperson, whether the opportunity to fund the deferred maintenance--does that give you a sense of, I guess, more preparedness to move forward? Because, again, you know, trying to have eyes wide open here, taking on too much can be problematic. But does that make a difference so that we make sure that the deferred maintenance is taken care of in existing museums? Mr. Bunch. When I became Secretary, the--I won't say the biggest surprise, but the sort of thing that really struck me was that we have to wrestle with this deferred maintenance. It is too important not to, and we don't want to just push it down the road. I think that if we can make sure that we do get the support that allows us to continue our creative way of looking at maintaining this deferred maintenance, to be able to restore the Air and Space Museum that allows us to take away $200 million of deferred maintenance, to really think strategically how we do it, then I think we can move in the directions of new institutions. But I think, without recognizing the impact of these on the Smithsonian, I think what it does is it slows the process. It makes the process something where the Smithsonian is fighting within itself, rather than rallying around to craft these new institutions. Mrs. Davis of California. Well, I look forward to your expertise as we move forward. Thank you very much. The Chairperson. Thank you. Mr. Davis is recognized for his questions. And thank you. Mr. Davis of Illinois. Thank you, Madam Chair. And following up on my colleague Mrs. Davis's questions about deferred maintenance and the backlog, look, I appreciate what you do. Sorry we saddled you with Shimkus on the Board of Regents, but, you know, he is really enjoying the opportunity, and I know he speaks very highly of the entire board. We want to see you succeed. We want to see the Smithsonian continue to be the worldwide institution for history and especially our history. But the deferred maintenance backlog that Mrs. Davis mentioned, it really concerns a lot of us too. It is upwards of $1 billion right now. Your appropriations for maintenance are actually below industry standard, which is an obstacle to this backlog. What is the impact on your current facilities, including some of the most visited museums in the world, like the Air and Space Museum and American History Museum, if new museums are added to your portfolio? Mr. Bunch. There is no doubt that we have to figure out the way to address that so that we are really reducing our backlog. There is no doubt about that. I think that I really take a lot for the support you have given us for the Air and Space Museum. All that renovation is really allowing us to reduce that backlog. We are going to have to think very creatively. And what we have done, as I mentioned before, is look at it in a much more strategic way, to really analyze where the real needs are, so that we are putting our resources in addressing what are the most significant, crying-out needs. Also, though, because of your support, we are able to do more preventive maintenance, which I think is the way we want to make sure that we don't have this challenge with the African American Museum, we are doing more in the Museum of American History. But I think the point is that we have to do this with both hands. If we create something new, we have to make sure what is old is taken care of as well. Mr. Davis of Illinois. I agree. And I am very supportive of the concept. But we also want to make sure that you have the resources at the Smithsonian to continue to put the best of the best museums to honor our Nation's history like you have. But if that maintenance remains at the current level, what about 10 years from now? What is the state--you know, we are doing well with the Air and Space Museum and some of the backlog there and preventative maintenance. You know, if we don't make changes to how we address the maintenance backlog now, what do you anticipate these museums will look like in 10 years? Mr. Bunch. Well, I think that it is hard for me to sort of say, in 10 years, it will be X. What is clear to me is that we have people working very diligently on what are all the things we can do to reduce that backlog. For me, the most important thing is to make sure that the visitor experience at the Smithsonian remains high and wonderful and treats people effectively. But, also, it is crucially important that we maintain the collections. So what I am doing is what any leader does: You juggle. Right? You want to make sure that we have the resources that we need, and I want to put a lot of our attention on maintaining that. And so we really are appreciative of the support that you have given us in this regard. At some point, it is crucial for us to simply say, are there new ways we can think about maintaining and attacking the backlog? And that is something we are working on. Mr. Davis of Illinois. Well, we appreciate that. And I do have a question later about storage capacity. And if we don't get to it, I would love to be able to get a written response later, because I think it is important for us to understand the issues that you may face when it comes to storage collections when you have the opportunity to have more artifacts come in for newer opportunities and ideas. But I do want to address in my last question, in testimony before this Committee, your predecessor, Secretary Skorton, stated that the Smithsonian did not have the capacity to bring new museums to fruition given other competing challenges, which is not what we want. We want to see new museums like those discussed here today. But do you share that concern, Mr. Secretary? Mr. Bunch. I share the concern that we have to address this backlog, but I believe that with your leadership and with our creativity, that with the resources that we need, we can begin to build new museums if necessary. Mr. Davis of Illinois. I agree with you. The Federal budget for the Smithsonian is about a billion dollars. If additional funding is required to support new museums and to meet other priorities, can you give me a range of what you think you might make as a request for us to continue to provide you the resources for new possibilities and for existing museums? Mr. Bunch. Well, I would like to really come back to that and give you an answer. I think it is important to recognize that, if you build a new museum, after you have built it, then the costs are probably anywhere from $25 million to $40 million annually just to operate, the direct costs. Then there is probably another $40 million to $60 million that is really the cost to make sure that you can provide the security, that you can make sure that you have the contracting to support that. So there are costs. And that is what I meant by saying, if we are going to do things like this, we have to realize that opening the museum is just the beginning. Mr. Davis of Illinois. Great. Thank you. I yield back. And I really enjoy working with you. Mr. Bunch. Thank you very much. The Chairperson. Thank you. The gentleman from Maryland is recognized. Mr. Raskin. Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Bunch, welcome. Mr. Bunch. Good to see you. Mr. Raskin. How do you determine the appropriate size of a museum? Mr. Bunch. You look at several things. First of all, you look at the visitation you might expect. There is a certain number that the Smithsonian will always get. You also look at the stories you want to tell, how many exhibitions you need to tell. You want to look at whether or not you have on-site storage or off-site storage. So you look at a variety of factors. You also look at what the site allows you to do. And what we have discovered is, to be able to do a building that serves the public, also protects the staff and gets the right amount of staff, it is about 350,000 square feet. That is, sort of, industry standard here at the Smithsonian. Mr. Raskin. So what are the major challenges presented by creating a new museum, and what are the major benefits of creating a new museum? Mr. Bunch. You got three hours? I think that there are many challenges. Obviously, the challenge of balancing new with old--right?--making sure that we are taking care of the entire Smithsonian. It is crucially important to realize that we have to build a strong fundraising apparatus from the very beginning so that we can make sure of the resources that are there from the private sector. It is also essential to build a strong staff. And then most of these museums, like the African American Museum, will have to build collections, so to think about what are the variety of strategies that allow you to find the stuff of history that people need to see. But maybe more than anything else, it is important to recognize, how do these new museums find the right balance between tradition and innovation? What is the role of technology? Does that add additional burdens? Does that save us costs? Ultimately, what you are really doing is, on new museums, from the African American Museum on to anything new we build, what you are saying is: It is no longer acceptable just to be something that serves audiences in Washington. So what are the ways you reach beyond that? So all of that are part of some of the challenges. One of the benefits is really that--the history of America is so complicated that no one building can do it. But the Smithsonian has this amazing opportunity to create different portals into what it means to be an American, a portal that may go through the Air and Space Museum or the African American Museum. And what that does is it means that, even if you are only interested in technology, suddenly you can see connectivity because you are at the Smithsonian. That is something that doesn't happen anywhere else in the world. Mr. Raskin. I wonder if you would reflect for a moment on the experience of the African American Museum, since you were the founding director of it. Specifically, if you would address the original points of skepticism that were leveled against the museum and then how the experience since has responded to the original kinds of criticisms that were leveled against the idea. Mr. Bunch. Well, first, the notion was that this museum had been floating around for 100 years so it would never happen. So part of the strategy was making the museum exist from the day I started, not waiting for a building--birthing the museum online, doing traveling exhibitions, and basically creating a space in the Museum of American History that now the other museums are building on. I think that was crucially important. I think one of the real challenges were that many of these smaller African American museums were very concerned that this would take away resources. But what has happened since then is the visibility of the museum, the excitement about African American culture has led to increased visitation around the country, has led to more support from local governments for these kinds of institutions. I think the biggest challenge was to think, what does it mean to be a 21st-century museum? What is the role of technology? What is the role of reaching out? And I think the museum, sort of, invented a lot of new things that we can build upon. So, ultimately, the key for us was to think about, how do you craft a museum--the fundamental question I would ask is, how do you craft a museum on the Mall that is part of the Smithsonian that serves a community but serves more than that community? That, I think, is one of the fundamental questions. Mr. Raskin. Well, I appreciate that. And I just wanted to tell you, a week doesn't go by when I am not there a day or two a week for different events. It has become such a spectacular asset, not just locally but nationally. I yield back, Madam Chair. The Chairperson. The gentleman yields back. The gentleman from Georgia is recognized. Mr. Loudermilk. Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Secretary, thank you for being here. Thank you for your leadership and guidance. I am a huge fan of the Smithsonian. Mr. Bunch. Thank you. Mr. Loudermilk. It has been part of my heritage growing up, the excitement of seeing the artifacts, being in touch with our history, our heritage, our culture. And I am invigorated by the idea, the vision of moving forward. One of the things about the Smithsonian Institution that I think resonates with people is quality. There is a term back home, especially if you see--like the museum I have in my district, the Southern Museum of Railroad Heritage in Kennesaw, Georgia, the site of the beginning of the Great Locomotive Chase during the Civil War. It has been a museum for years. Smithsonian partnered, and now the term is, it is a Smithsonian-quality museum. And I think that is a very, very important aspect. So my concern is continuing that level of quality, the viability going forward. And there are really three things--as a business owner in the past, there are three things that can really harm a business: being undercapitalized during the growth period, the first three to five years; you don't have enough capital to go forward and grow. The other thing, once you are past that period, is the lack of growth. But there are many businesses that fail because of excessive growth, that they cannot keep up and maintain their current customer base or their current product, and it causes the collapse of very viable businesses. I am going to echo some of the concerns we have here, because I am with you. We want to make this happen. And you have to have growth in business. If you are stagnant, people tend to move on. Even if you are providing a good product, they are always looking for better. So it is important to grow. But with the maintenance backlog and nearly a billion- dollar cost of the renovations that are greatly needed to the Air and Space Museum, my concern is--and I hear what you are saying, that you have really good people dedicated to eradicating this backlog. But is there a plan--a plan--in place that says, from this date to this date, we are going to eliminate the backlog we know of now? And that is just--I don't know that we really have our hands wrapped around that. I know that, yes, part of leadership is juggling, but also part of leadership is a plan with benchmarks that you can get to. If you wouldn't mind responding. Mr. Bunch. Sure. I think that I have said as soon as I became Secretary, that is one of our major priorities, to develop that plan. We have parts of it in place. We don't have a complete plan, and that is something we are working on. But I think it is also key for us to understand that that plan is going to mean we are going to have to tap our fundraising to see if that is a way to begin to address it. We are going to have to tap how we are already doing some restorations and renovations in our old buildings. We have to look at how do we move up so that we are spending more of our money towards that maintenance. And the key for us was preventative maintenance. And so the support we have, we have a plan on how to make sure that we don't continue just to grow the backlog, that---- Mr. Loudermilk. Right. Mr. Bunch [continuing]. We actually put a cap on it. And so that is what we are working on. And there will be a more detailed plan as we move forward. Mr. Loudermilk. Are there outside sources of revenue that can bring things in? Like, one of my favorite television channels is Smithsonian Channel. Mr. Bunch. Sure. Mr. Loudermilk. I love ``Aerial America.'' Mr. Bunch. Right. Mr. Loudermilk. I mean, it is kind of a go-to program for me. Do you receive any revenue from that from advertising? Are there sources like that that we can--I never want to see us charge for the actual museum, but---- Mr. Bunch. Right. Mr. Loudermilk [continuing]. Are there outside revenue sources that we can invest in to grow? Mr. Bunch. We have looked at all the things that we have sources of revenue coming in. We are looking at, are there--for example, we have an endowment for the facilities that probably throws off $50,000 a year, which is not much. So to think about, as we look towards maybe another capital campaign, is that endowment a crucial part of it, so is that going to allow us to put more money into deferred maintenance. Mr. Loudermilk. Okay. Mr. Bunch. We are looking at all the opportunities we have at this stage to see where we can take resources to go in this direction. Mr. Loudermilk. Last question, really quickly. You had testified that the Mall area--this was in the Transportation and Infrastructure Committee--is now a floodplain, could potentially be subjected to floods. Is it wise for us to look at building new museums actually in that area if that is a concern? Mr. Bunch. One of the things that we have looked at is, are there models that say we shouldn't build in that area, are there models that say we should move museums, and there aren't. What we have had to do is, when we built the African American Museum, we built that recognizing that there is going to be rising water, that it is a different environment, and we put systems in place to ensure that we can protect that precious treasure. We have also made--in areas where we couldn't build new, you know, we have moved collections out of lower levels just to make sure that we are protected. So, like all of us, we are wrestling with what this means and how we address it, but we think we have moved in a smart way to make sure we have protected the collections right now. Mr. Loudermilk. Thank you. The Chairperson. Congresswoman Fudge. Ms. Fudge. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you so much, Mr. Secretary, for being here. I just really have two questions: One is, for the museum honoring Latinos, there was a capital site that was--or a recommended site for the museum, which, we understand, can accommodate a building of about 250,000 square feet. Is that large enough, or are we putting ourselves behind the eight ball before we start? And does that--will it accommodate storage and administrative offices in that space? Mr. Bunch. At 200,000 square feet, what you really have to think about is collections will not be able to be housed in a place like that. I am not sure that is large enough for the staff that would really need to be--to handle that. And I also think there is a symbolic issue, and that is, the question of people who expect new museums expect them to carry the weight like other Smithsonian museums, that the buildings themselves are part of the symbol, and a building of 200,000 square feet may not be large enough to do that. Ms. Fudge. So what, then, would be your recommendation to the Committee, because clearly, I don't think it is big enough, knowing what we already have. What would you then do with your storage needs? What would happen with that, if that is the site that was selected? Mr. Bunch. I think that what we would have to do is look candidly at what we had to do with the African American Museum. We had two options: One is, do you build new storage areas like out in our Suitland campus or out in Dulles. To build a new storage unit costs, you know, over $100 million. Ms. Fudge. In addition to the cost of this building? Mr. Bunch. Oh, absolutely. Or do you take rental spaces? You know, we rent space out at Pennsy, and that is a cost that is going to hurt us down the road. So what you want to do is recognize, though, that the Mall is sacred space, so you do want to use as much of that space as possible for the visitors, and for the services that need to be there, and you want to have a minimal collection storage, and then you have got to find another place as your collections grow. Ms. Fudge. All right. And, so, I just want to be clear that that then becomes a significantly larger cost than the cost of the museum, which is what we are talking about today, so that people are aware of the fact that it is going to impact a lot of other things, including possibly your other plans for other museums. The other thing is, is there--and, if there is, please let me know--a fund-raising plan for the museum? Do you know if there is one, and, if so, what it is? Mr. Bunch. I think, at this stage, it is too premature to have a fund-raising plan. You would really want to, sort of, think about exactly the location, to have leadership think about what are the products that you want to produce--exhibits, et cetera--but what is crucial, then, is to have the support so that you can hire fund-raisers very early in the process. I don't think we are there yet, but that is something that I would argue needs to happen very shortly after a museum is being willed into existence. Ms. Fudge. Well, I would just close by saying that I wholeheartedly support the museums, but I also--we have some fiscal responsibility to the taxpayers to be sure that we are acting in an appropriate manner as we start to move down the road with this, so I thank you, and I yield back. Mr. Bunch. Thank you. The Chairperson. Thank you. Mr. Aguilar from California, and also a member of the Appropriations Committee, who we are looking to, to help us get our deferred maintenance funds. Mr. Aguilar. Thank you, Chairperson, and I think, with that pressure in mind, I will just kind of start down that path. Mr. Secretary, your budget request, as my colleagues had mentioned, for fiscal year 2020, you had requested $219 million for the facilities capital account. You were appropriated $253 million. So, my first question would be, how do you plan on using the additional $34 million that you were appropriated? The second piece of that is, the list--the specific list of 16 projects that you mentioned within the 219 requests, are those still valid? Are those estimates? Is the completion of those projects still possible given the dollars that we were appropriating? Mr. Bunch. Well, I think the estimates are still accurate. Mr. Aguilar. Okay. Mr. Bunch. And what we want to do is use some of the additional resources to really focus on preventive maintenance, to really make sure that we are just not continuing to dig a deep hole. I think that the additional support allows us to be even more creative in how we use and how we address this. It also reminds us that it is going to take a concerted effort with Congress finding some other sources as well, because this is really a challenge that we have left for so many years that it is going to take more than 2 or 3 or 4 years to fix it. Mr. Aguilar. Sure. And I don't want you to get ahead of OMB and the President's budget next week, but, you know, just among friends here, you know, what would be the capital request? What would be the ballpark estimate of a capital facilities request that you might propose to the Appropriations Committee? Mr. Bunch. I would love to get back to you with that---- Mr. Aguilar. Sure. Mr. Bunch [continuing]. Because we are still grappling with what we think is the right number. Mr. Aguilar. Sure. I look forward to monitoring that across the process, and as the Chairperson said, we are serious about addressing this, and maybe it takes some bold action on our part in order to really chip away at this backlog in a big way. But we are serious about meeting those obligations as well as honoring the commitment. You sat there and heard our colleagues talk about some of these ideas for future plans as well, and I know that you have had a lot of those conversations. I appreciate you attending the Hispanic Caucus meeting a few months ago with Eduardo Diaz. And you talked a little bit about the Molina Family Gallery opening in 2021; the exhibit is going to have bilingual stories and a cross-cultural audience as well to enjoy. Given the state of play--and this is similar to questions you heard in that meeting--given the state of play in our country when it comes to race relations, can you speak to what steps the Smithsonian Institution is taking to ensure that that 4,500-square-foot exhibit can adequately represent over 600 years' worth of diverse Latino American history? Mr. Bunch. One of the things with the Molina Gallery that I have asked is, give me a five-year to ten-year plan of what else you would do in the gallery. The plan is to have an opening exhibition that frames the broad issues, explores the community. But clearly, one exhibit is not going to get us to where we really need to be, but I think, if we look--much like I did with the African American Museum, look at an array of issues that we can explore over the next four, five, six years, that begins to get at this, because the most important thing the Molina Gallery does is twofold: One is to sort of firmly say to the Smithsonian and say to the Smithsonian's public, this is so important that we want to give it square footage. That is--you know, when you come to see it, that is important. But the second thing is, it should be a space that allows us to test ideas, test the way the audience engages, test the way different communities think about the experiences, so, therefore, we can then improve, and if we move down the road towards a museum, we have actually laid a strong foundation. Mr. Aguilar. I appreciate it. You know, one of our goals is, as you heard with our colleague, both of whom are retiring, Mr. Serrano and Mr. Hurd, we want to move that bill. We want to mark that up, and we want to move it in a strong bipartisan way, and part of that is, obviously, making the case that the exhibit space that we are going to be utilizing is done appropriately. I appreciate the steps that you are taking in that regard. What process are we going to use--and I know you are talking about making that case and having that kind of long- range view. What opportunities for collaboration are included in that within the role that Mr. Diaz plays, as well as within your role and in others? What are different opportunities where folks can say, Hey, try this out, or why don't you include this era, or do a little bit more of this instead of that? What opportunities for collaboration and input---- Mr. Bunch. Uh-huh. Mr. Aguilar [continuing]. Do you see in a more formal way? Mr. Bunch. I think it is important to realize that the Smithsonian is in a networked age, that it is--no longer has broad-enough shoulders to carry everything, and it has got to find ways to both collaborate with museums that care about the subjects we want to explore, to help us look at new ideas, but also to help us convey our ideas outside of Washington so that what you want is a kind of mutually reciprocal relationship that is a long-term commitment that improves both the Smithsonian and local entities. I think the other thing is to make sure that the Latino Center of the Smithsonian is doing a much better job developing new support, new interns, new fellows, so that we are really making sure that we have got new generations of, if not museum people who can shape museums, at least museum consumers who can support it. Mr. Aguilar. I appreciate it. Thanks, Mr. Secretary. Thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair. I yield back. The Chairperson. The gentleman yields back. Mr. Secretary, it is always an honor to have you here, and we are very proud of you, and grateful that you are the Secretary of the Smithsonian. Mr. Bunch. Thank you. The Chairperson. And thank you for answering our questions and for the terrific job you are doing. Mr. Bunch. Thank you very much. Appreciate it. The Chairperson. All right. We will now call up the third panel. So welcome to everyone. I am going to introduce first Henry R. Munoz III, who is the Chairman of the National Museum of the American Latino Commission, a legislatively created, independent position established to study the feasibility of creating a museum dedicated to Latino American culture within the Smithsonian. In addition to leading the Commission, Mr. Munoz has served the Smithsonian as vice chairman of the Smithsonian National Board, chairman of the Smithsonian National Latino Board, and trustee of the Cooper Hewitt National Design Museum. He is also chairman of the board and chief creative officer of Munoz & Company, one of the largest and oldest minority-owned design practices in the country. We also have Beth Lew-Williams, who is an associate professor of history at Princeton University, and a historian of race and migration in the United States, specializing in Asian American history. Her recent book, ``The Chinese Must Go: Violence, Exclusion, and the Making of the Alien in America,'' has won a variety of awards, including the Ray Allen Billington Prize, and the Ellis W. Hawley Prize and the Organization of American Historians, and the Sally and Ken Owens prize from the Western History Association, as well as the Vincent P. DeSantis Book Prize from the Society of Gilded Age and Progressive Era, and the Caroline Bancroft History Prize, a book I think we probably have to get and read. Prior to her time at Princeton, Dr. Lew-Williams was a new faculty fellow at Northwestern University appointed in history and Asian American studies. We have Lisa Sasaki, who is the Director of the Smithsonian Asian Pacific American Center, a museum without walls, that brings Asian Pacific American history, art, and culture to communities through innovative museum experiences online and throughout the country. She is also a frequent guest lecturer for museum studies graduate programs, and, prior to her time at the Smithsonian, Ms. Sasaki served as the Director of the Audience and Civic Engagement Center at the Oakland Museum of California, and the Director of program development at the Japanese American National Museum in Los Angeles. And, finally, last but not least, Eric Petersen is a specialist in American national government in the government and finance division of the Congressional Research Service, where he has worked for two decades. He conducts research and provides policy analysis support and training for Members of Congress and their staff. His research areas include the Smithsonian Institution, congressional administration and staffing, constituent service management, and the Government Publishing Office, which, by the way, we will be having an oversight hearing on that in the coming weeks. Dr. Petersen earned undergraduate degrees at the Community College of Philadelphia and the University of Pennsylvania. His graduate work includes a master's in public administration from Virginia Tech, and a Ph.D. in political science from Syracuse University. In addition to his work at CRS, he is a lecturer at the John Glenn College of Public Affairs of the Ohio State University. Thanks to each of you. I will remind you that your statements should be about 5 minutes, and then we will go to questions. So, Mr. Munoz, we will turn first to you. STATEMENTS OF HENRY MUNOZ, CHAIR, NATIONAL MUSEUM OF THE AMERICAN LATINO COMMISSION, WASHINGTON, D.C.; DR. BETH LEW- WILLIAMS, ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR OF HISTORY, PRINCETON UNIVERSITY; LISA SASAKI, DIRECTOR, SMITHSONIAN ASIAN PACIFIC AMERICAN CENTER; AND DR. ERIC PETERSEN, SPECIALIST IN AMERICAN NATIONAL GOVERNMENT, CONGRESSIONAL RESEARCH SERVICE STATEMENT OF HENRY MUNOZ Mr. Munoz. Thank you, Chairman, and thank you, members. It is an honor to be here today to provide testimony regarding the many decades of work held aloft by so many people across this country--scholars, curators, historians, scientists, teachers, artists, activists, businesspeople, volunteers, and everyday citizens--I am one of them--to answer the question of whether there should be a national museum of the American Latino in our Nation's Capital. I am here today, not just as the chairman of the Commission to establish a national museum of the American Latino, but as the first Latino in the 173-year history of the Smithsonian to ever serve a term on its national board. Mainly, I am here because I grew up in South Texas during a time where the stories of people like myself and our families were not included in museums or archives or libraries. Our Commission, after working for almost two years, found the answer to be abundantly clear: Yes, the time has come for the creation of a place on The National Mall, where our most important monuments are located, where we conduct the business of our Congress, pay tribute to our veterans, gather to inaugurate our presidents, and where we give full voice to our freedom of speech. The Mall, more than any other public space in our country, should tell the story of America, recognizing that Latinos were here well before 1776, and that, in this new century, our future is increasingly Latino, more than 58 million people and growing. The Commission investigated nine sites, and, yes, made a recommendation of one. The Commission believes strongly that the new museum should be a part of our Nation's preeminent scientific research and cultural institution, the Smithsonian Institution, and when created, should be known as the Smithsonian American Latino Museum, free to every American citizen and governed in the same manner, and funded in the same manner as the National Museum of the American Indian and the National Museum of African American History and Culture, a place that, within the vision of the Smithsonian, for the increase in diffusion of knowledge, is not just a monument to past accomplishments, but a 21st-century learning laboratory connected to cultural centers and schools across the country, recognizing that many American children may never visit Washington, D.C., and, yet, deserve to have access to great American stories. This is possible because of the work to create and the funding of programs, exhibitions, and territorial positions established throughout the Smithsonian Museum system over the last 30 years at the American History Museum, the American Art Museum, the National Portrait Gallery, the Cooper Hewitt National Design Museum, and the Natural History Museum, and this is just the beginning. These efforts will soon be joined by the privately funded Molina Family Latino Gallery within the walls of the American History Museum, and our collections are accessible to every American citizen through the Smithsonian's Latino Virtual Museum. The National Museum of the American Latino Commission responded to the direction of Congress to engage the American people in order to create a strategic plan for the establishment and maintenance of the museum; to develop a fund- raising strategy to support the museum; to report on the availability and cost of collections to be acquired; to examine the impact of this museum on regional Latino museums; to analyze and recommend possible locations for the museum; to recommend whether the museum should be located within the Smithsonian Institution; to recommend a governance and organizational structure for the museum; to engage the American Latino community in the development of the museum; to determine the cost of constructing, operating, and maintaining the museum; and, finally, to assist in drafting legislation to carry out the plan of action to create and construct the museum. In May of 2011, in a ceremony at the White House, the members of the Commission, ahead of schedule and under budget, delivered to the President of the United States and to Members of the Congress, a final report containing our in-depth analysis, findings, and recommendations. Based upon our work with a broad group of thought leaders and experts, and, most importantly, a dialogue with hundreds of thousands of citizens in communities across the United States, both in person and online, in the first-of-its-kind effort, now carried forward by the friends of the American Latino Museum, the Commission articulated a comprehensive plan for the establishment of the Smithsonian American Latino Museum. I have attached an executive summary of the Commission's final report for your record, and I am happy to report that the findings validate the readiness of this idea to be formalized by Congress. It is completely within the capabilities of the Smithsonian Institution and this young, dynamic, fast-growing, and economically-significant population of Americans to give birth to, and to sustain a new national museum. At this moment in our country's history, when cultural understanding could not be more essential to the enduring strength of our democracy, I am asking, on behalf of the American people, to carefully consider the importance of creating the Smithsonian American Latino Museum so that we may illuminate the American story for all. [The statement of Mr. Munoz follows:] [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] The Chairperson. Thank you very much. We will turn now to you, Dr.--let's see. Who am I---- Ms. Lew-Williams. Lew-Williams. The Chairperson. Dr. Lew-Williams. STATEMENT OF BETH LEW-WILLIAMS Ms. Lew-Williams. Well, I want to thank the Committee for holding this hearing and having this conversation, and thank you for allowing me to testify. Every year, I begin my semester at Princeton by asking my students: What do you know about Asian Pacific American history? What have you been taught? And the most frequent answer I get is, Nothing. And, when pressed, they will usually recall that the Chinese built the railroad and the Japanese internment was a tragic mistake. Most of the time, they have learned these things thanks to a couple of paragraphs in their high-school textbook, and this is true whether they come from New Jersey or from Texas or from Virginia, or even from California. Their K-12 education is practically devoid of the history and culture of Asian Pacific Americans. And I think, if you think back to your own education, I would wonder what you learned. And, according to research, this lack of knowledge that I observe in my classroom is due to a lack of exposure, and studies of U.S. history and government textbook show a startling dearth of content on Asian Pacific Americans. In the National Register of Historic Places, only 3 percent of sites are associated with their history, and history isn't the only area of neglect. A 2019 study of U.S.--major U.S. art museums found that only 0.06 percent of showcased artists are Asian American. What I want to say today is there is nothing natural about this omission. Asians and Pacific Islanders are the fastest- growing racial group in America today, and our history in this country stretches back centuries. The first Chinese immigrants came to America in the 1820s, and their numbers rapidly increased with the 1849 gold rush in California. Chinese workers blasted tunnels through the Sierra Mountains to make way for the transcontinental railroad, they drained swamplands to make way for agriculture, and they fell trees needed to construct the towns and cities of the West. They were joined by Japanese, Korean, and Sikh immigrants, who labored in the fields and factories. As Asian immigrants who made America's landscape and built America's infrastructure, they also reshaped the legal foundations of the Nation. They brought landmark cases before the Supreme Court, which helped to define key concepts of citizenship and equal protection. As Asian American--Pacific Americans helped to build America, we also need to remember that America built this community through its actions in the world. The Spanish- American War brought Filipinos, native Hawaiians, Guamanians, Samoans into the national fold, and the Vietnam War brought waves of Vietnamese, Cambodians, Lao, and Hmong refugees. I think, if we fail to include Asian Pacific Americans in our historical memory, we emerge with a distorted understanding of our Nation. If we ignore the history of Chinese exclusion, we can imagine that America once welcomed the huddled masses yearning to breathe free. If we dismiss the Philippines and the Pacific Islands, you can pretend that America was never an empire. If we omit Japanese confinement during World War II, we can forget how quickly wartime hysteria can undermine our constitutional principles. If we want to understand the transformation of American politics, we need to remember women, like Representative Patsy Mink, the first woman of color to serve in Congress, and we also need to remember Grace Lee Boggs, a revolutionary who empowered the youth of Detroit. If we want to recognize the richness of American culture, we need to talk about Asian Pacific American food, music, architecture, art, and literature. People go to the Smithsonian to learn about America, who we are as a people and a Nation. Our national museums capture the stories we tell about ourselves, about our past and our future. By creating an Asian Pacific American Smithsonian, Congress could recognize the historically marginalized group and bring them closer to the rightful role in American society and American memory. This would convey a powerful vision of inclusion, diversity, and equality. I urge you to please take the first step in making this vision a reality, to form a Commission to consider a National Museum of Asian Pacific American History and Culture. [The statement of Ms. Lew-Williams follows:] [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] The Chairperson. Thank you very much. Ms. Sasaki. STATEMENT OF LISA SASAKI Ms. Sasaki. Chairperson Lofgren, Ranking Member Davis, and members of the Committee, thank you for the opportunity to testify before you today. I am Lisa Sasaki, and I have the honor of serving as the director of the Smithsonian Asian Pacific American Center since 2016. Prior to joining the Smithsonian Institution, I spent over 20 years working in the museum field, specifically in community-based museums like the Oakland Museum of California, and the Japanese American National Museum. It is my great privilege to work with the talented team of curators, programmers, and professionals to highlight the stories of what is currently the fastest-growing racial group in America, an estimated 20 million Asian Pacific Americans and their communities located across the mainland United States and the Pacific. The Smithsonian Asian Pacific American Center was established in 1997 as a mission-critical Pan-institutional initiative to further the inclusion and representation of Asian Pacific Americans across Smithsonian exhibitions, collections, programs, and research. In its early years, the center produced numerous temporary and traveling exhibitions and hosted notable Asian Pacific American speakers, artists, and performers here in Washington, D.C. Today, the Center has expanded to also present digital projects, community--excuse me--community-based public programs, and educational resources that bring Asian Pacific American art, history, and culture to a global audience. The Center acts as a respected convener and cultural laboratory working in close partnership with community organizations, scholars, artists, and nationally-recognized institutions, such as The Library of Congress and The Kennedy Center and other Smithsonian units. The Center also administers the Smithsonian Asian Pacific American initiatives pool, federally appropriated funds that support projects from across the Smithsonian's 19 museums and 9 research centers that focus on contributions and experiences of Asian Pacific Americans through research, acquisitions, programs, exhibitions, new media, publications, and educational activities. Since its creation 4 years ago, this pool has helped to support 49 projects in 16 different Smithsonian units, including the creation of the first ever curator of Asian Pacific American history position at the National Museum of American History. I appreciate the opportunity to testify before you today on H.R. 4132, a bill to establish a commission to study the potential creation of a National Museum of Asian Pacific American History and Culture. If Congress deems it in the public interest to move forward with the creation of the commission, the Smithsonian and I stand ready to serve as content experts should the bill pass into public law. In the meanwhile, the center will continue to advance its mandate to increase Asian Pacific American content and focus at the Smithsonian Institution and around the country. Specifically, we have recently launched a comprehensive campaign designed to do the following. One, create a series of national collecting initiatives with Smithsonian museums to preserve Asian American Pacific stories digitally and through the collections of object, art, and archives. Two, increase opportunities for Asian Pacific American students and museum professionals within the Smithsonian, helping to create the next generation of scholars, curators, and leaders. And, three, create the first dedicated Asian Pacific American exhibition gallery in Washington, D.C., within the Smithsonian. I also wanted to now say a few words about our sister program, the Smithsonian Latino Center, which is directed by my colleague, Eduardo Daz. Eduardo had planned on testifying before this Committee today, but was unable to, unfortunately, due to a death in his family. Fortunately, his written testimony is included for the record of this Committee hearing. The Latino Center was created in 1997 to promote Latino presence within the Smithsonian. The center works collaboratively with the Institution's museum research centers, record label, and traveling exhibition service, ensuring that the contributions of the Latino community in helping build this country and shape our national culture are explored, presented, celebrated, and preserved. The Center supports research, exhibition collections, public and education programs, and digital outreach about the U.S. Latino experience, as well as a range of professional development programs in history, arts, culture, and the sciences. Currently, the center is preparing to unveil the first ever Latino gallery on The National Mall, the Molina Family Latino Gallery, which will open at the National Museum of American History in spring 2021. I am proud that The Latino Center is making great strides to increase the visibility of Latino populations and their rich and culturally diverse stories at the Smithsonian. I am equally proud to be working at the Smithsonian Asian Pacific American Center to ensure that Asian Pacific Americans are also recognized. I would like to thank the Committee for giving me this opportunity to testify and for your support and interest in the work of the Smithsonian. I am happy to answer any questions that you might have. [The statement of Ms. Sasaki follows:] [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] The Chairperson. Thank you very much. And we will turn now, Dr. Petersen, to you. STATEMENT OF ERIC PETERSEN Mr. Petersen. Chairperson Lofgren, Ranking Member Davis, and members of the Committee, thank you for your invitation to testify before you today. I have been asked to provide an overview of some of the matters Congress might encounter in the potential consideration and development of new Smithsonian museums, and this comes at a time of great interest in these museums in Congress and among museum advocates. In addition to the potential projects under consideration today, H.R. 1980, as reported by this Committee, would create a women's history museum in the Smithsonian. It is unclear whether Congress has ever considered the potential development of three substantial museum projects essentially at the same time. Questions that Congress and this Committee might consider regarding museum development range from big picture philosophical considerations to practical and detailed operational concerns, some of which we have heard today. In this oral statement, I will focus on three areas of concern, including the role and availability of private entities to support museum initiatives; the capacity of the Smithsonian to engage major new museum initiatives, along with a number of current institutional demands; and, naturally, the potential costs of establishing and operating new museums. With regard to private interest in museums, the development of the most recent Smithsonian museums, the National Museum of African American History and Culture and the National Museum of the American Indian, suggests that proposals for museums typically grow from initial efforts of private individuals or groups. In considering these proposals, there appears to be a series of around 10 events involving the efforts of supporters, Congress, and the Smithsonian. Private advocates appear to engage in everything from the first idea for a museum to the grand opening, and this can take a long time. A hundred and eight years elapsed between the time when George Heye began his collection and when the American Indian Museum first opened its doors. Similarly, the African American History and Culture Museum opened 101 years after the first efforts of African American Civil War veterans to establish and build a museum or monument. In considering the development of new museums, Congress might consider the commitment and capacity of advocates for various museums to work independently and effectively in support of that museum's establishment. Within the Smithsonian, recent and current leaders have taken an arguably discouraging approach to the creation of new museums and have instead advocated in favor of other priorities. The potential need for the Smithsonian to execute the development of as many as three new national museums might raise concerns about its capacity to effectively address ongoing operations, resolve longstanding maintenance concerns for existing facilities, in addition to consideration of the museums. In addition to these concerns, the extent to which the Smithsonian Institution has or can develop the human capital capacity to integrate new museums into its portfolio has not been assessed in a publicly available manner. Any of these concerns arguably might inform an assessment of the Smithsonian's ability to successfully develop the new museums under consideration. Finally, if the national American Latino, Asian Pacific American history and culture, or women's history museums are created by Congress, as we have discussed this morning, and they are funded in the same manner as other SI museums, they could represent a significant enduring increase in the appropriations provided for Smithsonian operations. In advance of a detailed project, it can be difficult to estimate costs for new museums, because those costs are going to vary according to the scope of the new museum's mandate, facility size, funding mechanisms, and other factors. Some potential guidance on costs, however, may be drawn from the costs of building and operational expenditures of the American Indian and African American History and Culture Museums. For the first 15 years those museums were in operation, and including the funding for the Federal components of museum planning, design, construction, and exhibit development, appropriations for the American Indian Museum were at least $564.9 million, and for the African American History and Culture Museum at least $644 million. These figures reflect adjustment for inflation to 2019 dollars. Finally, I want to acknowledge the assistance of some very good CRS colleagues, Dr. Jacob Straus, who is behind me today, and some wonderful librarians who helped me pull together this testimony. That is all I have for now. I appreciate your inviting me to testify. And I look forward to any questions you might have. [The statement of Mr. Petersen follows:] [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] The Chairperson. Thank you very much. And thanks to all the witnesses. I will turn now to the Ranking Member, Mr. Davis, for any questions he may have. Mr. Davis of Illinois. Thank you, Madam Chair. And thank you to all the witnesses. Great to hear your opening testimony, and look forward to working with you as these projects move forward. My first question is for Mr. Munoz. The Commission considered several sites as possible locations. One is the Capitol site on the Senate side of the Capitol, which is under the jurisdiction of the architect of the Capitol. Was the architect consulted on the location? And what input may they have provided? Mr. Munoz. Yes, they were consulted on the potential location of the museum on that site. It is the one site on the Mall that is not under the jurisdiction of the National Park Service. So, during the time of consideration of all nine sites, we worked through the various organizations that have jurisdiction over The National Mall. For example, the National Capital Planning Commission. Everyone weighed in on that process. In fact, at the end of the day, through all of the planning processes that have considered and continued to evolve what should happen on The National Mall as far back as Pierre L'Enfant's plan for the city of Washington, D.C., it has always been thought that there would be a significant civic building on that side. It is currently a parking lot. And so, at the end of the day, the National Capital Planning Commission said: We believe that some consideration of the rethinking of the entire site, including the Reflecting Pool, could be enhanced by the location of a building such as a museum, like the National Latino Museum, on that side. Mr. Davis of Illinois. Okay. You mentioned the collaboration. The Park Service obviously was included in this. Did they express any concerns about that location at all? Mr. Munoz. There is always--I think there are lots of concerns about the complexity of The Mall. So in every single site that was considered, there were pros and there were cons. The Secretary spoke to one earlier. I might disagree with him on that one, but there are always pros and cons. Mr. Davis of Illinois. Okay. Thank you very much. Thanks for your testimony. Mr. Petersen, thank you for being here as one of our witnesses. I forgot to look at your bio again beforehand and realize you didn't go to the University of Illinois. You went to some institution in Ohio that many people haven't heard of. Mr. Petersen. Actually, I teach there. Mr. Davis of Illinois. We will still consider you somewhat of an expert today on CRS. Mr. Petersen. Well, thank you. Mr. Davis of Illinois. What are the elements that needed to be considered in order to have a holistic estimate of the financial commitment any new Smithsonian museum would require? Mr. Petersen. Well, as Dr. Bunch has suggested, there are a number of pieces that we need to think about, from the initial idea through the expenses for a commission of consideration, to the unknowable--fully unknowable when we begin costs of construction and then operations. It is very difficult to tie down a specific number ahead of time. I know that some entities have tried, and, inevitably, they wind up lower than what the actual costs are. But, fundamentally, you are looking at paying for the idea stage, paying for the site planning and construction stage, and then paying for the ongoing operations. Mr. Davis of Illinois. We have had previous museums come in at certain estimates and then end up substantially higher, sometimes upwards of 50-percent increases. Is there something that stands out as a part of those projects that you can't plan for a 50-percent increase? What is it that we ought to, as a Committee, come together and be concerned about to ensure that the estimates reflect the actual costs? And what can we do to help ensure that on the front end? Mr. Petersen. Arguably, there is a degree of uncertainty that you are not going to overcome at the front end. Mr. Davis of Illinois. Should that be at a 50-percent degree of uncertainty, or do you think we can minimize that? Mr. Petersen. I think that is a question for analyzing past estimates and then finding out final costs. So, for example, in the case of the African American Museum, nobody really anticipated the challenges the creek running under The Mall would pose and the cost increases of having to build a vastly more reinforced foundation. In the case of the American Indian Museum, it was a strange circumstance in that you had a substantial renovation of a museum space in New York, a new building in Suitland for collection storage, and The Mall flagship facility. How do you get there? Again, I would prefer to look at the models of expenditures and then perhaps suggest an idea of what the potential overage could be. Mr. Davis of Illinois. Great. Thank you, to each of you. I look forward to working with you as this process moves forward. I yield back, Madam Chair. The Chairperson. Thank you. The gentleman from California, Mr. Aguilar. Mr. Aguilar. Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Munoz, the Latino population in the United States is projected to grow to reach over 100 million people in less than 50 years. H.R. 2420, the National Museum of the American Latino Act, has strong bipartisan support. The previous panel of Members, Mr. Serrano and Mr. Hurd, also another south Texan--we don't hold that against him. But can you explain to the public and to us how establishing this national museum will expand the Smithsonian's representation for Latino voices throughout our country and community? Mr. Munoz. Well, I would look at it from three perspectives. First of all, the wisdom of the Congress many years ago to establish Latino pool funds has seeded the development of this museum over the course of the last three decades. So there are currently curators that are established in each of these museums who are making sure that the American story that is told in those museums is more complete. That was the first step in establishing the scholarship that the Secretary talked about to ultimately build let's call it a major portal on The Mall in Washington, D.C. As that work progressed, everybody agreed that if you have the fastest-growing demographic group in the country, as you said, expected to be 100 million people, then it is in the best interests of the country for them to understand who they are as Americans. And that can't really be told without--let's call it a building--a building and a digital architecture and all of the scholarship that is associated with that. You know, I had an interesting experience a few years ago when I was vice chairman of the Smithsonian National Board. I was asked to represent the Smithsonian at a meeting of the Ministries of Culture. Of all of the countries in the Americas, we are the only country that doesn't have one. And so, when you think about the Smithsonian and all of its organic glory as a place of scientific research and culture and art, it is really important for this community to see itself as a part of that American story, and it is important for other people to see it, too. You know, last night I was watching, and there was a lot of discussion of pilgrims, but not of the true founding of the country, of the intersection that had happened between the indigenous people and the Spaniards, which predates that. And so, until that story is told, maybe because the country has this notion of purity, it won't really understand itself as a mixture, a great mixture, melting pot of people. So I think that the time is now to do this. I don't think there is a better team to do it than when Lonnie Bunch is the Secretary of the Smithsonian, because he has actually done it. And I am sitting here in this room thinking: How wonderful would it be to have a Secretary who really understands the process to watch over this, and this, and the women's museum? Mr. Aguilar. Yes, I appreciate it. And can you talk to us a little bit about how your analysis, how the study reviewed the site locations as well-- Mr. Davis talked a little bit about that--but the importance of it being on The Mall, but also some of the concerns associated with some of the other sites as well and why this might be the most appropriate use, this Mall site that was identified? Mr. Munoz. So there were nine, and not all of them were on The Mall in the purest possible thinking. But there has been an evolution in the thinking of The Mall. Development never stops, right? The city is evolving. And so there was discussion about what might constitute The Mall if you weren't being traditional thinkers. There were very few. I mean, there are many people, Save Our Mall thinks that there are too many buildings on The Mall already. The National Park Service was completing a study about what the use of The Mall should be in the future. This was on the heels of, like I said, L'Enfant's plan, and all of the pertinent organizations with jurisdiction met with us and weighed in on the cost, on issues such as security, on what unforeseen conditions--there is a creek running under The Mall--of those things. And the commission attempted to balance all of those. There were two overriding considerations. One was location. What had the possibility of fitting into the ecosystem of institutions on The Mall so that it had the broadest exposure possible to the American people? If you were going to choose that, then you might choose what came in second, let's call it, which was the Arts and Industries Building. But the Arts and Industries Building is a historic building, it has been around for a long time, and it probably isn't suitable for a 21st century collecting museum, but it has a great location next to the Castle. The second site, which became the preferred site, and, quite honestly, the site that had a great deal of consideration given to it through these various plans and the National Capital Planning Commission, was the Capitol site. And it, because of where it is, because it has always been anticipated that there would be a major civic building there, because it is currently a parking lot, because it would complete, if you are staring at the Capitol and you looked at the Botanical Garden here and you looked on this side, if you built a building, maybe it wouldn't be a 500,000-square-foot building, but it would be a building that was in harmony with the Botanical Gardens, well, that was a wonderful thing and the place where the Inaugural parade starts. But there were considerations there, too, which is security. It is very close to the Capitol. We thought that was a plus. So at the end of the day what I want the members of the Committee to understand was that there is no perfect site. Everybody was unanimous about the need for this to be on The Mall proper. It was a very careful consideration. And at least at that time, knowing that there would have to be further site selection considerations, the site that made the most sense was the Capitol site. Mr. Aguilar. Thank you, Mr. Munoz. Thanks for your service as well. Thank you, Madam Chair. The Chairperson. Thank you very much. I will just close out by saying how helpful this hearing has been to me to identify issues. Dr. Petersen, certainly we want to go into this with our eyes wide open, what the issues are, how to cope with them, because those are challenges, but not impediments if we plan for them properly. In terms of the timing, I am hoping we can move forward on this. Certainly the idea that we wait 100 years for this is completely unacceptable. And two of our three congressional witnesses are retiring at the end of this Congress. They both said they hoped we could act before they do. That seems like a reasonable request, and I am hoping that we can proceed. Certainly the Latino Museum has already done its commission. We are in a position to move forward. And, as Secretary Bunch has said, you never get to the end if you don't take the first step, and that is really where we are. In terms of siting, as I was listening to you, I was remembering back to the building of the World War II Memorial, and there was a lot of dissension and fighting about that, and there was a strong sense that we should move forward. And I am a huge environmentalist, but there was going to be environmental delays that went on and on and on. And Senator Bob Dole and I--an unlikely couple--decided to go after this. And I remember a press conference that Senator Dole and I had about this, and he said that if we wait until all the World War II vets are gone, that will not be acceptable. Now, obviously the Latino Americans and Asian Americans are not going anywhere, but we have a moment in time here with Secretary Bunch, who knows how to do this, the excitement in the country and of the Congress to proceed. We should take advantage of this moment to move forward. I was thinking about going to New Mexico years ago and meeting with various legislators whose families have been in New Mexico for like 300 years. My grandfather came here right just before World War I. Their families extend centuries, and, yet, their story is not fully told. What a great opportunity it is to build the full story of America for all of us to have pride in. So I am hoping to move that forward. I do have a question really for the Asian Pacific Islander Museum, because this is a commission: How we are going to structure this to fully capture the great diversity of the Asian Pacific Islander Museum. And I am not critical, because it is the pattern, the members of the commission is two members from the Majority Leader of the Senate, two from the Speaker, two from the Minority leaders of the House and the Senate. It is a small commission. And yet we have Japanese Americans, Chinese Americans. We have Indo Americans, who are also very diverse, Sikhs, Hindus, Baha'is, Muslims. We have Tongans, Nepalese. I mean, it just goes on and on, such a diverse--Vietnamese Americans--such a diverse Asian community. How will we approach capturing the diversity that has so blessed our country? Ms. Sasaki. Would you like to go? Go first. Ms. Lew-Williams. I would say that the diversity of the community is one of the reasons that we need a standalone museum to try to capture what is an incredibly diverse and distinct many histories, many stories of many people. I would say that, as a historian, as an academic, that academics have been working on this project for a long time. As a field, Asian American studies is about 50 years old, and the study of Asian immigrants and Asian and Pacific Islanders goes back before that. So I think that we have the academic resources to think about this community as a community together, perhaps, and Ms. Sasaki can talk about the community and how the community can come together. I think that the fact that it is so many stories means that just the building, just having a commission and then imagining such a bringing together of these many histories, would be a productive thing for the Asian Pacific American community to imagine how we tell this story that is so often overlooked. The Chairperson. Do you have anything to add? Ms. Sasaki. Yes. Thank you so much for bringing this up, because I think that this is an opportunity for us to recognize that the commission, should it go forward, has a very important job to do, which is call together as many experts, scholars, and community members from across all of these different communities in order to be able to talk about the impacts of their history, their stories, the opportunities that we have to share about this larger American story that we all contribute to. And I think that with the recognition of that from the very beginning about how complex this endeavor will be, given the diversity of all of the communities that fall underneath the umbrella of Asian Pacific America, that we have a great opportunity to bring together amazing scholars, like my colleague here, who can help us better unpack and talk about how we are going to be able to represent those stories in what will ultimately never be enough space. The Chairperson. Well, I am going to thank each of you for being here today as witnesses. It was very important to hear from you. The Committee may have additional questions, which we will send to you. If so, and if we do that, we would ask that you respond in writing as quickly as you can. I am just thinking we are really the only country in the world that is completely made up of people from someplace else, other than our Native Americans. And it is the kind of country, it is not where you are from, it is where you are going that matters. But you always have to remember where you are from as well. Such a rich opportunity we have here to further strengthen America through understanding all of the people who are here and what makes us great. Thank you very much, and we are now adjourned. [Whereupon, at 11:59 a.m., the Committee was adjourned.] [all]