[House Hearing, 116 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
BUDGET CUTS AND LOST LEARNING:
ASSESSING THE IMPACT OF
COVID-19 ON PUBLIC EDUCATION
=======================================================================
HEARING
BEFORE THE
COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION
AND LABOR
U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
ONE HUNDRED SIXTEENTH CONGRESS
SECOND SESSION
__________
HEARING HELD IN WASHINGTON, DC, JUNE 15, 2020
__________
Serial No. 116-58
__________
Printed for the use of the Committee on Education and Labor
[GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Available via the: https://edlabor.house.gov or www.govinfo.gov
__________
U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
41-105 PDF WASHINGTON : 2022
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND LABOR
ROBERT C. ``BOBBY'' SCOTT, Virginia, Chairman
Susan A. Davis, California Virginia Foxx, North Carolina,
Raul M. Grijalva, Arizona Ranking Member
Joe Courtney, Connecticut David P. Roe, Tennessee
Marcia L. Fudge, Ohio Glenn Thompson, Pennsylvania
Gregorio Kilili Camacho Sablan, Tim Walberg, Michigan
Northern Mariana Islands Brett Guthrie, Kentucky
Frederica S. Wilson, Florida Bradley Byrne, Alabama
Suzanne Bonamici, Oregon Glenn Grothman, Wisconsin
Mark Takano, California Elise M. Stefanik, New York
Alma S. Adams, North Carolina Rick W. Allen, Georgia
Mark DeSaulnier, California Lloyd Smucker, Pennsylvania
Donald Norcross, New Jersey Jim Banks, Indiana
Pramila Jayapal, Washington Mark Walker, North Carolina
Joseph D. Morelle, New York James Comer, Kentucky
Susan Wild, Pennsylvania Ben Cline, Virginia
Josh Harder, California Russ Fulcher, Idaho
Lucy McBath, Georgia Steve Watkins, Kansas
Kim Schrier, Washington Ron Wright, Texas
Lauren Underwood, Illinois Daniel Meuser, Pennsylvania
Jahana Hayes, Connecticut Dusty Johnson, South Dakota
Donna E. Shalala, Florida Fred Keller, Pennsylvania
Andy Levin, Michigan* Gregory F. Murphy, North Carolina
Ilhan Omar, Minnesota Jefferson Van Drew, New Jersey
David J. Trone, Maryland
Haley M. Stevens, Michigan
Susie Lee, Nevada
Lori Trahan, Massachusetts
Joaquin Castro, Texas
* Vice-Chair
Veronique Pluviose, Staff Director
Brandon Renz, Minority Staff Director
------
C O N T E N T S
----------
Page
Hearing held on June 15, 2019.................................... 1
Statement of Members:
Foxx, Hon. Virginia, Ranking Member, Committee on Education
and Labor.................................................. 8
Prepared statement of.................................... 9
Scott, Hon. Robert C. ``Bobby'', Chairman, Committee on
Education and Labor........................................ 1
Prepared statement of.................................... 6
Statement of Witness:
Gordon, Mr. Eric, Chief Executive Officer, Cleveland
Metropolitan School District, Cleveland, OH................ 31
Prepared statement of.................................... 34
Johnson, Mr. Mark, Superintendent of Public Instruction,
North Carolina Department of Public Instruction, Raleigh,
NC......................................................... 28
Prepared statement of.................................... 30
Leachman, Mr. Michael, Ph.D., Vice President for State Fiscal
Policy Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, Washington,
DC......................................................... 11
Prepared statement of.................................... 14
Pringle, Ms. Rebecca, Vice President, National Education
Association Education Association, Washington, DC.......... 21
Prepared statement of.................................... 24
Additional Submissions:
Courtney, Hon. Joe, a Representative in Congress from the
State of Connecticut:
Article: Ripple Effects of Downturn Show Pandemic's Early
Economic Toll was Just the Beginning................... 49
Article: Norwich Board of Education Cuts Staff, Rejects
Closing Schools for now................................ 114
Questions submitted for the record by:
Bonamici, Hon. Suzanne, a Representative in Congress from
the State of Oregon.................................... 119
Sablan, Hon. Gregorio Kilili Camacho, a Representative in
Congress from the Northern Mariana Islands
Responses submitted for the record by:
Mr. Gordon............................................... 122
Ms. Pringle.............................................. 124
BUDGET CUTS AND LOST LEARNING:
ASSESSING THE IMPACT OF
COVID-19 ON PUBLIC EDUCATION
----------
Monday, June 15, 2020
House of Representatives,
Committee on Education and Labor,
Washington, D.C.
----------
The committee met, pursuant to call, at 12:02 p.m., via
Webex, Hon. Robert C. ``Bobby'' Scott (Chairman of the
committee) presiding.
Present: Representatives Scott, Davis, Grijalva, Courtney,
Fudge, Sablan, Wilson, Takano, Adams, Norcross, Jayapal,
Morelle, Wild, Harder, McBath, Schrier, Underwood, Hayes,
Shalala, Levin, Trone, Stevens, Lee, Trahan, Foxx, Roe,
Thompson, Walberg, Guthrie, Byrne, Grothman, Stefanik, Allen,
Smucker, Banks, Comer, Cline, Wright, Meuser, Johnson, Kelller,
and Murphy.
Staff Present: Tylease, Alli, Chief Clerk; Phoebe, Ball,
Disability Counsel; Ilana, Brunner, General Counsel; Ramon,
Carranza, Education Policy Fellow; Christian, Haines, General
Counsel; Sheila, Havenner, Director of Information Technology;
Ariel, Jona, Staff Assistant; Stephanie, Lalle, Deputy
Communications Director; Andre, Lindsay, Staff Assistant;
Jaria, Martin, Clerk/Special Assistant to the Staff Director;
Richard, Miller, Director of Labor Policy; Katelyn, Mooney,
Associate General Counsel; Max, Moore, Staff Assistant; Mariah,
Mowbray, Staff Assistant; Jacque, Mosely, Director of Education
Policy; Veronique, Pluviose, Staff Director; Lakeisha, Steele,
Professional Staff; Loredana, Valtierra, Education Policy
Counsel; Banyon, Vassar, Deputy Director of Information
Technology; Cyrus Artz, Minority Staff Director, Courtney
Butcher, Minority Director of Member Services and Coalitions;
Amy Raaf Jones, Minority Director of Education and Human
Resources Policy; Carlton Norwood, Minority Press Secretary;
Chance Russell, Minority Legislative Assistant; Mandy
Schaumburg, Minority Chief Counsel and Deputy Director of
Education Policy; and Brad Thomas, Minority Senior Education
Policy Advisor.
Chairman Scott. The Committee on Education and Labor will
come to order.
I want to welcome everyone and note that a quorum is
present. The Committee is meeting today for a hearing to hear
testimony on, quote, ``Budget Cuts and Loss Learning: Assessing
the Impact of COVID-19 on Public Education.''
This is a completely virtual hearing, and I will ask that
all microphones, for Members and witnesses participating
remotely, be kept muted as a general rule to avoid unnecessary
background noise. Members and witnesses will be responsible for
unmuting themselves when they are recognized to speak or when
they wish to seek recognition.
Further, pursuant to House Resolution 965 and its
accompanying regulations, Members are required to leave their
cameras on the entire time they are in an official proceeding,
even if they step away from the camera. This is an entirely
remote hearing, and as such the Committee's hearing room is
officially closed. Members who choose to sit in there--with
their individual devices in the hearing room must wear
headphones to avoid feedback, echoes, and distortion resulting
from more than one person in the room on the software platform
as has been reported by other committees.
They are also expected to adhere to social distancing and
safe healthcare guidelines, including the use of masks, gloves,
and wiping down their area both before and after their presence
in the hearing room.
And while a roll call is not necessary to establish a
quorum, in an official proceeding conducted remotely, whenever
there is an official proceeding with remote participation, the
clerk will call the role to help make clear who is present at
the start of the proceeding.
At this time I will ask the Clerk to call the role.
Madam Clerk.
The Clerk. Chairman Scott?
Chairman Scott. Present.
The Clerk. Mrs. Davis?
Mrs. Davis. Present.
The Clerk. Mr. Grijalva?
Mr. Grijalva.
The Clerk. Mr. Courtney?
Mr. Courtney. Present.
The Clerk. Ms. Fudge?
Ms. Fudge. Present.
The Clerk. Mr. Sablan?
Mr. Sablan. Present.
Mr. Clerk. Ms. Wilson?
Ms. Bonamici?
Mr. Takano?
Mr. Takano. Present.
The Clerk. Ms. Adams?
Ms. Adams. Present.
The Clerk. Mr. DeSaulnier?
Mr. Norcross?
Mr. Norcross. Here.
The Clerk. Ms. Jayapal?
Ms. Jayapal. Present.
The Clerk. Mr. Morelle?
Mr. Morelle. Present.
The Clerk. Ms. Wild?
Ms. Wild. Present.
The Clerk. Mr. Harder?
Mr. Harder. Present.
The Clerk. Mrs. McBath?
Mrs. McBath. Present.
The Clerk. Ms. Schrier?
Ms. Schrier. Present.
The Clerk. Ms. Underwood?
Ms. Underwood. Present.
The Clerk. Mrs. Hayes?
Ms. Shalala?
Ms. Shalala. Present.
The Clerk. Mr. Levin?
Mr. Levin. Here.
The Clerk. Ms. Omar?
Mr. Trone?
Mr. Trone. Here.
The Clerk. Ms. Stevens?
Ms. Stevens. Hello. I am here, present.
The Clerk. Mrs. Lee?
Mrs. Lee. Present.
The Clerk. Mrs. Trahan?
Mrs. Trahan. Present.
The Clerk. Mr. Castro?
Mrs. Foxx?
Ms. Foxx. Present in the committee room.
The Clerk. Mr. Roe?
Mr. Thompson?
Mr. Thompson. Present.
The Clerk. Mr. Walberg?
Ms. Foxx. Mr. Walberg is having difficulty with his sound,
but he is present in the room.
The Clerk. Mr. Guthrie?
Mr. Guthrie. Present.
The Clerk. Mr. Byrne?
Mr. Byrne. Present.
The Clerk. Mr. Grothman?
Ms. Stefanik?
Ms. Stefanik. Present.
The Clerk. Mr. Allen?
Mr. Allen. Present.
The Clerk. Mr. Smucker?
Mr. Smucker. Here.
The Clerk. Mr. Banks?
Mr. Walker?
Mr. Comer?
Mr. Comer. Present in the committee room.
The Clerk. Mr. Cline?
Mr. Cline. Present.
The Clerk. Mr. Fulcher?
Mr. Watkins?
Mr. Wright?
Mr. Wright. Here.
The Clerk. Mr. Meuser?
Mr. Meuser. Present.
The Clerk. Mr. Johnson?
Mr. Johnson. Johnson is present.
The Clerk. Mr. Keller?
Mr. Keller. Here.
The Clerk. Mr. Murphy?
Mr. Murphy. Present in the committee room.
The Clerk. Mr. Van Drew?
Chairman Scott, this concludes the roll call.
Chairman Scott. If people will all remute, there is still a
lot of background noise, we would appreciate it.
Thank you.
Pursuant to Committee Rule 7(c), opening statements are
limited to the Chair and Ranking Member. This allows us to hear
from our witnesses sooner and provides all members with
adequate time to ask questions.
I now recognize myself for an opening statement. But before
I deliver opening remarks, let me first acknowledge the recent
protest against police misconduct and in favor of racial equity
and justice across the Nation. Times are demanding that we
address this country's centuries-old challenges, and with
today's hearing, we can be prepared to answer the calls for
racial equity and justice in education.
I want to note that this hearing marks the Committee's
first fully remote hearing, pursuant to House Resolution 965
and its accompanying regulations.
Today we are going to examine how COVID-19 pandemic has
drastically impacted State and local government revenue and how
projected State and local government shortfalls will further
exacerbate educational inequities rooted around the country.
Nationwide school closures due to COVID-19 have had a
profound effect on all students, especially in what has been
called the summer slide; only this year the summer slide has
started a few months earlier than usual.
Our country's history of educational inequity tells us
which students will lose the most during these schools
closures. Today the pandemic is exposing and worsening
achievements gaps for students of color, students with
disabilities, English language learners, and students from low-
income backgrounds.
Vulnerable students are less likely to attend schools that
have the resources to rapidly establish high-quality distance
learning programs. They are also less likely to have the basic
technology, such as a personal computer and high-speed internet
connections, and the support at home needed to access virtual
learning.
Data suggests that only 60 percent of low-income students
are regularly logging into online instruction compared to 90
percent of high-income students. Only 60 to 70 percent of
students in schools serving predominantly black and Latino
students are regularly logging in.
It is important to note that States and school districts
entered this recession with already crumbling infrastructure, a
teacher shortage, 77,000 fewer school workers, and about 2
million more public school students compared to prerecession
levels. These setbacks have not been distributed equally. Our
continued reliance on local property taxes to finance public
education has ensured that public schools with the highest need
are forced to do with less.
Unfortunately, the achievement gaps exacerbated by COVID-19
could widen even further.
This morning the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, or
CBPP, revealed that States will face a $615 billion revenue
shortfall over the next 3 years due to the pandemic. States are
required to balance their budgets every year and public
education is usually one of the largest expenditures, about 40
percent of many State budgets on average.
Unless the Federal Government provides immediate relief, it
won't be a matter of whether education funding will be cut but
how deep the cuts will be. While wealthier districts will fall
back on property taxes, low-income public schools will rely
heavily on State funding. These districts, which are already
disproportionally impacted by COVID-19, will suffer severe cuts
in education and other areas at a time when they can least
afford it.
We have already started to see the consequences of these
shortfalls. Nearly 759,000 public school employees have lost
their jobs since March.
In Colorado, State Legislature just passed the budget that
cuts $1 billion from its schools next year.
In Virginia, we ended our regular General Assembly session
just as the pandemic was starting and then reconvened a few
weeks later for the normal veto session where we consider the
Governor's vetoes and amendments. Revenues had been reforecast
during that period of time, and we learned a new word,
unallocated. That is what happened to the 2 percent teacher
raise. That is what happened to additional counselors in the
schools. That is what happened to money going into low-income
school districts. Because of the renewed revised revenue
estimates, those expenditures were unallocated. Unless they get
assistance from the Federal Government, those expenditures will
just totally evaporate.
But regrettably the Department of Education has received
$31 billion to help fund the emergency education funding. That
happened in the CARES Act. But, regrettably, the Department has
mishandled those funds and has prevented States and school
districts from quickly accessing those funds.
Specifically, the Department issued equitable service
guidance, which has drawn bipartisan criticism and generated
widespread confusion, by directing schools to divert funding
relief away from low-income students in public schools to
support wealthier students in private schools.
The Department also announced its intention to use the vast
majority of the $300 million in discretionary funds it received
in the CARES Act which was intended to support public schools
in their effort to respond to the virus, to fund a grant
program that is virtually indistinguishable from private school
vouchers.
Even if the Department had used CARES Act funds in
accordance with the law, the initial emergency relief package
would be insufficient to confront the scale of the problem.
Researchers project that reopening schools could cost the
average school district about $2 million, with large urban
districts obviously facing higher costs.
The American Federation of Teachers projects that schools
nationwide will need as much as $116 billion to safely reopen
campuses. Recent history foreshadows the consequences our
educational system will face if we fail to act.
In response to the great recession in 2008, Congress
provided approximately $110 billion in funding for education,
more than three times the funding we have secured in response
to the pandemic so far, while helpful research shows that even
that funding was insufficient and did not focus enough on
school districts with the highest need. Consequently, schools
across the country experienced massive budget cuts. 300,000
school employees lost their jobs, and unsurprisingly children
in the poorest communities bore the brunt of these cuts.
This lesson from our past makes clear that school districts
urgently need more relief, and to that end the House passed the
Heroes Act last month. This legislative relief package
dedicates nearly a trillion dollars to help States and
localities address their budget shortfalls and to avert cuts in
education.
Additionally, it provides $60 billion in direct K through
12 emergency funding that schools can use to cover the costs of
cleaning supplies and other expenses required to reopen,
purchase educational technology like laptops and hot spots,
sustain special education for students with disabilities,
provide training and professional development for teachers, and
support school counselors who are helping students tackle the
trauma of this pandemic.
This is a pivotal and perilous moment in our fight for
equity in education. The pandemic has already translated into a
major setback with students across the country; but with all of
us wanting to reopen the schools as quickly as possible, we
cannot put the safety of students, teachers, and communities at
risk or opening schools without providing the resources they
need.
If we fail to give the States and local governments and the
school districts these recourses, the impact of this
unprecedented challenge on students will be felt long after it
is over.
I want to thank our witnesses for being with us today, and
I yield to the distinguished ranking member, Dr. Foxx, for the
purpose of an opening statement.
Dr. Foxx.
[The statement of Chairman Scott follows:]
Prepared Statement of Hon. Robert C. ``Bobby'' Scott, Chairman,
Committee on Education and Labor
Before I deliver opening remarks, let me first acknowledge the
recent protests against police misconduct and in favor of racial equity
and justice across the nation and the world. The times are demanding
that we address this country's centuries-old challenge. With today's
hearing, we can be prepared to answer the calls for racial equity and
justice in education.
I want to note that this hearing marks the Committee's first fully
remote hearing, per House Resolution 965 and its accompanying
regulations.
Today, we will examine how the COVID-19 pandemic has drastically
impacted state and local government revenue and how projected state and
local government shortfalls will further exacerbate educational
inequities rooted around the country.
Nationwide school closures due to COVID-19 have had a profound
effect on all students, especially in what has been called the summer
slide; only, this year, the summer started a few months earlier than
usual.
Our country's history of educational inequity tells us which
students lose the most during these school closures. Today, the
pandemic is exposing and worsening achievement gaps for students of
color, students with disabilities, English language learners, and
students from low-income backgrounds.
Vulnerable students are less likely to attend schools that have the
resources to rapidly establish high-quality distance learning programs.
They are also less likely to have the basic technology, such as
personal devices and high-speed internet, and the support at home
needed to access virtual learning.
Data suggest that only 60 percent of low-income students are
regularly logging into online instruction compared to 90 percent of
high-income students. Only 60 to 70 percent of students in schools
serving predominantly Black and Latino students are regularly logging
in.
It's important to note that states and school districts entered
this recession with already crumbling infrastructure; a teacher
shortage; 77,000 fewer school workers; and about 2 million more public
school students compared to pre-recession levels.
These setbacks have not been distributed equally. Our continued
reliance on local property taxes to finance public education has
ensured that public schools with the highest need are forced to do more
with less.
Unfortunately, the achievement gaps exacerbated by COVID-19 could
widen even further.
This morning, the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, or CBPP,
revealed that states will face a $615 billion revenue shortfall over
the next three years due to the pandemic.
States are required to balance their budgets every year, and public
education is usually one of their largest expenditures, accounting for
40% of many states' budgets, on average.
Unless the federal government provides immediate relief, it won't
be a matter of whether education funding will be cut, but how deep the
cuts will be. While wealthier districts will fall back on property
taxes, low-income public schools will rely heavily on state funding.
These districts--which are already disproportionally impacted by COVID-
19--will suffer severe cuts in education and other areas at a time when
they can least afford it.
We have already started to see the consequences of these
shortfalls. Nearly 759,000 public school employees have lost their jobs
since March. In Colorado, the state legislature just passed a budget
that cuts $1 billion from its schools for next year.
In Virginia, we ended our regular General Assembly session just as
the pandemic was starting and then reconvened a few weeks later for the
normal veto session where we consider the governor's vetoes and
amendments. Revenues had been reforecast during that period of time and
we learned a new word: unallocated. That is what happened to the two-
percent teacher raise; that is what happened to the additional
counselors in schools; that is what happened to money going into low-
income school districts. Because of the revised revenue estimates,
those expenditures were unallocated.
Unless they get assistance from the federal government, those
expenditures will totally evaporate.
The Department of Education has received $31 billion to help
provide emergency education funding, which happened in the CARES Act.
Regrettably, the Education Department has mishandled those funds
and prevented states and school districts from quickly accessing these
funds.
Specifically, the Department issued equitable service guidance,
which has drawn bipartisan criticism and generated widespread confusion
by directing schools to divert relief funding away from low-income
students in public schools to support wealthier students in private
schools.
The Department also announced its intention to use a vast majority
of the $300 million in discretionary funds it received in the CARES
Act--which were intended to support public schools in their efforts to
respond to the virus--to fund a grant program that is virtually
indistinguishable from private school vouchers.
Even if the Department had used CARES Act funds in accordance with
the law, the initial emergency relief package would be insufficient to
confront the scale of the problem.
Researchers project that reopening schools could cost the average
school district about $2 million, with large urban school districts
obviously facing far higher costs. The American Federation of Teachers
projects that schools nationwide will need as much as $116 billion to
safely reopen campuses.
Recent history foreshadows the consequences our education system
will face if we fail to act. In response to the Great Recession in
2008, Congress provided approximately $110 billion in funding for
education--more than three times the funding we've secured in response
to the pandemic so far.
While helpful, research shows that even that funding was
insufficient and did not focus enough on school districts with the
highest need. Consequentially, schools across the country experienced
massive budget cuts; 300,000 school employees lost their jobs; and,
unsurprisingly, children in the poorest communities bore the brunt of
these cuts.
This lesson from our past makes clear that school districts
urgently need more relief.
To that end, the House passed the Heroes Act last month. This
legislative relief package dedicates nearly $1 trillion to help states
and localities address their budget shortfalls and avert cuts in
education.
Additionally, it provides nearly $60 billion in direct K-12
emergency funding that schools can use to:
Cover the cost of cleaning supplies and other expenses
required to reopen;
Purchase educational technology, like laptops and hotspots;
Sustain special education for students with disabilities;
Provide training and professional development for teachers;
and,
Support school counselors, who are helping students tackle
the trauma of this pandemic.
This is a pivotal and perilous moment in our fight for equity in
education. The pandemic has already translated to a major setback for
students across the country.
But--while all of us want to reopen schools as quickly as
possible--we cannot put the safety of students, teachers, and
communities at risk by reopening schools without providing them the
resources they need.
If we fail to give states, local governments, and school districts
these resources, the impact of this unprecedented challenge on students
will be felt long after it is over.
I thank our witnesses for being here today, and yield to the
Ranking Member, Dr. Foxx, for the purpose of an opening statement.
______
Ms. Foxx. Thank you, Chairman Scott.
I want to thank our witnesses also for being here today,
and I want to particularly recognize, as a former teacher, the
teachers and schools for their herculean work this spring to
stand up learning distance mechanisms for students and in some
cases doing so almost overnight.
Educators at all levels should be celebrated for their
dedication in responding to the coronavirus crisis and going
far beyond their normal responsibilities to respond to the
needs of their students and communities. Just as our teachers
are working to overcome the many challenges this global
pandemic poses, this Nation's elected officials must also step
up and do the job they were elected to do. This means working
from D.C. and being physically present, like our founders
intended. That is why Committee Republicans are participating
in today's hearing in person from our hearing room.
The Republican invited witnesses also are with us in the
hearing room. We can and should be at work here in Washington,
and I urge my Democrat colleagues to make that a priority
moving forward.
The coronavirus pandemic has adversely impacted private and
public schools alike. An estimated 94 percent of public and
private schools closed this spring impacting approximately 97
percent of the country's students. All students, including
those at traditional public schools, charter schools, and
private schools, should have access to the tools they need for
lifelong success.
That is why Congress responded swiftly and enacted the
CARES Act, which provided more than $30 billion in emergency
education funding for students, schools, institutions, and
States. There has been no evaluation of how $30 billion in
hardworking taxpayer money has been spent, yet here we are with
Democrats pushing those same taxpayers to dole out more of
their hard earned money at a time when many Americans are being
forced to tighten their belts.
Given the ever-evolving threat COVID-19 poses, it would be
irresponsible to rush to throw additional funds at a problem we
don't understand fully. Also, some schools have not yet spent
the funds they received from the CARES Act. Despite these
facts, Democrats are demanding we spend more money. Money is
not a cure-all solution, and it is irresponsible to blindly
throw more money at this situation.
Let's not forget that history has shown that more spending
does not guarantee better outcomes. In fact, per pupil
educational spending has increased significantly over the
years, but high school seniors aren't performing any better
than they were 30 years ago.
Congress must first evaluate the impact of the billions of
dollars in Federal taxpayer education aid already provided
through the CARES Act before rushing to further burden
taxpayers with additional spending. Demanding additional funds
at this time is premature and illogical.
As we continue to monitor the issues students and schools
face, it is within this Committee's jurisdiction to explore
opportunities for long-lasting reforms that will improve the
education system for all families. For example, families
experiences this spring illustrated the inadequacy of the
status quo for providing all students the foundation they need
for lifelong success.
I am looking forward to testimony today about what States
and school districts are learning from the work done this
spring, how they are identifying weaknesses in the educational
offerings provided the students and how they are seeking to
address those weaknesses.
Superintendent Johnson will talk about the need for more
personalized learning so that students' needs can be identified
quickly and instruction can be tailored to ensure each student
is back on the path to success when school resumes.
I hope we hear from others about how they are using these
current challenges to question long-held assumptions. We owe it
to our educators and students to examine this carefully and
legislate with meaningful reform.
I yield back.
[The statement of Ms. Foxx follows:]
Prepared Statement of Hon. Virginia Foxx, Ranking Member, Committee on
Education and Labor
As a former teacher I want to begin by recognizing the teachers and
schools for their herculean work this spring to stand up distance
learning mechanisms for students, and in some cases, doing so almost
overnight. Educators at all levels should be celebrated for their
dedication in responding to the coronavirus crisis and going far beyond
their normal responsibilities to respond to the needs of their students
and communities.
Just as our teachers are working to overcome the many challenges
this global pandemic poses, this nation's elected officials must also
step up and do the job they were elected to do. This means working from
D.C. and being physically present like our Founders intended. That is
why Committee Republicans are participating in today's hearing in
person from our hearing room. The Republican- invited witness is also
with us in the hearing room.
We can and should be at work here in Washington, and I urge my
Democrat colleagues to make that a priority moving forward.
The coronavirus pandemic has adversely impacted private and public
schools alike. An estimated 94 percent of public and private schools
closed this spring, impacting approximately 97 percent of the country's
students. All students, including those at traditional public schools,
charter schools, and private schools, should have access to the tools
they need for lifelong success.
That is why Congress responded swiftly and enacted the CARES Act,
which provided more than $30 billion in emergency education funding to
students, schools, institutions, and states.
There has been no evaluation of how $30 billion in hardworking
taxpayer money has been spent, yet here we are with Democrats pushing
those same taxpayers to dole out more of their hard-earned money at a
time when many Americans are being forced to tighten their belts.
Given the ever-evolving threat COVID-19 poses it would be
irresponsible to rush to throw additional funds at a problem we don't
understand fully. Also, some schools have not yet spent the funds they
received from the CARES Act. Despite these facts, Democrats are
demanding we spend more money.
Money is not a cure-all solution and it is irresponsible to blindly
throw more money at this situation.
Let's not forget that history has shown that more spending doesn't
guarantee better outcomes. In fact, per-pupil education spending has
increased significantly over the years, but high school seniors aren't
performing any better than they were 30 years ago.
Congress must first evaluate the impact of the billions of dollars
in federal taxpayer education aid already provided through the CARES
Act before rushing to further burden taxpayers with additional
spending. Demanding additional funds at this time is premature and
illogical.
As we continue to monitor the issues students and schools face, it
is within this Committee's jurisdiction to explore opportunities for
long-lasting reforms that will improve the education system for all
families. For example, families' experiences this spring illustrated
the inadequacy of the status quo for providing all students the
foundation they need for lifelong success.
I am looking forward to testimony today about what states and
school districts are learning from the work done this spring, how they
are identifying weaknesses in the educational offerings provided to
students, and how they are seeking to address those weaknesses.
Superintendent Johnson will talk about the need for more personalized
learning so that students' needs can be identified quickly, and
instruction that can be tailored to ensure each student is back on the
path to success when school resumes. I hope we hear from others about
how they are using these current challenges to question long-held
assumptions. We owe it to our educators and students to examine this
carefully and legislate with meaningful reform.
______
Chairman Scott. Thank you, Dr. Foxx.
And all other Members who wish to introduce written
statements into the record may do so by submitting them to the
Committee Clerk electronically in Microsoft Word format by
Monday, June 29, by 5:00 p.m.
I will now introduce our witnesses.
Dr. Michael Leachman, Vice President of State Fiscal Policy
at the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities. He directs the
center's State policy research, overseeing analysis of State
policy needs, how Federal policy decisions affect States and
State policy choices and improve equity and boost opportunity.
Becky Pringle is vice President of the National Education
Association, the Nation's largest labor union and professional
association for educators. Ms. Pringle served as a middle
school teacher in science for 31 years. She has received
numerous awards for her commitment to education equity,
received her bachelor of science degree in elementary education
from the University of Pittsburgh, master's degree in education
from Pennsylvania State University.
I now yield to the Ranking Member, Dr. Foxx, to introduce
Mr. Johnson.
Ms. Foxx. Thank you again, Mr. Chairman.
I am thrilled to have my home State superintendent with us
today. I have known Mark for several years, and he has done an
incredible job at North Carolina. Mark was elected North
Carolina State Superintendent in 2016. He has been involved in
education in a variety of roles, including as a teacher at West
Charlotte High School in Charlotte, North Carolina, and as a
member of the Winston-Salem/Forsyth County School Board.
I thank Mark for being here today and look forward to his
testimony. I think Mark's experience leading our State through
these challenges will be helpful for our members.
I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you, Dr. Foxx.
Our fourth witness, Eric Gordon, was appointed Chief
Executive Officer of the Cleveland Metropolitan School District
in June 2011 after serve as the District's Chief Academic
Officer for four years. He serves as a member of the Executive
Committee for the Board of Directors for the Council of Great
Cities Schools. Mr. Gordon owns a bachelor's degree in science
in secondary mathematics education and driver education, and a
master's degree in education administration and supervision
from Bowling Green State University.
I appreciate the witnesses for participating today and look
forward to your testimony. Let me remind the witnesses that we
have read your written statements and they will appear in full
in the hearing record.
Pursuant to Committee Rule 7(d) and Committee practice,
each speaker is asked to limit your oral presentation to a 5
minute summary of your written testimony. Let me remind the
witnesses that pursuant to the Code, it is illegally to
knowingly and willfully testify--falsify any statement, any
representation, or otherwise conceal or cover up material facts
when presenting to Congress.
During your testimony staff will keep track of your time
and use a chime to signal--they will use a short chime when
there is 1 minute left in your 5 minutes and a longer chime
when time is up. Please be attentive to the time and wrap up
when your time is over and then remute your system.
If anyone is experiencing technical difficulties during
your testimony or later in the hearing, you should stay
connected on the platform and make sure you are muted with your
mute button highlighted in red and use your phone to
immediately call the committee's IT director whose number has
been provided for you.
We will let all of our witnesses make their presentations
before we move to member questions. When answering a question,
please remember to unmute your system.
I will first recognize Dr. Leachman for 5 minutes.
STATEMENT OF MICHAEL LEACHMAN, Ph.D., VICE PRESIDENT FOR STATE
FISCAL POLICY CENTER ON BUDGET AND POLICY PRIORITIES,
WASHINGTON, D.C.
Mr. Leachman. Chairman Scott, Ranking Member Foxx, and
distinguished members of the Committee, thank you for the
opportunity to testify today.
I am Michael Leachman, Vice President for State Fiscal
Policy of the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, a
nonpartisan research and policy institute.
The COVID-19 pandemic has created an extraordinary,
unanticipated State fiscal crisis. States rely on sales and
income taxes for 70 percent of their tax revenue, and with so
many businesses closed and so many people laid off, these
revenues have fallen off the table. Based on history and the
economic projections from the Congressional Budget Office and
the Federal Reserve, we project total State shortfalls of $615
billion over the next three State fiscal years.
It is hard to exaggerate the magnitude of this crisis. The
shortfalls that States will face in the upcoming fiscal year
alone far exceed even the worst year of the great recession of
a decade ago. Federal aid provided so far, while helpful, is
much too small to allow States to avoid laying off teachers and
other workers and taking other steps that would worsen the
recession and delay recovery. States can use this aid to close
roughly a hundred billion dollars of their budget gaps. Even
with that aid and with all of the States' rainy day funds, they
would still fall some $440 billion short.
These estimates do not include States added costs due
directly to the COVID-19 virus. School districts, for example,
face substantial unanticipated costs, including costs for
distance learning and expanded learning time to offset the
learning loss caused by school closures.
Further, our shortfall estimates are for States only. As
you know schools also depend heavily on revenue raised by
school districts and other local government entities, and their
revenues are falling, too. Unless States and school districts
receive much more in Federal aid, they will lay off more and
more teachers and other workers and cut spending in other ways
that would further weaken the economy and delay the recovery.
When States last faced a budget crisis in the great
recession a decade ago, emergency Federal aid closed only about
one-quarter of State budget shortfalls, and school districts
have never recovered from the layoffs they imposed back then.
When COVID-19 hit earlier this year, schools employed
77,000 fewer teachers and other workers than they did before
the great recession took hold, even though they were teaching 1
1/2 million more children. These funding cuts and layoffs hurt
our kids, and that hurts our future. They drove down test
scores and college attendance rates, and the impact was
particularly damaging for low-income students and students of
color, adding to the substantial structural barriers these
children must overcome.
Federal aid provided so far includes just $13 billion in
direct aid for K-12 schools. That is far too little to meet the
extreme fiscal challenges that schools face. Roughly $60
billion in additional direct aid for schools in the Heroes Act
is a significant step in the right direction, but on its own,
it is not enough. States and localities could use other forms
of aid in the Act to protect schools, but it is not certain
that they will, and as such, we would support a significant
increase in the amount of direct aid for schools in the final
package.
Besides aid for schools, States will need other forms of
fiscal relief to avoid harmful layoffs, other cuts, and tax
increases. Raising the Federal Medicaid matching rate that was
under the Heroes Act is a particularly effective form of broad
State fiscal relief. It can be delivered quickly and, by
providing direct savings to States, raising the matching rate,
freeze up funds that they can reallocate to protect schools and
other fundamental public services.
An adequate aid package will also need to include, direct
flexible grants to States and localities like those in the
Heroes Act. States and localities should have the flexibility
to use these grants to make up for revenues lost during the
pandemic. That revenue loss is the primary threat to school
funding.
Finally, the best way to deliver aid during economic
downturns is through permanent automatic stabilizers that
trigger--that trigger on based on economic indicators that
adjust depending on the state of the economy, ending sooner if
the economy recovers quickly, but remaining in place as long as
needed if the recovery is unexpectedly slow.
Thank you again for want opportunity to testify, and I will
be happy to take questions when the time is--when that is time.
[The statement of Mr. Leachman follows:]
[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
Ms. Pringle?
You have to unmute.
STATEMENT OF REBECCA PRINGLE, VICE PRESIDENT, NATIONAL
EDUCATION ASSOCIATION, WASHINGTON, DC
Ms. Pringle. Thank you, Chairman Scott, Ranking Member
Foxx, and members of the committee. My name is Becky Pringle,
and I am a science teacher from Pennsylvania and Vice President
of the National Education Association.
As NEA's vice president, I am honored to represent more
than 3 million teachers, education support professionals, and
specialized staff who share the belief that all students in our
public schools, no matter where they live or their race or
ethnicity or family income, should have an education that
prepares them to live into their brilliance. That is our fight,
and it is a privilege to wage it.
The COVID-19 pandemic has deepened the disparities that
already existed and prompted budget cuts that will devastate
students, especially in Black and Brown, Native, and rural
communities. The millions of students who lack access or
connective devices were faced with this digital divide that
denied them the opportunity to access remote instruction so
they could continue their learning at home.
I met with educators in North Carolina. They talked to me
about starting the school year knowing they had to not only
determine where their students were academically, but they
worried about meeting the emotional needs of their students who
they knew were suffering from anxiety and fear because of
uncertainty and tragic losses.
Layered on top of the pandemic is the crisis we face with
policing in Black and Brown communities. We were not the only
ones who witnessed the brutal murder of George Floyd. Our
children were watching. Some have experienced themselves or
seen their friends and loved ones subjected to racial
profiling, humiliating and unlawful detention, or worse.
NEA members are so proud to see their students demanding
justice for Black lives, but everything our students are seeing
and feeling requires that educators are able to use trauma,
inform practices as they engage with their students. That means
we need enough teachers, counselors, and other educators to
nurture every student.
The bottom line is that districts must spend more, not
less, especially if we are to reopen schools safely, by
providing protective equipment for students and staff and
retrofitting classrooms and other spaces for social distancing.
This task is more difficult because our school buildings on
average are over 40 years old. The Rebuild America's Schools
Act begins to tackle many long-standing infrastructure needs,
but so much more must be done to keep our students safe.
No doubt these investments will be a major challenge,
especially in districts that never recovered from the 2008
recession. Cutbacks from that recession caused 300,000
educators to lose their jobs. Already nearly 500,000 public
education jobs have been lost because of the pandemic. And
according to NEA's analysis, nearly 2 million educators could
lose their jobs over the next three years. This will be
devastating for students in schools that already are
underresourced. These students desperately need to return to
public schools with the resources to help them recover and
thrive.
NEA has been listening to our members and allies and
recently released reopening guidance, called all hands on deck,
because we know reopening schools is also in the best interests
of our Nation. But those decisions must be rooted in health and
safety with input from educators who know the names of their
students, professionals who have the experience to make good
teaching and learning decisions, and they need the funding to
reopen schools in the right way.
That is why the NEA supports the Heroes Act because it
includes $902 billion in direct relief for State and local
governments and $900 billion in additional revenue for
education.
We thank the House for boldly taking action to pass the
Heroes Act, and we call on Mitch McConnell and the Senate to
demonstrate they care about the education of all students.
Schools are already planning for the upcoming year, and they
need that funding now.
My 30 years of experience makes me think and believe that
we can learn from this moment, that we can finally provide the
resources and support so every one of our students has access
and opportunity. NEA members are an optimistic bunch. As
educators it is our job requirement.
We know we can address the challenges not only of COVID-19
but we can and we must address the equity challenges that have
plagued our schools forever. We stand ready to work with our
members and to bring about the new day our students deserve.
Thank you.
[The statement of Ms. Pringle follows:]
[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
Mr. Johnson.
STATEMENT OF MARK JOHNSON, SUPERINTENDENT OF PUBLIC
INSTRUCTION, NORTH CAROLINA DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC INSTRUCTION,
RALEIGH, NC
Mr. Johnson. Good afternoon, Chairman Scott, Ranking Member
Foxx, and members of the Committee.
I am State Superintendent Mark Johnson. It is my honor and
privilege to serve the students, educators, and citizens of
North Carolina. Thank you for the opportunity to take part in
this hearing today, and thank you all for your swift,
bipartisan efforts to enact the CARES Act in order to use
Federal taxpayer dollars to support our citizens, our
communities, and our schools during this unprecedented
pandemic.
Together we have faced the unbelievable challenges of
COVID-19. This virus has threatened our health, our economy,
our students' education, and even our way of life. Students,
educators, parents, and caretakers across North Carolina and
the Nation have made difficult sacrifices to confront this
crisis, and it has shown that we have the resilience to
overcome it. States ensure that child nutrition services
continued, which meant keeping our meal services available no
matter the obstacle. Schools kept cafeterias open, creating
grab-and-go locations, and even delivered meals using school
busses and the mail. In North Carolina, we have served over 30
million meals during this crisis.
States also led the switch to remote learning practically
overnight. North Carolina is a leader in digital education
strategies, but even as advanced and fortunate as we are, no
State was ready for the switch from 0 percent remote learning
to 100 percent remote learning over a weekend.
Teachers and school leaders connected students where they
could, and if they couldn't, assignments were delivered by
school bus, over the phone, and even through the United States
Postal Service. Now we are able to switch from being reactive
to being proactive, and the challenges we will face going into
next school year will actually put on full display the
resilience of students, parents, and educators. We should all
be focused not just on coming back strong, but coming out of
this pandemic stronger.
Thank you for helping those students of North Carolina with
Federal taxpayer funds. We will use these funds to protect the
health and safety of students and educators, and we will also
use these funds to help innovate and spread strategies and
tools that will truly help every child work hard in school and
reach their American dream.
For example, we are investing in technology, strong digital
curriculum options, and professional development for teachers.
Even before this unparalleled moment in our history, North
Carolina was making the monumental shift in education to
empower teachers with tools that support personalized learning
for all students.
Now this innovation is more important than ever. We are
going to see a significant loss of learning as a result of this
crisis. When students return in the fall, we will need to help
all students catch up; but we don't have to do that with one
size fits all strategy. The technology in curriculum options we
are purchasing can also help teachers more easily meet students
at their abilities and help students catch up at their own
pace.
Make no mistake, teachers have been working hard for
decades to individualize education for students, and this is
not the remote learning that we have endured the past few
months. The technology we are pushing for North Carolina will
be another tool for teachers to help students.
Our youngest students can use this technology to catch up
on their reading skills that they need to be successful for the
rest of school and in life, and our older students can use this
technology to discover the pathways to success that they decide
work best for them, whether that is a high-valued credential,
military service, or a degree from a community college or a 4-
year institution.
The challenges facing us next school year are enormous, but
we must also use this moment to reach every single student with
resources and strategies that help them work hard in school and
succeed.
In North Carolina we have a State toast. We say that our
State is where the weak grow strong and the strong grow great.
Our Nation is enduring and rising above unprecedented
challenges. We are strong. Let's grow great.
Thank you.
[The statement of Mr. Johnson follows:]
[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
And Mr. Gordon.
STATEMENT OF ERIC GORDON, CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER, CLEVELAND
METROPOLITAN SCHOOL DISTRICT, CLEVELAND, OH
Mr. Gordon. Good afternoon, Chairman Scott, Ranking Member
Foxx, and Members of the Education and Labor Committee.
My name is Eric Gordon. I am the Chief Executive Officer of
the Cleveland Metropolitan School District in Cleveland, Ohio.
I am also proud to serve as the co-chair of the Ohio Urban 8
Coalition and as Chair of the Council of the Great Cities
Schools. The Cleveland Metropolitan School District is the
second largest school district in Ohio with an enrollment of
nearly 38,000 students.
With over 42 percent of our children living below the
poverty line, Cleveland has the highest child poverty rate of
any major city in the country. With a median household income
of just over $26,000, Cleveland residents often lack basic
necessities considered essential to today's America.
Our school community is 86 percent children of color. Over
17 percent of our students are English language learners, and
nearly a quarter of our students are identified for special
education services. Nearly 5 percent of our students, over
1,900 students, are homeless on any given day.
Despite these and other inequities, CMSD has gone from
being the worst performing school district in Ohio to becoming
one of Ohio's fastest improving school districts. On March 13,
Ohio Governor Mike DeWine ordered the necessary closing of Ohio
schools due to the COVID-19 public health emergency. This had a
significant impact on students across Ohio.
While my peers in more affluent districts in Ohio focused
on switching from classroom to online instruction, the reality
is that more than 40 percent of our families had no reliable
access to high-speed internet in their homes and that 68
percent of our families had no device other than a Smartphone
to even access that internet.
So CMSD operated 22 grab-and-go meal sites. We also
established homework hotlines, delivered content that could be
accessed by cellphone, like posting lessons on Instagram,
created weekly grade level learning packages, along with
supplemental packages to support students with disabilities,
and English language learners, and to support social and
emotional health which we then mailed to each child's home.
We created lessons broadcasts on local TV stations and
established social emotional health hotlines for those who were
experiencing high stress, feelings of isolation, or signs of
neglect.
Over the shutdown period, we froze spending across the
district to direct all available funds towards the purchase and
distribution of over 9,000 hot spots with a 1-year subscription
to the internet and over 16,000 devices. Those devices and hot
spots which are now in place and will remain distributed
throughout the summer ensure that my families are now able to
apply for unemployment, apply for jobs, to access medical care
through telehealth and to access other essential supports
afforded to most Americans.
The inequities my families faced during this public health
emergency have existed in Cleveland and in communities across
the country for decades, and it is important to note that these
inequities are most acute in communities of color.
Addressing these needs and preparing to return to school to
both address nine weeks of lost learning and to create a more
fair, just, and good system of personalized mastery learning
must also be done within the context of the looming budget
crisis brought on by the economic recession.
In my district, we are facing the very real threat of
losing up to $127 million in State and local revenue in the
year ahead. That is nearly 25 percent of my district's net
operating budget.
If this worst case scenario were to occur, I will have no
choice but to make deep devastating cuts to my district this
winter and implement those cuts for the second semester of the
school year, essentially wiping out the 10 years of growth my
team and I have generated in Cleveland. I have already received
a $5.6 million budget cut from the State of Ohio.
I urge Congress to provide the necessary resources to keep
our Nation's school districts intact during the economic crisis
that arose from this public health emergency. While this
includes resources contemplated in the Heroes Act and future
Stimulus and Stabilization Acts, this would also include
additional resources in the years ahead to ensure adequate
funding for America's most vulnerable children.
Including Title I, A, disadvantaged and at-risk youth;
Title I, D for children who have been the victims of neglect;
Title III for immigrant children; IDEA Part B for students with
learning disabilities; and the McKinney-Vento Act for homeless
and foster youth as school districts like mine work to recover
the learning time that was lost for the most fragile among our
youth.
Chairman Scott, Ranking Member Foxx, and members of the
Education and Labor Committee, on behalf of the 38,000 students
of the Cleveland Metropolitan School District who I have the
privilege of serving, along with the 192,000 students of the
Ohio Urban 8 Coalition, and the 8.2 million students of the
Council of the Great Cities Schools, thank you for letting me
be with you today.
Thank you.
[The statement of Mr. Gordon follows:]
[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Chairman Scott. Thank you. And I thank all of our witnesses
for your testimony.
And now we will begin with questions.
I will go last and start with the gentlelady from
California, Mrs. Davis.
Mrs. Davis. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
And thank you to our witnesses. I know all of you feel so
strongly about what we are about to face here. It is really
going to be as great a crisis as our schools have experienced,
and I think the numbers show that.
I wonder--you know, we all maybe need to take our own test
now and then, and I wonder if you could respond. I mean, is it
possible for us to open the schools if we cannot avoid
personnel cuts, if we cannot avoid layoffs of teachers?
Is it possible for us to open up our schools if we cannot
compensate for learning loss, obviously, particularly in
reading and math? And is it possible for us to open our schools
if we cannot keep our students safe?
Now, if we are struggling with answering those questions,
then we really have a very difficult decision to make with, as
you have all expressed, I believe, that the increased costs
that we are going to be seeing range somewhere, I think, in 20
percent, at least they certainly do for California and for San
Diego City schools.
So I guess the question then is, if that is true and we are
not able to reach a level where we are comfortable with any of
those major three issues, what do we do? Where is it that we
are going to be able to at least reach an appropriate level of
service if we can't do that?
I wonder--perhaps, Mr. Gordon, you were just speaking,
where do you go from there? And I want you to address, as you
have done, the learning loss particularly for our most
vulnerable students. If we can't provide the basics for each
and every student in our school, how are we going to be able to
do that? And does that mean having more students coming into
school in those areas, longer time in school? What is it--what
are you thinking about in Cleveland?
Mr. Gordon. Thank you to the Chairman. To the
Congresswoman, thank you for the question.
As I provided in my written testimony, I think that this is
both a crisis to face but an opportunity in education to really
reinvent our systems of delivery of learning. And much like my
colleague, Mr. Johnson, I am an advocate for moving to a very
much personalized learning that is driven by mastery of content
and not simply seat time.
In Ohio, we are not likely going to be able to bring all
children back at exactly the same time for the whole school day
because of the very strict public health guidance we have seen
so far. So this means we are going to have to have multiple
scenarios of who we can bring back and for how much time, and
school districts are talking about things like A days and B
days where we split classes in half, or a.m.-p.m. kinds of
shifts, Monday-Tuesday class, meeting Wednesday, Thursday-
Friday class. I am challenging my team to think even more
nimbly and ask ourselves the question who are those children
who need the most direct time with teachers? That would be
students with disabilities, English learners, younger children,
perhaps our foster and homeless.
And then who can be more self-sufficient in a proactive,
high-quality learning environment that can be partially remote?
That does require keeping our personnel intact. If I have to
sustain a quarter of my budget cut, that will necessarily
result in huge layoffs like we experienced in 2010 where we
closed 23 school buildings and laid off 700 teachers all in a
single moment.
And so, you know, we do--will we open? We have to. But will
it be a high-quality learning system? That will be dependent
upon whether we are able to keep educators intact.
Mrs. Davis. Thank you. I believe my time is up.
Thank you.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
Dr. Foxx, do you want to go now?
Ms. Foxx. Yes, sir. I will go ahead and ask my questions
now.
Chairman Scott. The gentlelady, the ranking member is
recognized for 5 minutes.
Ms. Foxx. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Superintendent Johnson, you spoke in your testimony about
some of the ways CARES Act money is being spent or that you
expect CARES Act money to be spent. What is the status of the
CARES Act money in North Carolina?
Mr. Johnson. Thank you, Representative Foxx.
The CARES Act funding in North Carolina, as you know, came
through multiple sources. The $95 million that is in the hands
of the Governor, there has been no decision yet by the Governor
on how that will support education.
The schools that will receive a pot of about $400 million,
the North Carolina State Board of Education has decided to hold
back the maximum amount, $40 million, to address equity issues
across North Carolina, but that has not been determined yet
what exactly that money will be used for.
The $350, roughly, million that have been left after that
for schools, that has now--all the application process has been
done, but school districts have not started drawing down on
that money yet. And, of course, there is the large sum that
went to the North Carolina General Assembly and Governor. They
have dedicated $230 million of those funds to address summer
learning loss, help with connectivity, and device purchases.
But, again, we have not spent that money yet.
There was also on top of that, at the very beginning of
this crisis, $50 million from State funds that was repurposed
for school districts to address the reactive measures of the
crisis, and we have not yet spent all of those funds yet
either. So we are in a very proactive phase right now with our
schools in North Carolina.
Ms. Foxx. Thank you, Superintendent Johnson.
I can't imagine anyone in your shoes would turn down more
Federal taxpayer funding from America's taxpayers. However, in
light of the fact that the overwhelming majority of CARES Act
money has not been spent, is now the right time to spend
billions more in taxpayer funds and what steps do you think are
needed before those decisions are made and what factors should
Congress consider before determining if another round of aid is
needed?
Mr. Johnson. Thank you, Representative Foxx.
I would say, as a citizen and educator, that it is
important for Congress to balance the fact that there is a lot
of debt being taken out, but also there are a lot of needs out
there across the Nation.
I would encourage Congress to work with the State chief
officers. In North Carolina, we are still waiting on what the
plan will be for reentering school. Our Governor has set out
potential plans, but we have not made a firm decision on
whether or not we are going to have students back in school or
remote learning. The metrics aren't going in the right
direction in North Carolina.
Also, we don't have a State budget yet. So while we are
concerned about budget cuts, just like everyone else, we do not
know exactly what those details will be just yet. And as
mentioned earlier, we are being very proactive. We are very
fortunate we are not being reactive with our CARES Act funding.
I would definitely encourage Congress to see where that
money is spent in North Carolina, as I discussed in my opening
testimony, focus on, of course, the health and safety of
students but also using this moment, this opportunity, to
transform how we meet every student at their ability level and
help them proceed and excel at their own pace.
Ms. Foxx. Thank you.
One more question, Superintendent Johnson. There has been
concern expressed from some about the Federal Department of
Education's interpretation of the CARES Act equitable services
provision. Without getting into the weeds of this debate, do
you believe that each education sector, traditional public
schools, charter schools, and private schools, deserve
equitable support and why?
Mr. Johnson. The short answer would be yes. This is an
unprecedented crisis that is affecting everyone, and Congress
actually took those steps with the stimulus check. People who
lost their jobs and needed help paying bills, they got a
stimulus check; but also we had people who retired and didn't
have income, they got a stimulus check as well.
I think it is important that, you know, if Congress wants
to help every citizen, that is what they do. Not to get into
the weeds of the debate, but it is Congress' job to be in
charge of the purse strings, and I encourage the General
Assembly, our legislative branch in North Carolina, to be clear
on their intent and really be sure that they direct where they
want the funding to go and not delegate too much power to the
administrative branches.
Ms. Foxx. Well, thank you.
I am going to end with a comment, not exactly a direct
question to you; but if you agree with me, I would appreciate,
or disagree, you can say.
I am a student of the Constitution, and I have read it
many, many times, and I fail to find the word ``education'' in
there. Can you show me if you found that as a reason to--a
responsibility of the Federal Government?
Mr. Johnson. Educators all over the Nation appreciate any
funding that comes from the Federal Government; but we also
appreciate not putting a lot of strings attached to it. So we
appreciate the funding that comes.
It is in our Constitution in North Carolina; but you are
correct, I don't believe it is in the Constitution for the
United States.
But we appreciate the support. Thank you.
Ms. Foxx. Thank you.
I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
Mr. Grijalva.
Mr. Grijalva. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
A couple of questions for Dr. Leachman; but a couple of
things. You know, I think we are in a situation now that is
unprecedented, and the threat to the future of public education
is real, it is severe, and it is upon us.
And it is not a question of throwing money at a problem,
and it is not a question of long-held assumptions being the
rule of the day. But I think it is important that as we go
forward talking about the Heroes Act and talking about the
support that is needed at a State level but in particular with
our public schools that we recognize that there is a legacy, a
systemic legacy, preexisting conditions in public education,
and those conditions revolve around the issue of inequity.
They revolve around the issue of income and the
manifestations of those have been kids with disabilities,
English learners, poor kids, digital divide, facilities
conditions, class size, and the list goes on.
And I mention that because I think that the pandemic and
the response to the pandemic has exposed that even more so in
front of us, and so I think the role of the government is
twofold.
To respond to this pandemic and to supplement both the
public school systems and public education in our country so
that the issue, the inequities that we know are there that are
being agreed as we talk don't become the permanent legacy of
this pandemic, both the inequities becoming permanent and the
efforts to try to do something about them. So, you know, that
is a priority. It should be a priority for this Committee to
make sure that all kids get that.
Mr. Leachman, one of the things, you know, is that all
States do things differently, you know, and not all States are
proponents of public education in terms of their
administration, so whoever happens to be the governor.
But given that, and given the fact that, you know, can the
States afford regardless for the Federal Government to take
kind of a-wait-and-see approach to State and local fiscal
relief and the urgency for that Federal relief, why is it a
priority? And try to give your comments on that question.
Mr. Leachman. Thank you, Congressman.
No, I think it is really--this is very urgent that Congress
act. States already are starting to cut their education
budgets.
In Georgia they have--already the Governor and legislative
leadership have called for substantial cuts across the board
for the upcoming fiscal year, which starts July 1, in just a
couple of weeks.
In Ohio the governor has asked for agencies to submit 20
percent cut budgets and has already implemented cuts from the
current fiscal year.
States and localities have already furloughed or laid off
about 1.5 million workers. And with their fiscal year beginning
very soon, States are going to be making decisions that will
result in teachers and other education workers being laid off
at just the wrong time, when--it is never a good time, but when
the economy is especially weak, the last thing we want is more
layoffs.
So, in addition, to the impact on schools and kids, there
is a full affect on the economy at a very important time.
Mr. Grijalva. Arizona is now one of the top States, if not
the top State, in terms of the uptick in mortality, infection,
and spread of the pandemic. And in the middle of this, our
Governor is saying that the schools will be open in a month or
less.
And the cost attendant to doing that right and protecting
kids and staff, as you mentioned, that is not included in the
overall need that schools are going to have in order to at
least be held harmless for the coming school year, financially
speaking.
So any response to that?
Mr. Leachman. Congressman, that is an excellent point.
The revenue loss here that States are experiencing is
unprecedented. It is an extraordinary fiscal crisis, and then
on top of that, we have schools having to deal with substantial
new costs to try to open safely.
Mr. Grijalva. Thank you.
I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. Let's see. The gentleman from
Tennessee, Dr. Roe?
The gentleman from Pennsylvania, Mr. Thompson?
Mr. Thompson. Chairman, thank you so much. Chairman and
Republican Leader Foxx, I really appreciate this. This is a
movement towards getting--truly getting back to work and
performing our duties and responsibilities. The needs of the
Nation didn't stop, and they don't stop because of any pandemic
or crisis or emergency. In fact, it probably intensifies the
need for our work thanks to the members of the panel.
Superintendent Johnson, I want to thank you for making time
today to join us today at the hearing. The spread of COVID-19
has caused significant disruption to educators and students
across the country. We all know that. An estimated 124,000
public and private schools closed this spring, including more
than 3,000 schools in my home State, the commonwealth of
Pennsylvania.
Due to this pandemic, Congress responded swiftly, enacted
the CARES Act, which delivered more than $13 billion dollars in
formally funding directly to States and school districts to
help--yep? I went down? I don't know. No, I am still there.
Thanks, Greg.
--in formally funding directly to States and school
districts to help students respond to the coronavirus-related
needs. I represent Pennsylvania's 15th Congressional District.
It covers 14 counties and nearly 25 percent of the land mass in
Pennsylvania. During the outbreak, the number one issue I
continually heard from my school districts, a very rural
district in nature obviously, is a lack of broadband and
technology access.
Now, these school districts have been creative on how they
address these connectivity issues, like setting up drive-by Wi-
Fi hotspots near school parking lots, and quite frankly, local
libraries, different places. However, the need for improved
broadband service to these areas is absolutely long overdue.
According to the census data, roughly 15 percent of the
U.S. households with school-age children do not have high-speed
internet connection at home. Either don't have it at all, or
quite frankly, it is even larger than that. They don't have
sufficient broadband to support the online learning platforms.
And that number is much higher in my district because I work
with all of my school districts throughout this time. It is
unacceptable.
So Mr. Johnson, in your testimony, you touched briefly on
this. Is North Carolina experiencing similar issues with access
to broadband technology, and if so, how are your school
districts addressing the problem?
Mr. Johnson. Thank you Representative.
Yes, I believe every State is facing this same issue right
now, including North Carolina. We were actually the first State
in the Nation to connect every single classroom to high speed,
wireless internet, which is a monumental task and a truly
amazing accomplishment for our education system. But that does
not help when students in rural North Carolina or students in
urban North Carolina don't have that broadband connection.
We have immediately addressed this by making sure that we
put money into hotspot devices and innovations that will help
get wireless internet to students in rural communities. We
also--we use school buses to get assignments, the phone, mail.
But this is absolutely something that we would appreciate
Congress very much helping with and looking at, how do we make
sure that we innovate and get that broadband access to every
student. Because we hope to be back in schools in North
Carolina, but there is the chance that we will be back in
remote learning like other States.
Mr. Thompson. Right. Well, I would just comment briefly and
then to a quick question. My comment is on, I am just so
appreciative of USDA and what they have done with the, you
know, providing flexibility and waivers to our National School
Lunch Program. I have participated personally with that, with
the distribution of meals, and you know--and the team work and
the collaboration between the community and the schools.
My final question though for you, Mr. Johnson, as I talked
with my school districts, as early--as late as this morning on
a county advisory committee meetings that I routinely have as
school board member, the issues most of our schools are looking
at are the transportation costs, you know, if there is
implications given for social distancing, you know, especially
in rural areas, they would have a tremendous amount of
transportation.
And North Carolina is a lot--geographically a lot like
Pennsylvania. Any quick thoughts on what you are anticipating
in terms of transportation challenges come fall?
Mr. Johnson. It will absolutely be a challenge if social
distancing is required in our schools. Again, our governor has
set out three different plans. We hope to be under the plan
that allows us to get as many students back as safely as
possible, but if we are required to have 50 percent capacity on
school buses and social distancing on school buses, we will be
in the same situation. It will be very difficult.
We will probably come to look for more waivers and more
help when it comes to getting more buses on the road to run
more routes, or as has been mentioned, the very difficult
reality of, we might switch to A days and B days and actually
have to have some students stay at home one day while other
students go to school and then they switch, but we know that is
going to be a huge challenge for our communities as well.
Mr. Thompson. Thank you, Chairman.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
The gentleman from Connecticut, Mr. Courtney?
Mr. Courtney. Great. Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman and to
the witnesses for, you know, this hearing today which is really
extremely urgent. And I am actually speaking to you from
Norwich, Connecticut, where my district office is. It is a
community of about 42,000 people. A couple of nights ago, the
Board of Education just voted to eliminate 45 positions in the
K-through-12 system, which again is a huge hit in terms of just
the size of the workforce there. Again, it is a relatively
small community.
And the superintendent, when they were talking about her,
she was quoted in the paper saying, at the end of the day, this
is about revenue and the lack thereof, which is, again,
precisely the problem which the coronavirus recession has
created.
By the way, Connecticut has already distributed the Title 1
CARES Act funding, and Norwich is a Title 1 area here. Again,
it was not enough to stop these layoffs. So Ms. Pringle, I just
wanted to ask you, I mean, we are obviously weeks away from the
schools reopening, and I know there is a lot of work being done
about trying to plan for that. Reducing staff is really, isn't
it the exact opposite of where we should be headed if we are
trying to reduce class size and accommodate social distancing
which CDC and all the public health officials are advising? Is
that correct?
Is she still there?
Ms. Pringle. You know, I have been doing enough of these
virtual calls and I know to unmute, but--thank you so much,
Congressman Courtney, for that question.
I actually got a chance to talk with quite a few of your
educators there in Connecticut last week, and you are
absolutely correct. Without that additional funding, we know
that other school districts, like the one you just talked
about, will absolutely have to lay off hundreds and hundreds of
educators.
Teachers, our support staff who nurture our students, bus
drivers, we just heard that we will need more of those. We know
that we cannot open our schools safely without these additional
funds.
So imagine that we are sending our students back to school,
and we are all saying that we want them to go back safely, but
we are cutting--already have cut over 500,000 education jobs.
And more are coming. Because we know that our States will be
suffering, and we have already been down this road before. In
2008, what got cut first? Education. Education jobs, services
for our students. Our students with special needs, in
particular, need that additional assistance.
So for us to think that we are going to send our students
back to school safely and provide them with the quality
education that we believe they all deserve, we know that cannot
happen. So we need the Senate to act right now. You know, I
heard others say that, you know, some districts haven't started
spending the money yet. Well, I would ask questions about why
that didn't happen. I am so glad to hear you talk about yours,
saying that we are already putting that money to good use.
Our educators are planning right now, as they should. We
always do. By the time we are finishing school, we are starting
to plan for the next year, before we even leave school. In
June, usually. So they are already making plans.
If we know that we are going to aim to have our students
come back to school safely, we have to change a lot of things.
And so we are having those conversations right now.
If we don't know the amount of money that we are going to
get to open our schools safely, if we don't know the changes we
are going to have to make, or how we are going to provide the
PPE for our students and our educators, then we can't do the
kind of planning that is absolutely necessary so our students
have what they need and what they deserve.
Mr. Courtney. Well, thank you for that answer because the
wait-and-see sort of approach which we have heard articulated
here today and seems to still be in the Senate, obviously, you
know, the opening of schools is happening really right now in
terms of certainly the planning.
Mr. Leachman, real quick, the HEROES Act provided local
aid, as well as State assistance, and again it targeted about
half of that locally to communities of 50,000 or less, which
normally kind of--it gets to the end--they get, kind of, pushed
to the end of the buffet line. I mean, those communities in
particular because they have no commercial tax space in most
instances, they really need to get this direct assistance, and
as Ms. Pringle said, sooner rather than later. Isn't that
correct?
Mr. Leachman. Yes, absolutely. States depend heavily on
income and sales taxes, so their revenues have fallen off the
table. But many localities depend heavily on sales taxes as
well, and of course with--they are having similar kind of
effects in that regard. So I share your concern for those
communities as well.
Mr. Courtney. Great. Thank you.
Mr. Chairman, this morning's Washington Post had an
article, Ripple Effects of Downturn Show Pandemic's Early
Economic Toll Was Just the Beginning, by David Lynch. I would
ask to submit it into the record, which again sort of just
shows how we are really at the beginning of the ripple effect,
and that is why we got to get it out there.
With that, I yield back.
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Chairman Scott. Thank you.
The gentleman from Michigan, Mr. Walberg?
The gentleman from Michigan, Mr. Walberg?
The gentleman from Kentucky, Mr. Guthrie?
Mr. Guthrie. Okay. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. You got that--okay, thanks so much.
Just a couple of questions, and I think we are kind of
hitting the same themes because they are kind of equivalent of
what everybody else, I think, we could say maybe across the
aisle on both sides that we are all concerned about the same
things. And one is what we call the summer loss.
I remember I was in grad school. I attended a talk or a
presentation on education by a gentleman named Benno Schmidt,
who had been President of Yale. I remember it striking me that
he said that one of the correlation studies they have is the
length of the summer--the length of the summer in terms of
student performance. And essentially in Kentucky, and I think
across most of the country, we have essentially had students
out since spring break. So we have kind of added to that.
And so it gets to two things. One, to Mr. Johnson--and I
think, Mr. Gordon, I would be interested in hearing you as
well--is the quality of the time that you have had since you
have gone online or since kids have been out of school, how are
you able to maintain or try to understand the quality of that?
And number two is, I am also on Energy and Commerce, and we
are looking at broadband deployment, and one is getting
broadband to the homes. I have a--one of my county executive's
number one priority was getting broadband into his rural
county, Hancock County, in order to be able to have access. But
I know Mr. Gordon talked earlier--and I appreciate your
presentation--on a city like Cleveland that probably has ample
broadband, but it is not just getting the pipeline to the home,
it is getting the device in the home where people can have
delivery.
So Mr. Johnson, if you would go first about your concern
about the length of the summer and the quality, does school
essentially end? I know that people were set on doing online
classrooms after schools were shut down.
How did you manage the quality of education up until now?
And then access to, as you go forward, because even if you
don't open in the fall, you are not going to have broadband
there at that exact moment, and exact time. How are you going
to manage that moving forward? So Mr. Johnson and Mr. Gordon, I
would be interested in your perspective. Thanks.
Mr. Johnson. Thank you, Representative. I will be brief to
allow time for my colleague as well. It was extremely
challenging to go to remote learning, and teachers have been
amazing in stepping up and making sure they were doing
everything they could for their students. My daughter is a
first grader, now a rising second grader. So we are very
fortunate. We had broadband, we had the device, but even for
families that were well connected, this was still a struggle.
And that doesn't even start for families that were not
connected, didn't have the device, very challenging.
Teachers have done an amazing job, and what we will be
doing is making sure that when we come back to school in the
fall, whatever that is, we will be doing some formative
diagnostic assessments of students to see how much learning
they did lose, and then meet them at their ability levels.
When it comes to connecting the broadband, that is a
challenge that every State and our Nation should take on. And,
yes, we can put on some bandaids of hotspots, been putting
wireless internet on school buses and driving out to rural
North Carolina. That is helping, but it still makes it--it is
still very difficult.
So we would encourage any help and thoughts you all have
around that, and I know that is a concern for many education
chiefs across the Nation. Thank you.
Mr. Guthrie. Thank you.
Mr. Gordon, just the quality of your final half a semester
and then how you are managing broadband going into the fall--or
access going into the fall.
Mr. Gordon. Thank you to the chairman, to the Congressman.
Thank you for the question. We know, because we surveyed our
students from grades 3 through 12, and their parents, as well
as our educators, that the quality was directly related to
whether they had high speed, reliable internet in their home.
Our students told us that those who had routine access were
more effective in completing their work. They were more
confident that they could complete their work. They were more
focused. They spent more of the day in learning, they were less
bored, and they were happier. So we know that there is a direct
line.
Our educators also were able to share that kids who did not
have those, despite all of the things we outlined in our
written testimony, just weren't getting the same learning
experience. We are--and again in my written testimony I have
outlined this--we are working over the next year to create a
nonprofit that exists here in Cleveland to deliver high speed,
reliable internet to every family. And the district is going to
be the customer for the time that they are a member of the
district, so that we can get around hurdles like bad credit or
other things that prevent families from accessing it.
And then like my colleague, we are going to assess where
students are and use this opportunity to be much more
personalized and get away from old constraints like Gregorian
calendars or formal grade 2, grade 3, as opposed to multi-age
group of where children actually are in their learning.
Mr. Guthrie. Thank you very much. I appreciate you guys'
responses and being here today. I appreciate it very much.
Thank you and I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentle lady from Ohio, Ms.
Fudge? Oops.
The gentle lady from Ohio, Ms. Fudge?
The gentleman from Northern Mariana Islands, Mr. Sablan?
Mr. Sablan. Well, yeah, good morning, Mr. Chairman. Thank
you very much for holding this hearing, and thank you to our
witnesses for their testimonies. The Government Accountability
Office recently released a report on the state of public
schools--public school units in the country.
Unfortunately, it confirmed that high poverty school
districts like mine, and across the country, face challenges
funding new school buildings or maintaining existing ones.
A 2013 report by the Army Corps of Engineers found $177
million in deferred maintenance needs in schools in the
Northern Marianas and other insular areas. The conditions of
school campuses and facilities from the Nation is a matter that
will be examined--that will be examined further in a full
committee member briefing I will be leading later this month in
my capacity as chairman of the subcommittee on early childhood,
elementary, and secondary education.
So Mr. Gordon, if I may, given the State of Ohio's budget
cuts and Cleveland's local levy prospects, how confident do you
feel about your city's ability to keep up with healthy schools
for students in the coming years?
Mr. Gordon. Thank you to the chairman, to the Congressman,
for that question. We are in the midst of a school
reconstruction project here in the city that has been going on
for the past 20 years, because in Ohio, the buildings have been
built in the 1960s and 1970s and then not maintained because of
budget constraints.
We get a large portion of those resources from the State of
Ohio's capital budget, which we now believe the capital dollars
will likely need to be diverted to other priorities and that
school construction could be halted for the immediate future. I
have actually found myself in the difficult space of advocating
that the capital budget be used for the internet,
infrastructure problem in rural and urban Ohio, at the expense
of school construction, and have even signaled to our community
that we may pause the new buildings that were expected to start
our construction this fall.
Mr. Sablan. Thank you, Mr. Gordon. I don't mean to cut you
off, but I have a--it is a decent area where Federal funding
such as is proposed by our Rebuild America's Schools Act, the
RAS Act, would help?
Mr. Gordon. Yes, sir, those acts would be very helpful for
school districts like mine and across the country.
Mr. Sablan. Okay. I have other questions that I will submit
for the record, but I will continue. I have another question.
Mr. Gordon, you said that many children in your district lack
home internet access, so some students participated remote
learning online while others use paper packets. Can you
describe the impact this will have on achievement gaps,
specifically for students with disabilities, students with
economic challenges, and students of color impacted by the
subpar educational experience?
Mr. Gordon. So my community is 100 percent poverty, 86
percent children of color, and over a quarter of our students
are on an IEP, both because there is a lead health crisis in
Cleveland and because of lack of resources in charter and
voucher schools for students with disabilities. So students who
already face gaps brought on by race and class in this city as
one of the most segregated cities in the country are only going
to be magnified by those 9 weeks' learning loss.
And when we compare them to their suburban peers--and
again, using our own student data--as ineffective as online
learning was, in every experience, it was still far more
effective as reported by students and parents and teachers than
the kinds of tools we were forced to use--mailing packages and
those sorts of things.
We can't fully know the gap until the kids are back with
us. I can guarantee you without seeing the data, it is going to
be magnified.
Mr. Sablan. Thank you. Thank you. Yes, we are also using
the ACT learning system, but the CARES Act provided $13 billion
in Federal emergency relief for K-through-12 education. As
Chairman Scott knows, I advocated early on that there should be
language to limit the governor--our governors issue. Like in
our example, the governor had 4, almost $5 million of money he
could have given to our K-through-12 education. While our
community college needed $1 million, the governor decided to
give the community college the entire almost $5 million. They
were happy, of course. They never asked for that money. They
were very happy.
So let me ask Ms. Pringle at this time, looking at where we
are today, how far will the CARES Act funding, which the
Learning Policy Institute indicates is less than $300 per
student, will the student--go with helping students in your
district? Or actually, Mr. Gordon, go ahead and answer that.
Mr. Gordon. So Cleveland's portion of the CARES Act direct
funding is between $24- and $26 million, depending on whether
Ohio chooses to follow the law or the guidance from the
Department, and Ohio has not yet made that decision.
Of that $24 million, we have already had $15 million in
unplanned expenses and a $5.6 million State budget cut, so
essentially $20.6 million has been spent. We are able to start
drawing down those dollars today, so they are finally arriving
in our district.
Our governors have not made a decision about the balance.
Although we are advocating for internet and for children with
disability to get a compensatory--
Mr. Sablan. Mr. Gordon, my time is up, but in my district,
we had over 500 teachers furloughed, and now an additional 40
support staff have been furloughed also.
Thank you very much. Mr. Chairman, I am sorry. I yield
back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman from Alabama, Mr.
Byrne?
Mr. Byrne. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate the
opportunity for you to bring us all together to talk about this
very important topic. I was worried about this from the get-go,
because I knew when we--
Mr. Walberg. I am out of here.
Mr. Byrne.--so abruptly ended school and then tried to put
children in the circumstance where they would learn virtually,
that none of us were prepared for that. Children weren't,
teachers weren't, administrators weren't, mom and dads weren't.
So the thing that bothers me now is that we marched into this
thing without thinking through, and I am worried we are not
thinking through what we got to do--
-- I have used it. I have see it be used very effectively.
Mr. Byrne. So Mr. Johnson, here is the question I have--we
can have all the great [Inaudible.]
Mr. Gordon. The short answer, Mr. Representative, is no,
and I think you would find broad agreement from all spectrums
of the political aisle that the best place for students to
learn is in the classroom with a great, caring teacher. There
is no replacement for it, and I think that has been magnified
through this crisis when, again, I compliment the steps that
North Carolina has taken to be a leader in digital education,
but even in North Carolina, it is very glaring that we were not
where we needed to be to switch from zero percent remote
learning to 100 percent remote learning. And there is
absolutely no replacement for students being in the classroom.
And I don't just say that as the State Superintendent. I
say that as the father of a little girl who just finished her
first grade year through remote learning. And we know that she
is going to have learning loss herself because as hard as her
teachers tried, you could not just get through as much as when
they are in the classroom. But also it took an emotional toll
on my daughter, and I won't get into the details, but this has
been very difficult, especially for our younger students.
Ms. Foxx. Mr. Chairman? Mr. Chairman, I need to tell you
that Mr. Byrne is not being shown as he is speaking and that
you skipped over Mr. Walberg, unfortunately, because you
could--he was speaking but you could not hear him.
And I would ask your indulgence, because Mr. Walberg needs
to step out, after Mr. Byrne. But we need to get Mr. Byrne on
the camera. This is the reason we ought to be in this room and
ought not to be doing these things remotely. This is very
troubling, so I would ask you to please see what you can do
about getting Mr. Byrne on.
Chairman Scott. I have Mr. Byrne on my computer. I see him
well. His voice went out briefly, but I see him on my computer.
Is anybody else--can you nod your heads, can you see Mr. Byrne?
Ms. Foxx. I could not see him.
Chairman Scott. Okay. Some are seeing him, some are not. He
is right in the middle of my screen.
Ms. Foxx. Okay.
Chairman Scott. Okay.
Ms. Adams. I am able to see him. I am able to see him, Mr.
Chair. This is Alma Adams.
Looking good.
Chairman Scott. And I called on Mr. Walberg.
Ms. Foxx. And he answered, but you could not hear him.
Chairman Scott. Okay. Well, we will move him up on the
list. If he is in a real crunch, if Ms. Wilson will defer, he
can go next.
Ms. Foxx. We would appreciate that.
Chairman Scott. Have you completed your questions, Mr.
Byrne?
I can't--I can't--you are right, we can't hear him.
Ms. Foxx. Mr. Byrne is coming to my microphone.
Mr. Sablan. Okay. I am not suggesting anything, but
remember I had that bad experience. He should hold his mike up
to his mouth. That works.
Chairman Scott. If you use Dr. Foxx's mic, I think that
would be helpful.
Mr. Byrne. The last comment I wanted to make is this. If we
can make virtual education work as effectively as in-person
education, we would only need one teacher for every subject,
and we just blast out that great teacher to everybody in
America. But we all know that is not enough. We have got to get
these kids back in school this fall.
And I know it is up to the governors, that is not something
we get to control. But if we think we are going to be able to
substitute, with virtual education, the quality that these kids
get when they are actually in school with the teacher, we are
kidding ourselves.
And with that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Ms. Foxx. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for this. And if Ms.
Wilson is willing to defer to Mr. Walberg, we would be very
grateful.
Chairman Scott. I am going to recognize Ms. Wilson at this
point. Ms. Wilson?
Ms. Foxx. We can't hear you.
Ms. Wilson. Mr. Walberg? Go ahead, Mr. Walberg.
Chairman Scott. Okay. She has deferred, Mr. Walberg. Thank
you, Ms. Wilson. The gentleman from Michigan, Mr. Walberg, you
are recognized for 5 minutes.
Ms. Foxx. Thank you Ms. Wilson.
Mr. Walberg. I thank the gentle lady. Can you hear me?
Chairman Scott. Yes.
Mr. Walberg. Can you hear me now?
Ms. Foxx. Yes, we can hear you.
Mr. Walberg. I was asking if Bobby could hear me. I know
you can hear me in the room. Again, it is a great hearing, but
the reason we ought to have these hearings here is because of
this stuff. It is difficult to be passed over because of
technology, and I know it wasn't your fault.
I appreciate the fact that we have one of our witnesses
here today. I appreciate you coming all the way from North
Carolina to be here. And another reason why we ought to be
here, we ought to open up our country again. One of the best
things that can provide education funding is have an economy
that is going, not shut down.
So another reason, to get the sales tax revenue, the
property tax, all of that going, and provide the necessary
funding for our schools.
Mr. Johnson, the CARES Act created the Education
Stabilization Fund, which provided over $30 billion for State
schools and higher education to respond to the coronavirus.
More specifically, the CARES Act states that local educational
agencies may use the funding for purchasing educational
technology, including hardware, software [Inaudible.] and
connectivity.
In April the FCC and the Department of Education announced
a partnership to promote the use of $16 billion [Inaudible.]
For the use of remote learning.
Mr. Johnson, a challenge that certainly exists in my
district is a lack of broadband access. As co-chair of the 5G
Caucus, expanding broadband connectivity is something of
particular interest to me. So three questions I want you to
discuss as I ask them to you.
The first is, how has your State utilized CARES Act
resources to promote distance learning? Secondly, do you have
best practices you can share with districts looking to better
utilize technology in their schools? And third, are there any
additional actions that you think Congress should consider to
further promote connectivity between students and the
classroom?
Mr. Johnson. Thank you, Representative. I will start again
with urging Congress to look at the need for broadband access
across our Nation, not just in my State, but this is an issue
that all States are facing. We have dedicated a lot of our
CARES Act funding with the idea of addressing these
connectivity divides.
Again, there was a large sum that went to the North
Carolina General Assembly. They have provided tens of millions
of dollars for devices for students and teachers. They also
have provided $70 million of those funds to address summer
learning loss, and I have encouraged local superintendents that
if we are in a place where students cannot come back in during
the summer to have their learning loss addressed, we use that
funding to buy really high quality, professional development
for teachers, and digital curriculum options for teachers, and
devices to help address that summer learning loss remotely.
Then finally, we are getting out the money from the CARES
Act that go to the local districts and the schools there. That
money is about $400 million in North Carolina. We have just
finished the application process for districts, and
overwhelmingly districts are telling us that they want to use
that to buy devices and ensure connectivity for students.
Mr. Walberg. Thank you, Mr. Johnson. There has been a lot
of discussion today about how the Federal Government needs to
add assistance on top of the money that was allocated in the
CARES Act. And while there may need be significant needs for
greater assistance--and we have to look into that--are there
ways the Federal Government can assist States and school
districts in other ways? Are there flexibilities in Federal law
that have not yet been used today that would be useful?
Mr. Johnson. Yes. Thank you. You have heard a lot today
about this idea of personalized learning, being able to use
these new tools to empower teachers to do what they have been
doing for many, many years, individualizing education for
students, but to actually be able to do that in a practical,
easier-to-use way, by using technology and these good digital
curriculum options.
Let's look at getting some flexibility from our
accountability metrics so that we still have the accountability
we need to ensure students are learning, but it doesn't have to
be through high stakes, end-of-year testing. Let's start
looking at a program--we are grateful we are part of an
innovative assessment pilot put on by the U.S. Department of
Education.
Let's maybe put that into overdrive and allow formative
diagnostics throughout the year, to give us the accountability
metrics but also help teachers inform their instruction of
students.
Mr. Walberg. Thank you, and I thank Representative Wilson
for her help on this problem in allowing me the opportunity to
ask the questions.
And I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. And Ms. Wilson will speak in the
time previously reserved for Mr. Walberg. Ms. Wilson?
Ms. Wilson. Stay safe, Mr. Walberg.
I am a strong advocate for public schools, and if a
district--if our districts don't already have enough to worry
about, Betsy DeVos' misguided equitable service guidance
threatens to redirect critical resources away from
disadvantaged students in schools with high concentration of
children from low-income families and towards wealthier private
schools--
Now, in the midst of a pandemic and the worst economic
crisis since the Great Depression, she is seeking to strip
desperately needed emergency funding from public schools, all
while ignoring longstanding precedent, the intent of Congress,
and the statutory requirements of the CARES Act.
I have a question for Ms. Pringle. Can you speak to your
concerns regarding life outcomes for Black students and
students with disabilities, such as educational, career, socio,
emotional, and health outcomes through the combination of the
COVID-19 pandemic and the possibility of gaping holes in State
education budgets for several years?
Ms. Pringle. First of all, I want to say thank you for
making your comments that you made about Secretary DeVos
ignoring the intent of Congress, specifically the guidance
around this Every Student Succeeds Act. We know that money was
designated to go to public schools, and to try to use it for
private schools and voucher schemes is unacceptable.
And we thank you for, in the CARES Act, actually seeking to
make sure that is limited, that what she is trying to do is
limited, with the intent of that act. Thank you.
Absolutely, our students of color, our students with
special needs already--already--were at a disadvantage because
of the inequitable system that they have found throughout the
years have not provided the resources they need, the supports
they need to learn.
And we know that this pandemic, just like any other crisis,
always impacts them first, and it impacts them the most. That
is why we are coming together, our millions of educators all
over the country are doing everything they can to push the
Senate to concur with the actions of the House and provide the
additional funding that our schools need. Because we absolutely
know that our students with special needs, as well as our Black
and Brown students, need that additional assistance with
equitable funding in their schools.
We already heard that they are more likely to go to schools
that are crumbling, that are suffering from poor air quality,
which will predispose them to getting sick. Already. We need
those additional funding--that additional funding to improve
the conditions in our schools. We need that additional funding
to make sure they have access to high quality educators. We
need that additional funding to make sure that they have those
resources and supports, especially now.
And Congresswoman, I can't thank you enough for raising up
the emotional challenges that our students are coming back to
school with. We have the twin pandemics, not only the COVID-19,
but of the institutional racism in this country.
Our Black and Brown students are suffering, as they are
watching these inequities all over this country show up in both
pandemics. And so we absolutely need to make sure we have
counselors and enough teachers to address their emotional needs
when they come back to school.
Ms. Wilson. Thank you so much. Thank you, Ms. Pringle.
Dr. Leachman, does that mean my time is up? I yield back.
Chairman Scott. You have 1 minute left.
Ms. Wilson. Okay. So Dr. Leachman, can you explain why it
is important for State leaders to ensure high poverty school
districts are not disproportionately harmed by the budget cuts?
And how do we--can we explain how school budgets are set, when
these decisions are made, or how--why it would benefit States
and districts to know what Federal support they can rely on?
Mr. Leachman. Thank you, Congresswoman. Both excellent
questions. Low-income children and children of color already
face enormous barriers to success. Cutting funding to their
often already under resourced schools would just increase those
already very significant barriers.
Talking about laying off teachers, counselors, nurses,
librarians, limiting course offerings, extracurricular
opportunities, putting off maintenance that needs to be done,
because of the barriers placed in front of those children
already, these sorts of cuts would be particularly damaging.
And then to your question about--I am sorry, Congresswoman,
can you remind me your second question?
Ms. Wilson. How can we guide school districts to know that
this money is coming so that they can--
Mr. Leachman. Yes, ma'am.
Ms. Wilson. --address the budget crisis that they have and
know that--
Mr. Leachman. Thank you.
Ms. Wilson.--give us some information on when are these
decisions made, why would it benefit States and districts to
know what Federal support they can rely on--
Mr. Leachman. Yes.
Ms. Wilson.--as early as possible, considering the
timelines they have in making--setting up budgets. It is
important.
Mr. Leachman. Thank you. Almost all States start their
fiscal year on July 1st. They are required to balance their
budgets. So they need to know soon how much Federal aid they
are going to get because they have to write those budgets.
And so they are going to be making decisions about cutting
funding, which will result in layoffs and other crucial, very
damaging school cuts, unless they get substantial Federal aid.
So they need to know if that is coming so that they can avoid
making those harmful cuts.
Ms. Wilson. Thank you. Thank you so much. I yield back.
Mr. Leachman. Thank you, Congresswoman.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. That time was previously
reserved for Mr. Walberg. So we will go back in regular order,
and I note the gentle lady from Ohio, Ms. Fudge, has returned.
Ms. Fudge?
Ms. Fudge. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, and forgive
me, I had to take a call, Mr. Chairman, doing the work that
everybody thinks that we can't do unless we are in Washington.
It is the work I do every day and all day.
Welcome to all of our witnesses today, and I especially
want to welcome CEO Eric Gordon from the Cleveland Municipal
School District, and my friend, Ms. Pringle, it is nice to see
you as well.
Mr. Gordon, in your testimony, you talked about schools
across the country and how desperately we needed funding. In
your recent--in your written testimony, you state that 40
percent of families in Cleveland have no reliable access. What
additional resources are needed for remote learning to be
successful in Cleveland?
Mr. Gordon. Through you the chairman to my congresswoman,
great to see you, and thank you for the question. We estimate
that just for Cleveland to be connected alone is $40 million,
to get the infrastructure in place that would connect the kids
and families that I serve in the district, and that estimate
was created through our nonprofit partnership, DigitalC. It is
the way we are delivering the infrastructure here in the city.
Ms. Fudge. Thank you. You also mentioned a personalized
system of learning. Can you just briefly tell me what that
entails?
Mr. Gordon. So over the past decade, we have really tried
to test and push against the system. We have changed calendars
to year-round schools and longer days. We have moved learning
into museums, Fortune 500 companies, hospitals. We have
partnered with, you know, any number of nonprofit groups--glee
for clee, which is our early childhood efforts, mentorships,
student-organized learning, and remote content, which can be
researched, can be using databases, can be using learning
management platforms.
And so what we seek to do is to make the mastery of the
content the goal, which all educators want it to be, and the
time is one of the resources, as opposed to having 180 days
dictate that is the amount of learning a child is supposed to
have, but by using a much more flexible environment of all of
those different resources, so that students move at the pace
that they are able.
And what this would allow us to do is, instead of every
teacher always having 25 children in a class, some who are
bored because they could be moving faster, could be working
more independently, and others that could benefit from having a
small group setting with their teacher, we can then personalize
how we assign kids, so that kids who are far behind get more
personalized attention, and kids who are prepared to excel can
keep moving.
Ms. Fudge. Okay, thank you. Mr. Leachman, in your written
testimony you say, an excellent K12 education for children of
color is vital for overcoming historical barriers. I couldn't
agree with you more, and that is the reason why Chairman Scott
and I introduced the Strength in Diversity Act. And you know
that act provides grants to schools to improve diversity.
Mr. Leachman, can you talk through the historical barriers
to education for students of color?
Mr. Leachman. Congresswoman, thank you for that question
and raising this very important issue. It is crucial that we
all understand the connections between historical racism and
other--and ongoing forms of discrimination and bias on the
opportunities that are available to families in the communities
where these schools are located and on the kids themselves.
Without understanding that history, it is difficult to devise
policy that will really be effective in addressing--in creating
opportunities and creating the kind of educational system that
all of our children need.
Doing so would benefit all of us, because having all of
those kids--helping all of those kids reach their full
potential and overcoming finally these historical barriers,
would benefit the economy, would make our community stronger.
Ms. Fudge. Thank you so much. And I thank you all again for
testifying. And just to a point that I heard earlier about
education not being in the Constitution, there are a whole lot
of things that are in the Constitution that my colleagues don't
follow. With that, I will yield back, Mr. Chairman.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman from Wisconsin,
Mr. Grothman?
Mr. Grothman. Can you hear me now?
Chairman Scott. I can hear you now.
Mr. Grothman. Okay, real good. I don't mean to beat a dead
horse here, but I will just request of my good friend, the
chairman, that I know next week we are going to be around here
anyway, I think on Thursday and Friday, and I missed today not
being able to talk with my Democrat colleagues.
I like to be all bipartisan, and I wish so much I could
talk to some Democrats to my left, but I can't. So I would just
ask you one more time, I wish you would reschedule it for, you
know, next Wednesday, Thursday, or Friday when so many of us
are around here anyway.
Second thing, as far as Mr. Gordon is concerned, he is very
critical of schools that are 40 years old or older. And when I
was at the district I went to today, not at the time, I think
all the schools are over 40 years old, and is a very well
respected school. Everything in my experience indicates the
important thing is to have good teachers and good parents, and
how old the bricks and mortar are is secondary.
But I will ask Mr. Gordon, who was complaining here--I
tried to do a little bit of research--compared to the State of
Ohio as a whole, how much they spend per pupil in the Cleveland
public schools.
Mr. Gordon. Through the chair to the congresswoman--the
Congressman, I am sorry--we spend about $11,000 per pupil.
Mr. Grothman. And how is that compared to Ohio as a whole?
Mr. Gordon. I don't know the State average. It is widely
varied in the State. So for example, a neighboring school
district charges about $22,000 per child. So it is widely
varied in the State of Ohio.
Mr. Grothman. I am under the impression, just looking on
the internet, that you are getting more than the average in the
State of Ohio. Do you believe that is not true?
Mr. Gordon. That is likely true, yes.
Mr. Grothman. Okay, okay.
A question for Ms. Pringle. One of the things I was
thinking about, or one of the lessons we learned over the last
few weeks from the tragedy of George Floyd--and again this is
for Ms. Pringle--is that this horrible police officer should
have been removed earlier. And I think around the country,
unions are looking at this situation and maybe sometimes
realizing they have done too much to protect the bad police
officers. I hear from my school superintendents that until
Scott Walker changed the rules in Wisconsin, that was a big
problem for them as well. You know, sometimes, the unions were
too powerful at protecting bad, bad teachers.
I know a lot of the--or some of the unions are recognizing
maybe they protected some bad policemen. Do you regret your
past stances on maybe protecting too many bad teachers?
Ms. Pringle. So unions don't protect bad teachers. Unions
are there to ensure that employees' rights are followed, to
make sure that we have the opportunity as we have, our members
of the NEA, whose mission is to not only unite our members but
the entire Nation to fulfill the promise of public education.
And it is our unions who are fighting to ensure racial and
social and education justice. It is our unions who are fighting
to diversify the teaching force. It is our unions who--
Mr. Grothman. Can I take it to mean you are not going to
change your policy?
Ms. Pringle.--making sure that our students and our schools
get the resources they need--
Mr. Grothman. Okay.
Ms. Pringle.--and deserve.
Mr. Grothman. I guess I got my answer. I will emphasize,
teachers are important. And I think, say, a bad second grade
teacher is particularly harmful to a student who comes from a
difficult background and--but in any event, now we will switch
to Mr. Johnson.
You answered questions before about internet in rural
areas, but I would like to ask how quickly you are able to
provide more internet and broadband access to people in rural
North Carolina, and repeat again exactly how far long you are
on that process.
Mr. Johnson. Thank you. We are able to do that quickly with
hotspots and mobile devices on buses. We are closing that gap
as quickly as possible. We have done that for actual physical
school buildings. But we are still assessing exactly what that
gap is and using those funds to close that, along with our
General Assembly.
Mr. Grothman. Okay. About how--when you talk about access,
though, at home, percentage wise, how many kids at home have
broadband internet access in North Carolina, you think?
Mr. Johnson. Percentage wise, we are looking at about--we
are doing this by devices. We are looking at a few hundred
thousand devices would have to get out to students. So the
percentages, we are better along than other States, but we are
not where we want to be.
Mr. Grothman. Like, you know, like percentage wise, where
are you today, and percentage wise, where were you, say, 5
years ago?
Mr. Johnson. I would have to get that specific information
to you, and I can. We are getting the hotspots out, and that is
why I would hate to say something right now that is incorrect,
where we actually are better than we were just 3 months ago,
based on the hotspots we have done.
Mr. Grothman. So you are making progress that quickly,
significant--
Mr. Johnson. Yes.
Mr. Grothman.--improvement over the last 3 months?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, I can say that and we will get you that
progress as the hotspots get out, but we do realize this is a
major issue that many education chiefs in States are facing.
Mr. Grothman. Okay. Thank you very much. I will maybe--
because I do have a second here--no, I will let it be.
I will yield the rest of my time.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. And I thank the gentleman from
Wisconsin, particularly for his opening comments about the
desire to meet in person. I can assure you that if we are in
session, any committee proceedings will be in person and not
virtual, so we will follow through on your suggestion.
Next is the gentle lady from Oregon, Ms. Bonamici.
The gentleman from California, Mr. Takano.
Mr. Takano. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. My first question is
directed to Mr. Johnson, the superintendent of schools.
Mr. Johnson, you know, I understand you are a strong
proponent of charter schools and school choice, and I want to
know if you believe that charter schools should be known as
also public schools or whether there is a--I mean, should they
be able to claim that moniker?
Mr. Johnson. Yes. In North Carolina, charter schools are
public schools. They come out of the State's public-school
funding.
Mr. Takano. I would like to highlight a New York Times
article from this morning about charter schools. Unlike regular
and traditional public schools, charter schools and private
schools are eligible for PPP funds through the CARES Act.
Charter schools are also eligible for the Education
Stabilization funds. The ability for these schools to tap into
PPP funds significantly disadvantages traditional public
schools.
Should charter schools be allowed to tap into PPP funds
while they are also benefitting from Stabilization funds?
Mr. Johnson. I know that relief funds from the United
States Congress and the administration should help as broad a
spectrum of students and citizens as possible. I am not
personally aware of charter schools in North Carolina applying
for the PPP fund. That is something that I would need to look
into more with my colleagues.
Mr. Takano. Well, my understanding is that schools that are
fairly well--charter schools that have fairly healthy balance
sheets, that are funded by Mr. Bloomberg, who maximally donated
to your campaign for State Superintendent, that these schools
are potentially drawing PPP funds. If true, what do you think
about this?
Mr. Johnson. I would say in North Carolina--
Mr. Takano. [Inaudible.] funds?
Mr. Johnson. That is a determination for Congress and for
the Treasury Department. I would say that in North Carolina,
you have charter schools that are struggling just as much as
other public schools when it comes to the funding issue,
because of the way they are funded in North Carolina. They are
having to find resources for their own buildings. They find
resources for their own transportation.
And I will say I have been a very strong advocate for
charter schools but also for charter school accountability. And
if there is a charter school that is not doing well, I want to
make sure that it provides--
Choice for students. And there are definitely some
excellent examples of charter schools in North Carolina that
are providing education for--
Mr. Takano. Mr. Johnson, I recall my time, please. So, you
know, my concern is that the administration is refusing to
disclose who is receiving PPP funds, but some groups out there
have discovered that at least $50 million has gone to charter
schools from the PPP program. If there--that is why I asked you
about why you regard them as public schools.
Because if they are receiving money from the PPP program,
they are receiving it as sort of in this--with the
understanding that they are sort of nonprofit organizations.
And schools, public schools specifically, are not allowed to
receive PPP funds.
So do you think that the administration should disclose who
the recipients of PPP funds are so we can understand which
charter schools actually have been receiving PPP funds,
including those that may have very healthy balance sheets and
are backed by wealthy billionaires?
Mr. Johnson. I would support transparency in everything the
Federal Government is doing.
Mr. Takano. So you would call upon the Trump administration
to disclose, you know, whether or not charter schools have been
receiving PPP funds in addition to stabilization funds?
Mr. Johnson. I won't go so far as to make that grandiose
statement when we are here to talk about the public schools,
and the PPP is out of my realm of expertise, self-admittedly.
But, no, I absolutely agree with you; transparency in
everything is very important for government.
Mr. Takano. Well, I thank you for that, sir. We are talking
about funding the public schools. My concern is that currently
charter schools, what you call public schools, are drawing from
the stabilization program, which was intended for public
schools under the CARES Act, yet they are also able to be
nonpublic schools because public schools cannot--I would say
the conventional public schools are not able to draw on PPP
funds.
So I don't know what they really are. The public schools
are not, but we should take advantage of this moment.
I yield back Mr. Chairman.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
The gentlelady from New York, Ms. Stefanik.
Ms. Stefanik. Thank you, Chairman Scott. And thank you to
all of our witnesses for your testimony today on an incredibly
important subject.
In my district in New York's north country, we have been
working very closely with our teachers, our superintendents,
and our parents to get their feedback in real-time, and my
district is one of the most rural districts east of the
Mississippi River. It is certainly the most rural district in
New York, and there are some school districts where up to 50
percent of the students do not have access to broadband. So I
echo my colleagues sentiments on the importance of closing that
digital divide.
In addition, I have heard from parents and families of
students with special needs who have been woefully underserved
during this crisis.
I wanted to ask you, Mark, what are the biggest lessons
that you have learned in terms of where online learning does
not meet the need of our students? Because we have learned a
lot over the past few months. We have learned that many
students have completely fallen out of contact with our school
systems. We have learned that some students who have very
hands-on parents have thrived or caregivers who are involved in
helping them navigate this new technology.
So I would just like to hear from you, Mark, what your
biggest lessons are, from your perspective, with a particular
focus on rural students.
Mr. Johnson. Thank you for that question, Representative.
Absolutely we are making sure that we do everything we can
to help students thrive; but, again, as the father of a young
daughter myself, I can tell you, even with the connectivity,
this is still a struggle for parents having to step in and
especially parents who are educators themselves, parents who
are first responders. I mean, they were on the frontlines
educating and saving lives and still are during this crisis,
while students also needed that extra help with the remote
learning.
I think that is one of the biggest challenges. Obviously,
there is the glaring, glaring issue of the lack of connectivity
and the need for us to really help connect all students,
especially if we are going to be relying on the no learning,
but then also going into the proper professional development
opportunities that we can afford for our teachers to support
them in really best practices for remote learning and the
digital curriculum options.
We have heard a lot about personalized learning today.
Personalized learning is the idea that when our students come
back, we can do a formative assessment on where they are and
what their ability level is, how much learning they have lost.
And then all of this technology we are buying, use that
technology to help teachers meet them where they are in their
ability, and they can progress at their pace.
As my colleague said, you know, my words are that we have a
system that, you know, it is not any educator's fault, it is
not any the leader's fault. We just have a system that was
designed a hundred years ago for an agrarian industrial
society.
We are now in the digital age, and we should use this
moment to transform our education to digital age practices, but
that is going to be a heavy lift, and it is definitely going to
take support from States and school districts for our educators
and students.
Ms. Stefanik. Thank you.
And I just want to take this moment to thank all of the
teachers and educators in my district who I have spoken with
and those I haven't had an opportunity to speak with, they have
just been tremendous in rising to this challenge as a
community, and we couldn't be more proud of our teachers across
this country and our students during this difficult time.
And with that, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. Thank you.
Next is the gentlelady from North Carolina, Dr. Adams.
Ms. Adams. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And let me thank all of
our witnesses here today. Thank you for your testimony. Thank
you for your support of children.
I want to shout out to my district in CMS in Charlotte and
my former district, Guilford County in Greensboro.
Mr. Johnson, thank you for joining the committee. It is
always great to have an opportunity to talk policy with fellow
North Carolinians, and because of my particular interest in the
State of North Carolina and its public-school system. I was on
the school board many, many years ago. And I am a 40-year
retired teacher, but--or a professor.
But my questions will be very State specific, and so I
would appreciate if we could have succinct answers because, you
know, we are on a really short time limit.
We both know that the commitment our State made to public
education dated all the way back to the Great Depression, and
as many other States suffered rampant school closures, not one
public school closed in North Carolina due to the depression.
But since the depression of 2008, priorities have changed, and
today North Carolina is only one of seven States where State
investment in education has still not reached pre 2009 levels
adjusted for inflation.
So the State is projecting a revenue shortfall of $1.6
billion in 2019-2020, $2.6 billion in 2020-2021. So given these
facts, what is your plan as the State superintendent to ensure
North Carolina students recieve a sound basic education despite
the anticipated shortfalls in revenue?
Mr. Johnson. Thank you, Madam Representative. It is a
pleasure to see you, and thank you for your questions on North
Carolina specifically because you definitely know a lot about
North Carolina, and we appreciate that and appreciate your
service.
I would say that there are multiple plans in place. One, we
are working very closely with the North Carolina General
Assembly to make sure that we protect our education budget as
much as possible. We should be hopefully seeing the education
budget come out soon over the summer. That, plus the Federal
relief that Congress was able to send to North Carolina,
definitely putting all of that together to see how it helps
and, quite frankly, getting into the weeds a little bit on just
one particular thing, we are very fortunate in North Carolina
that we do live in a State where teacher salaries have
increased a lot just in a very short amount of time.
And in North Carolina last school year, the median teacher
salary was actually more than the median household income,
which is--it just reached it last year and we are very excited
about that; but we have launched a teach-and-see program where
we want to recruit great candidates to come and teach in our
schools because it is such an amazing important career.
We are going to double down on that. Especially when you
see all of the job losses in our economy and what that could
mean, we really want to reach these amazing graduates who are
just now graduating from college, put them in programs where
they can come teach in our schools, but we will need to make
sure we have the teaching places for them. And I believe we are
on track for hopefully the North Carolina General Assembly to
fund enrollment growth in North Carolina.
Ms. Adams. Well, thank you very much. And I served 20 years
in that General Assembly. I know some of the players who are
still there. I also know that Senate Bill 704, which set the
August 17 date for schools to be open, like many of my
colleagues, I am very concerned about how they can open safely.
And in the plan that was put together, what was your
involvement? Did you consult teachers or parents or community
leaders in developing it?
Mr. Johnson. Oh, absolutely. The Governor came out with the
plan that was in partnership with the education system, many
diverse stakeholders, from teachers, to staff, to
superintendents. Right now the Governor's plan is the plan A, a
plan B, and a plan C. And I will be very brief.
Plan A is getting as many students back into school as
possible. Plan B is advance social distancing requirements.
Plan C is remote learning. The Governor is going to make his
call on what plan we will be in by July 1.
Ms. Adams. Okay. I am going to have to send you a question
now in writing. But I just wanted to know what role you played
in the plan. But you don't need to answer that right now.
But. Mr. Leachman, let me ask you, what is the best way for
States and localities to spend CARES Act funds?
Mr. Leachman. Yes, thank you. Thank you, Congresswoman.
Ms. Adams. I have got about 59 seconds.
Mr. Leachman. Yes, ma'am.
So, first and foremost, it should be spent on dealing with
the pandemic. If we don't do that, then the economy and
everything that we care about is going to suffer. We do that
first and foremost. The second thing is to address the harm on
the people that have been hurt the most.
So I would say those two things, including--and including
distance learning and doing as much as you can in the schools
as part of those efforts.
Ms. Adams. What lessons, Mr. Leachman, can Congress learn
from the Great Recession and support our States and school
districts?
Mr. Leachman. The aid provided during the Great Recession
was helpful, but it was too small and it ended too soon, only
covered about a quarter of State shortfalls. We had to make
cuts that we are still feeling the effects of.
Ms. Adams. All right. I don't want the chairman to gavel
me. I am out of time.
Mr. Chairman, I yield back. Thanks very much.
Chairman Scott. Okay. Thank you.
The gentleman from Georgia, Mr. Allen?
The gentleman from Georgia, Mr. Allen?
The gentleman from Pennsylvania, Mr. Smucker.
Ms. Foxx. Mr. Chairman, Mr. Allen is on.
Mr. Allen. Yes.
Chairman Scott. Okay. Okay. Mr. Allen.
Mr. Allen. Yes. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
And I just wanted to share with everyone what I am hearing
in the 12th District of Georgia is that we must open this
economy and it is critical that we get schools open for the new
school year, and I can't get anybody to tell me there is
another option.
This is an important discussion that we are having today.
In fact, it is critical that we, as a Congress and as a
country, come together and try to decide exactly how we are
going to move forward.
Mr. Johnson, you spoke of some concern as a citizen on the
amount of Federal spending as a result of COVID-19 in your
opening remarks. Since you are a teacher--I don't know if you
are a math teacher, but I thought I would give you a little
math that we have had to deal with here.
This year the Federal budget at the beginning of the year,
October 1, was 300 billion above the previous year and 200
billion above 2018. Most of this was discretionary spending,
which is about 30 percent of the total federal budget, which
has increased from 1.2 trillion to 1.5 trillion in 3 years. In
the last 3 months, it has tripled. It has gone from $1.5
trillion to $5.5 trillion, or four times that originally
budgeted.
I have heard the Heroes Act mentioned here today which
would double the accelerated level from 5.5 trillion to 8.8
trillion. The Heroes Act also includes a large tax cut for
those who live in high tax States, known as the State and local
tax deduction, SALT.
As a citizen and an educator, how would you explain this
debt that we are putting on the backs of these very children
that we are trying to figure out how to get back to school this
fall, how would you explain this to them?
Mr. Johnson. Well, again, I will emphasize that I am the
father of a 7-year-old, and I agree with you, that is one of
the balances that Congress has to, unfortunately, strike in
this situation.
We absolutely are going to need resources for schools.
There is no doubt about that. But we know that the amount of
money coming from Congress is being done through debt, and
while we absolutely want to connect every student, we owe it to
every student to find the innovation to make sure we get them
the tools and strategies they need to succeed; but we also
don't want to burden them with even more of this debt that is
being piled upon them that eventually they are going to have to
pay.
So I would say it is a very hard balance that we are asking
Congress to make; but that is one reason why I just bring the
information from North Carolina about how we are still working
through the funding that you all have so graciously given us so
far.
Mr. Allen. Well, it is a very, very difficult situation,
particularly when we are asking our educators and everyone
across the State in Georgia, which has been mentioned earlier,
to reduce expenses as a result of COVID-19, and here we have
the Federal Government that has, I mean, almost six times,
increased spending almost six times to deal with this, plus we
have an economy that is currently being restricted because of
the COVID and other reasons that are a little bit beyond our
control.
But as far as the funding levels, assuming that we--I don't
know how we are going to deal with this situation. We have put
ourselves in a terrible situation. In other words, in Georgia
we had a $3 billion rainy day fund, and we are going to deal
with it. But, you know, what have you got to have to, I mean,
get your school system open this fall? I mean, can you get me a
number and what you think it looks like for the rest of the
country? Have you looked at any numbers there?
Mr. Johnson. No. And I know that there is actually the
group of chief State school officers that is working on
providing a number; but it is very important that we put
everything together when we make these decisions because you
are making some very difficult choices, everyone is.
And part of this is sometimes they are just really, really
tough challenges that we face with this COVID-19 crisis. But I
do believe that we will be able to work through it together and
get through it together.
Mr. Allen. Well. We have done it this so far to save lives,
and that is important; but we have got so many other things
that are confronting us right now, and it is difficult. And we
don't take this spending lightly; I don't, because it is going
to be a tremendous impact on future generations. We don't even
know what that impact is going to be.
So I thank you for your time.
And I will yield back, Mr. Chairman.
Chairman Scott. Thank you, thank you.
The gentleman from California, Mr. DeSaulnier.
The gentleman from New Jersey, Mr. Norcross.
Mr. Norcross. Thank you, Mr. Chairman and to our ranking
member. We appreciate you putting together this hearing. It is
a remarkable time in our country given what has gone on over
the course of the last few years.
Just a reflection, that when we look at our children, who
are our future, this is why it is so important that when we do
open, we open the right way. We have seen what happens across
this country with this spike coming after what happens when you
open the wrong way.
And to my colleague who suggested bricks and mortar don't
matter, well, they certainly do to those children who would be
in those facilities. The old schools had asbestos. They had
PCBs. They had lead. Now they have COVID. So there is a smart
way to reuse your buildings. That is why Mr. Scott and I have
introduced a bill to address that.
But I just want to talk about what is going on today, this
massive revenue loss, which is important when it is the
children that is the primary goal for us to make sure that they
don't do it. So I asked a number of teachers in my district how
they are dealing with it. We now have physical distancing as we
are communicating, but we know how important it is for a
teacher in her classroom to physically see the children, that
they can react and see difference nuances when a child is left
behind.
Ms. Pringle, how are teachers dealing with this online when
there is a disruption or there is an issue when you can't see
it and sometimes you can't even hear it? How are teachers
dealing with this?
Chairman Scott. Need to unmute.
Ms. Pringle. Thank you, Congressman, for that question.
I cannot tell you how proud I am of our teachers all over
this country who are, once again, standing in the gaps for our
students.
So I talked with one of those teachers who told me that she
actually spent almost a thousand dollars to get a device,
technology, where she could do exactly what you were talking
about, where she could actually see her students working
through the math problems so she could identify where they were
having problems. That is the kind of resource investment we
need.
We need that now, and I will tell you that it is
unacceptable, it is unacceptable, that we can find money to
bail out billionaires, and millionaires, and corporations, and
we cannot invest in our students right now and in their future.
That is unacceptable.
So we have our teachers who are stepping up, but we need
our government to step up, too.
Mr. Norcross. And also the one thing I hear time after
time, different ages act in different ways. When you have a
smaller child who has the guidance of their parent or guardian,
that is one thing; but as they get into high school, something
happens to students if we can all remember that. So that is a
challenge we have to continue.
But, Mr. Gordon, I wanted to ask about reopening schools.
The pandemic has changed normal. There will be a new normal.
What that looks like will depend on how this pandemic and this
virus reacts.
What steps have you taken--because traditionally the summer
months which, we are right now, is the construction season,
that opportunity to prepare schools for the next coming year,
which is only a couple of months away.
What guidance have you had in preparing the physical
schools for the pandemic and children that are coming back in
September?
Mr. Gordon. Thank you, sir.
We are very fortunate to have a very highly respected
medical community in Cleveland, and so we have been working
with University Hospitals, who has put together a team that is
actually coming into our buildings and walking the buildings
with us to let us know how we can safely implement Ohio's and
the CDC's guidance. We also--
Mr. Norcross. Let me interrupt for a minute.
Mr. Gordon. Yes, sir.
Mr. Norcross. You say guidance. We have heard protocol. But
these aren't standards. They are not enforceable by anybody.
You are voluntarily accepting them; is that correct?
Mr. Gordon. Well, Governor DeWine has not yet released his
guidance, so we do not yet know if it will be through an order
or whether it will be guidance. Most of his releases have been
mandates of how industries should run, then best practices. So
right now I anticipate that we will have mandatory public
health rules.
Mr. Norcross. Well, this is why we and Bobby Scott, again,
has another bill that talks about these enforceable standards
that are directly related to how employees and teachers, but,
more importantly, our kids, are going back into these public
institutions with guidelines. We need standards so people know
what to follow.
With that, that is my call. But, again, this is an issue
that is not going away. September is here.
And I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
The gentleman from Pennsylvania, Mr. Smucker.
Mr. Smucker. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I appreciate your
scheduling this hearing on this very important issue.
I would like to thank the witnesses, Mr. Gordon, Mr.
Johnson, Ms. Pringle, for participating in this and for the
work that you all are doing to ensure that our students can
respond in the best way possible and can continue to learn
through this unprecedented time.
I can tell you with conversations with administrators,
superintendents in my area, as well as teachers, I am so proud
of the work that is being done in PA 11. There was talk of
internet access. You know, in my area, I have some rural
communities in my area, but we don't have a big problem with
broadband access, but when schools switched to remote learning,
they realized that many families still didn't have the internet
access that they needed. And so it presented a lot of
challenges in the rollout of those remote learning platforms.
And so one of the creative solutions in my area was that
superintendents sent bus drivers out with hot spots on their
buses, and they drove around throughout the community. It would
stop at different areas creating mobile internet hubs. So that
was just one example of creative solutions that were taken
right here in our community.
My son was a junior, will now be a senior in Lampeter-
Strasburg, the school district where we live, and I was so
pleased to see the tremendous effort that the teachers took to
ensure that learning continued, even--just one example of a
teacher, you know, ran some sort of contest to keep the
students engaged and online and took her own personal time to
drop off some gift certificate to a local, I don't know,
Starbucks, or whatever it was, for my son.
So it just showed the kind of commitment that teachers were
making, I am sure all across the country, certainly I observed
firsthand all across our district here. So we appreciate all
the work.
This does obviously create a massive funding issue. Just
one comment on that. You know, the longer we are closed down,
the more additional revenue is lost. I have been disappointed
in Pennsylvania that data has shown that the curve was
literally crushed here, hospitals were never overwhelmed, but
we are far behind other States in reopening.
And every day we do that, it is not only additional revenue
that is lost that could be going to schools, but it is also
additional businesses that may not come back to reinvigorate
the economy when it does open. So I think it is urgent that we
continue to safely reopen and allow businesses that can safely
reopen to do so as quickly as possible.
And I was talking a long time and didn't get to a lot of
questions. But, Mr. Gordon, in particular, I was very
interested in one of your comments in regards to competency-
based learning as opposed to measuring--I believe this was you,
Mr. Gordon, but as opposed to measuring seat time, which I have
always been an advocate of. I think we should move students
along based on what they know, not necessarily the amount of
time they were sitting in the seats.
But you said you have potentially learned some things
through this that you might be able to apply. I wondered if you
could just expand on that. I was curious what you meant by
that.
Mr. Gordon. Certainly, Congressman. Thank you.
So I have long believed that we need to write our education
system so that it focuses on the mastery of learning and not
just a forced march. I say in my own community, there is no
science that says 25 kids can only learn English language arts
from 9:07 to 10:11 Monday through Friday. That is an efficiency
of scheduling, not a design for learning. And we have a decade
of work of trying to create more mastering of important models
in Cleveland.
What we learned in this shutdown is--and you heard it from
my colleague in North Carolina--is different kids respond in
different ways. Younger children struggled more with the
digital platforms in general than older students with
disabilities.
And then based on need, I have a parent who wrote to me
very upset because she has three children. She is a single
parent. She has two jobs, and both are considered essential.
And I want her making sure her kids do all of this stuff, and
she is overwhelmed. But even things like that add impact.
And so it is really pushed my team and I. I am proud of my
teachers because we scheduled student-parent-teacher
conferences at a schedule that met the family's need as opposed
to everybody gets a call every day or everybody gets a call a
week. That overwhelmed mom can't take a call every day. And I
think we did more and better for our kids because of how much
effort my educators made to find out where that family was and
walk along with them.
Mr. Smucker. Well I am out of time already, but I do want
again to say thank you for your leadership. And this has been
tough in many different areas, including education; but, you
know, perhaps we will learn a few things about how we could do
things differently. I know that is true in telemedicine. It is
going to change the way I think we work, but probably also see
some positive changes in terms of how we approach education.
So thank you for those comments.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
The gentlelady from Washington, Ms. Jayapal.
Ms. Jayapal. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And thank you to all
of our witnesses for being here today.
This hearing is incredibly timely as demonstrators and
activists across the country are calling on their elected
leaders to correct long-standing funding inequities that
disproportionately harm Black people. For far too long funding
for militarized police forces in Black communities is
prioritized instead of equitable public education for these
same communities.
And I am deeply troubled that this pandemic will only
further widen achievement gaps for Black students, low-income
students, and students of color.
In Washington State, while 96 percent of K-12 funding is
constitutionally protected, we are all incredibly concerned
that it would still be subjected to cuts. With a $7 billion
budget shortfall projected over the next 3 years in our State,
school employee hiring freezes and layoffs seem likely without
Federal support, especially when staffing makes up about 85
percent of K-12 costs in my district.
Ms. Pringle, thank you so much for your testimony and for
your work. How do staff cuts disproportionately hurt students
of color and low-income students?
Ms. Pringle. Thank you, Congresswoman.
Absolutely, we know this throughout history, that when we
have a crisis, it will disproportionately impact our Black and
Brown students, our students living in poverty, our students
with special needs. We already are not providing the resources
that they need when they need it, and this pandemic is just
like every other crisis throughout history that has impacted
them.
So we know that they already are in schools that have high
class sizes so that those teachers cannot provide that
individualized learning. If we do not get the funds from the
Heroes Act, we know that over 500,000 more teachers will be
laid off, and that will increase class sizes.
Let's talk about the safety around COVID-19. We know that
if we are going to try to practice those guidelines of social
distancing, if we have fewer staff, we know that they are going
to be impacted at a greater degree.
And then we also know--and this is what I have heard from
teachers all over the country--that they know they need to
prepare now for trauma informed practice. We cannot do that if
we do not have enough teachers and counselors and support
professionals to surround our students with the care and
nurturing they need to try to help them with the emotional
trauma that they have been experiencing over these 3 months.
So, absolutely, those students will need that additional
support, and so we are asking everyone to ensure that we lift
up our voice right now so they get what they need.
Ms. Jayapal. Incredibly important.
Let me ask you a follow-up question, Ms. Pringle. Secretary
DeVos has stated that she plans to move ahead with a policy
that would transfer CARES Act dollars from public schools to
wealthier private ones, and that is a departure from the usual
practice of how federal funding for equitable services is
allocated under Title I.
So as an educator, knowing the amount of learning loss we
have already seen among students of color due to the pandemic,
can you tell us what impact such a policy decision would have
on high poverty schools?
Ms. Pringle. Congresswoman, the same impact that Secretary
DeVos's decisions have had throughout her tenure, it is why
hundreds of thousands of educators all over this country rose
up and said she should not be confirmed. She is not fit for her
office. She is the most unqualified Secretary of Education we
have ever had. And we see in the middle of this crisis, she is
still trying to promote her schemes around privatization.
We are standing up and calling that out, and we thank you
so much for including language in the Heroes Act to call that
out, too.
Ms. Jayapal. Thank you.
Dr. Leachman, very quickly, why is direct aid dedicated to
K-12 so important? You have just got a very short period of
time, but if you could.
Mr. Leachman. Well, it is crucially important because our
schools are so important, and we want to make sure that they
are protected and the educations of our kids are protected. So
we need a range of tools to provide physical relief; but a key
part of that is direct aid to schools.
Ms. Jayapal. And what scale is needed to address the
crisis? You know, we put nearly a trillion dollars--excuse me,
an infusion of approximately $58 billion and nearly a trillion
in aid to state and local governments in the Heroes Act. What
scale do you think is necessary?
Mr. Leachman. Well, we are projecting over $600 billion in
overall shortfalls for States only, right. Schools account for
roughly a third of that. So just on very rough terms, that gets
you somewhere around 200. Then you have got the additional
shortfalls at the local level, plus the additional costs of
dealing with COVID-19 and opening up safely. So, you know, it
is a substantial sum that schools need.
Ms. Jayapal. Thank you so much.
Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
The gentleman from Indiana, Mr. Banks.
Mr. Banks. There we go, Mr. Chairman. Can you hear me now?
Chairman Scott. I can hear you.
Mr. Banks. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
I appreciate the opportunity to be a part of this hearing
today because I believe it is the most important conversation
that we should be having in America at the moment: How do we
get our kids back in the classroom?
I am pleased to see a number of my colleagues in the
hearing room. I do believe, Mr. Chairman, we have cheapened
this conversation today by not having an in-person hearing, and
I hope we will make up for it in the near future and perhaps
have many more committee hearings in this important
conversation in the days to come.
What is it going to take to get our kids back in the
classroom? And, Superintendent Johnson, you and I have
something in common. We both have young kids. I have a first
grader, a second grader, and a fourth grader, and it has been
tragic watching what they have gone through every single day
through this, trying to get a good education through virtual
learning.
All of the studies are showing that virtual learning has
failed to provide an adequate educational opportunity to our
kids. And the conversation today is about what is it going to
take to get our kids the education that they deserve, America
is the land of opportunity because we guarantee an educational
opportunity to every kid in this great country, and we are
about to leave a generation of kids behind if we don't do
everything absolutely possible to get our kids back in the
classroom in the fall.
Superintendent Johnson, from what you have already told us
today, I think you and I agree that the education that kids
have received through virtual learning is far inferior to what
they would receive in the classroom; is that correct?
Mr. Johnson. Yes. I think we will have the actual analytics
to prove that as well; but we definitely have the stories from
not just students, not just parents, but also educators
themselves and everything they are doing, and they truly have
been champions during this crisis. But they even know that this
is no replacement for having students in the classroom. Even
when there is at least more in their control during this remote
learning that they are putting in the efforts in towards, they
know, they see the results every day. This is no substitution
for being in the classroom.
Mr. Banks. There is no doubt about it, our teachers are the
super heroes in all of this trying to do whatever it takes to
deliver that education to these kids. But I haven't spoken to a
single teacher yet that tells me that kids don't deserve to be
in the classroom in the fall, that they shouldn't be in the
classroom in the fall, that they should be left to remain at
home receiving an inferior education, because our teachers
understand better than anybody that experience in a classroom
is far superior to what they have experienced over the last few
months.
There has been a lot of talk, Superintendent Johnson, today
about money, but what else do our schools need to accomplish
the end goal of opening our classrooms in the fall? And on that
note, can you talk about liability protection? I have had a lot
of school leaders call me and say that liability protections
are an important piece of the puzzle. Can you talk about that?
And what else is it going to take to move this conversation
toward doing whatever possible to get our kids in the
classroom, in the fall?
Mr. Johnson. Thank you.
We are still awaiting the guidance from our Governor in
North Carolina. That is going to be a very pivotal moment for
our schools. Are we going to try to get as many students back
in the school building as possible? Are we going to have to
shift to strategies that promote social distancing? Which we
know already the challenges that will bring with just trying to
get students on the school bus, trying to get students in the
classroom, it is going to be quite an uphill challenge.
For the liability, that is something that more and more
educators are looking for action from their elected leaders.
Whatever school looks like when we go back in the fall, we do
not want educators to have to worry about being held liable if,
heaven forbid, there is a spread of COVID-19, or even beyond
that, just being liable for making sure that the student is
keeping a face mask on.
In North Carolina it is not going to be a requirement for
face masks, but that just shows how it is going to be different
State by State. And anything the Federal Government can do to
help with giving some reassurance to educators around the
liability question would be very much appreciated.
Mr. Banks. It has been suggested that liability protections
are pro teachers, that our teachers are expecting liability
protections?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, I believe that is something that
education leaders and educators would very much support.
Mr. Banks. Let me move on to another question.
Have you read the CDC guidelines and the recommendations
for reopening?
Mr. Johnson. Yes.
Mr. Banks. Are they reasonable?
Mr. Johnson. I do believe--I hope that they can be
reasonably accommodating. We, again, in North Carolina, are
looking at that as a baseline. We are hoping to get into a
plan. We are going to get as many students back into school and
as safely as possible. It is going to be very difficult.
One point under the CDC's guideline of screening students
before they come into schools, that is something we are doing a
lot of work on right now of how do you actually practically
make that happen to ensure that guideline is met but you also
cannot interrupt the school day.
Mr. Banks. Thank you very much. You have given us a lot to
think about.
With that, Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
The gentleman from New York, Mr. Morelle.
Mr. Morelle. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman, for your
leadership throughout this crisis and for providing the
Committee with a number of different ways, both through your
briefings and this hearing virtually, to continue our vital
work.
You know, the revenue shortfalls, which is the subject of
this conversation, particularly for State and local governments
as a result of COVID, are devastating, and I am very grateful
we are having this opportunity to have this conversation about
that.
The challenges and losses are obviously on an unprecedented
scale. And, again, something like the virus, we have seen
something like 21, 22 States are now seeing an increase in the
number of cases, something that we experienced in New York some
weeks ago.
Our numbers are down dramatically, and I am in Upstate New
York, Rochester, where we have had a relatively flat curve in
terms of number of hospitalizations, et cetera.
But even as we regain our footing, if that is the case, we
have a real opportunity to be intentional about what we do in
terms of revenues and about guarding against future fallout,
and that is why I think this is such an important conversation.
I have spent many years in the State Legislature in New York,
in the State Assembly, so I am particularly keen and interested
in the impact that this has on State governments.
I think as it was noted earlier, the revenue loss
anticipated somewhere in the neighborhood of $615, $620
billion. Here in New York alone, we are expecting a $14 billion
shortfall. We provide, as a State government, I think more per
capita to K through 12 than any State in the Nation; but our
ability to do that is going to be dramatically impacted, and
obviously the quality of education is going to be impacted as
well.
And the other thing that this has pointed out--and I am
just commenting on some things that have already been
discussed--is the real digital divide when you go to and look
at the disparities between some communities, particularly urban
and rural, who don't have access to broadband, don't have
access to devices. And the more and more that we try to
compensate for the inability to be together by using distance
learning, that divide, that disparity, grows worse and worse,
particularly among communities of color.
I do want to say that I think the teachers throughout this
country have done an amazing job, like our healthcare workers,
have gone above and beyond whatever would have been expected of
them to try to accommodate their students, and they are all
going to work through the summers. I think, as has been said,
teachers start thinking about the fall in June as the class
year starts to end.
So I think perhaps Mr. Gordon could answer this. I suspect
others could pitch in as well. But I wanted to go back a little
bit to learning loss. The Northwest Evaluation Association said
there will be at least a 30 percent learning loss in reading
and a 50 percent learning loss in math as a result of the
school closings. That is on top of the learning loss that we
have already talked about.
So if we could just talk about the impact, Mr. Gordon, or
maybe comment on the lack of access to quality remote learning
which is impacting vulnerable students and as a result they are
falling further and further behind.
What could we do? What do you expect Congress should do to
try and address that and to help students adapt to remote
learning particularly in vulnerable populations?
Mr. Gordon. Thank you, Congressman.
I think that Congress is going to need to take a long view
of what recovery for most fragile communities looks like, and I
think in my community it is not actually learning loss. We can
still learn. Our children can still learn reading and math
everything. It is learning time loss, and that is going to take
time to make up.
You know, so immediately we are asking for support to keep
our districts whole. Like my colleague in North Carolina, we
are looking at how do we personalize and really start where
each child is and assess where they are and how we move them
forward. But I think my biggest fear, we know in past
recessions, public institutions come out of recessions much
more slowly. For Cleveland, it was 2012.
If the country is kind of up and humming and everybody kind
of forgets that we have to make up this time for children over
time and we don't adequately fund the Title programs, IDEA,
McKinney-Vento, those programs that are designed for these
children, that is where we will ultimately fail because our
educators are going to need to work more deeply and with more
time with these fragile communities than they would with a more
typical peer.
Mr. Morelle. And before I run out of time here, on that
topic of time learning, you mentioned 12-month-a-year school
years. Do you expect that is going to be the norm around the
country as we try to get back that lost time?
Mr. Gordon. Thank you, Congressman.
In Cleveland we already have several year-around schools,
and the reason we moved to that is we know from the evidence
that 3 weeks is about the length of break before you actually
do start seeing regression in learning. And so we have 10 weeks
on, 3 weeks off.
I would have the whole system there if I could afford it.
It is a cost issue because you are bringing in your faculty, in
our case, 8 more weeks to give them a learning time and
students for 4 more weeks a year, but it is the right way to go
and really lets us rethink the old agrarian calendar.
Mr. Morelle. I yield back my time.
Thank you very much.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
The gentleman from North Carolina, Mr. Walker. The
gentleman from North Carolina, Mr. Walker.
The gentleman from Kentucky, Mr. Comer.
Mr. Comer. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
I would like to begin by stating again for the record that
I am here in the committee room. I believe that it is important
for Congress to lead by example. I believe it is very important
that we reopen our economy and that Congress should again lead
by example, which takes me to my first question.
A lot of my colleagues have been stating the obvious that
many school districts across America, if not every school
district, is going to be faced with huge budget challenges.
These challenges are obviously a result of the COVID-19 and
having to temporarily shut the economy down. That is why I
think it is imperative that we get serious about reopening the
economy.
Some States have done a much better job of safely reopening
their economy than others, but I think that is something that
is important to know as we talk about funding challenges in
public education as we move forward.
One of the complaints that I have always had and heard from
school superintendents, school board members, administrators,
and school districts is that a lot of times they have adequate
budgets, but they don't have flexibility to spend the money in
programs that they see fit that work better in the local areas.
Mr. Johnson, are there flexibilities in the Federal law
that have not yet been addressed today that would be useful for
local school districts?
Mr. Johnson. Yes. I will just highlight, again, that we
would appreciate flexibility around the high stakes assessments
at the end of the year. There is work going on around that, but
possibly we can put that into overdrive in order to have that
be something that can help address the COVID-19 crisis as well.
And then I will speak on behalf of the professionals in my
Exceptional Children's Department at the State agency in North
Carolina. They would appreciate some flexibility on the
timelines per their requirements.
Mr. Johnson. Not throwing out any requirements when it
comes to serving our students who honestly need the most
service from educators, but looking at the timelines for those
requirements given just the unbelievable challenges that we
will all face coming up this next school year.
Mr. Comer. Thank you very much for that.
And, Mr. Chairman, hopefully that is something that this
committee can do in a bipartisan way to give our local school
districts more flexibility as we move forward.
Speaking of bipartisan, at the beginning of the pandemic, I
partnered with my Democrat colleague, Representative Bonamici,
to introduce legislation which allows school officials to
distribute food in any number of settings across our most
crucial nutrition programs and allow for flexibility on meal
components if food supply procurement is disrupted.
I am grateful that we took this step forward to prioritize
families and children affected by the coronavirus and am very
happy that President Trump signed it into law. However, having
worked with the food service directors during my time as
Commissioner of Agriculture in Kentucky and now as a member of
this Committee and the Agriculture Committee, I know these
issues don't go away as soon as students step back through the
classroom doors and recognize the amount of planning that goes
into the execution of our school meal programs. Some districts
are even considering adopting modified schedules or other
alternative education delivery methods for the fall semester.
Mr. Johnson, can you describe how the flexibility offered
by the U.S. Department of Ag has been helpful in that, and are
there any waivers that could be extended that would be
especially beneficial as you plan for the next school year?
Mr. Johnson. Absolutely. Thank you for that question.
This is something where the waivers have been very crucial
for meal delivery services to our students in two main
categories that you can think of: One, we were using school
buses to deliver meals to students. You might have a group of
students at the school bus stop, you might have parents there
on behalf of their students, but the flexibility around the
rostering and being able to hand out the meals is extremely
helpful.
And then also we had cafeteria and food and nutrition
workers who were in the at-risk category and were not able to
go in and perform their services and being able to use other
school employees to help fill in those roles was very helpful
as well.
We would absolutely encourage the Federal Government to
extend those waivers, and hopefully we can get back into
schools as normal as possible but, heaven forbid, we are back
in a place where it is remote learning and remote meal
delivery, we will absolutely rely on those waivers again.
Mr. Comer. And, Mr. Chairman, one last question if I may.
Mr. Johnson, in your view, what has been the biggest
challenge for districts trying to adapt to distance education,
aside from the lack of broadband in many rural areas, like my
congressional district that has already been discussed heavily
in this committee hearing? What are the other challenges for
school districts trying to adapt to distance education?
Mr. Johnson. People are social creatures by nature and that
is how we learn as well. We don't learn well or meet well over
our screens. That is very true for our younger students, and
the impact a teacher has when they are physically in that
classroom with students cannot be underestimated or ever
undervalued.
Mr. Comer. Thank you.
And hopefully we can get our school districts open just
after Labor Day and try to get things back to normal as quickly
as possible. Thank you.
Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
And I would say there was some feedback in that last
exchange. We could hear okay, but there was a little echo.
Okay. If people in the room would use earphones, that would cut
most of that echo.
The young gentlelady from Pennsylvania, Ms. Wild.
Ms. Wild. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
I would like to direct my first question to Ms. Pringle of
the National Education Association. At the beginning of this
pandemic, many schools moved instruction online and engaged
students in remote learning, but because of the structural
inequities that we know exist in public education systems,
schools with more resources adjusted to remote learning much
more quickly.
In my home State of Pennsylvania 7, the Lehigh Valley of
Pennsylvania, school districts with more resources and higher
income families were able to begin online instruction weeks
before their neighboring school districts which received less
funding and enrolled more low-income students.
The uneven transition to online learning I think
exacerbates learning loss amongst students, meaning that
students will lose the educational and academic progress that
they have once achieved.
So I guess my question, first of all, to you is what
academic effects do you expect to see as a result of these
students' uneven transition to remote learning as we move
forward and hopefully do get children back in the classroom,
students back in the classrooms?
And also I want, as part of that, have some students been
disproportionately left behind in the transition to remote
learning?
Ms. Pringle. Thank you, Congresswoman. Absolutely, we know
that we could have anticipated it because we know that over 12
million of our students across the country did not have access
to the internet or access to digital tools that allowed them to
continue their learning.
And we saw things vary exactly the way you described it,
based on whether or not those school districts, those families,
those communities had resources or whether they did not. We
have too many of our students who are living in poverty, are
students of color who did not--not only didn't have those
digital tools, but they had parents who had two and three jobs
who were essential workers and couldn't sit down with them to
actually make sure they were connected.
Ms. Pringle. Or those families might have had a device, but
everyone in the family had to use the same device. And if that
parent had to use those devices to continue to work, then we
saw that our students weren't able to join. And so we saw--we
heard from teachers all over the country where they had maybe
only 50 percent of their students who were present in the
classrooms.
They know that the learning for those students is
interrupted, and so they are looking at ways right now that
they can reach out, and they have been doing that after hours,
reaching out to students and parents, and trying to make up for
that, dropping off learning packets, going and sitting outside
of students' homes, by the way. We have teachers who are doing
that too.
But we know that these are issues. This digital divide is
not new. In fact, we put together a homework gap collaboration
back in February before our students were out, because we knew
that gap existed. And so we are fighting hard to make sure that
the Federal Government provides the resources to close that
gap, and asking for that additional $4 billion to do just that,
to invest in the E-Rate program.
Ms. Wild. Thank you, and you anticipated my next question,
but first let me say that I do believe that most teachers, even
in good times, go above and beyond what is expected of them and
required of them, to--that they really have a passion for
helping students learn, and they are certainly to be commended.
So my next question is, how can schools start preparing to
address the learning loss that the students have experienced as
a result of this interrupted school year? What kind of
challenges do you think that the students and the teachers are
going to face? As we move into the fall, let's assume that
everybody is back in school.
Ms. Pringle. So Congresswoman, let me tell you what we are
talking about with our teachers in the country. That, you know,
we have a shared responsibility to meet the needs of all
students. And so we are asking everyone to come together and do
their part. So we are having those conversations right now,
trying to make sure that everything our students need,
including those social, emotional needs, are being met, and we
are beginning that work before they go back to school.
But even when they get back to school, we need to make sure
that they come back to school in safe environments. If our
students don't feel safe and supported, they can't learn. So we
are working hard with community members, with educators, with
lawmakers, elected and appointed officials, to make sure that
we have the resources our students need, our educators need,
our parents need, to meet the needs of every one of our
students.
Ms. Wild. Thank you very much.
Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
My distinguished colleague from Virginia, Mr. Cline.
Mr. Cline. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I want to also echo the
comments of everyone on this committee who praised the
hardworking men and women in our educational systems at the
local level for the great job they did in the spring, getting
our kids educated back home, getting them the information they
needed, and even now, preparing for the fall term. It is a
really, really outstanding job that everyone has come together
to do.
This committee has the important task of working on policy
that can better allow future generations to flourish through
having a quality education. We must remember that policy we
implement in response to COVID-19 now will have lasting
implications on students' opportunities in the future.
I am glad we are having a hearing today on the topic of
budgeting as it relates to education, but I believe the focus
needs to be on evaluating what we have already spent before
rushing to put our Nation unnecessarily deeper in debt. We owe
it to students to carefully examine our spending instead of
blindly spending more hard-earned tax dollars.
During the 2018-2019 school year, the Federal Government
contributed $59 billion to education. States spent $362
billion, and localities spent $332 billion. Additionally,
almost $79 billion came from other sources, mostly coming from
private philanthropies. This comes to a total of $832 billion.
As these numbers show, the majority of funding for
education comes from States and localities. And from my time
serving in the Virginia House of Delegates--and I know the
chairman did as well--I know how important it is to maintain
those strong fiscal ties as close as possible to the homes and
schools they serve. Each State and district have unique needs
and priorities, and government should be enabling those closest
to it to serve them as they best see fit.
The CARES Act nearly doubled the amount of core Federal
education funding provided to school districts for fiscal year
2020 by providing $13.5 billion to State and school districts
through the Educational Stabilization Fund. It provides $3
billion to governors who to award grant to elementary and
secondary schools, institutions of higher education, and other
education-related entities, and gave the Secretary the ability
to allow for more flexibility in repurposing current funds for
technology needs. And that is something that we want to focus
on, that flexibility.
Mr. Johnson, there has been a lot of discussion today about
how the Federal Government needs to spend billions more
[Inaudible.] taxpayer funds, but how could the Federal
Government use that flexibility to assist States and school
districts in other ways? Are there flexibilities in Federal law
that have not been yet--been used to help those States and
localities that could be useful?
Mr. Johnson. Thank you for the question. Again, I sound
like a broken record, but we would love to have flexibility
from the high stakes standardized assessments. Understanding
that we are not going to replace accountability, because when
the Federal Government invests in education, you want to make
sure that students are getting the education that they so well
deserve. That would be a true highlight.
And then beyond that, I think probably share the sentiments
of many people testifying today that with Federal dollars that
are coming for this crisis, do not put too many strings
attached to them. Let districts spend that on the needs that
they have.
Mr. Cline. And to what extent are you engaging with
businesses and other private sector entities to assist with
school districts' responses to COVID-19?
Mr. Johnson. We actually have had a lot of educational
vendors step up and offer their platforms for free. That has
been a local district decision. We just want to make sure they
are high quality. We have had the industries that help with the
connectivity provide services for free during the crisis.
Hopefully that is something that can continue.
And on another topic, you know, we are making sure that we
connect the business and job world to what is going on in the
classroom, so we better connect students to see all the
pathways.
In North Carolina, a great example, even in the midst of
this COVID-19, are the jobs that are available in some kind of
computing or coding services. We have tens of thousands of jobs
still open, even with this crisis, and that could be a high
valued credential, or an associate's degree, or if students
want a 4-year degree, we are making sure we are partner with
business to make sure students know their path.
Mr. Cline. Great. Thank you very much.
Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
The gentleman from California, Mr. Harder.
Mr. Harder. Thank you. It is good to see you, Mr. Chairman,
and thank you so much for holding this hearing.
My first question is for Dr. Leachman. Dr. Leachman, it is
clear that we are looking at the kind of strain on school
districts that we haven't seen in a decade. How did States,
families, and school districts cope with the massive fiscal
strain of the Great Recession? And how do you expect this
crisis to be similar or different than what we just went
through the last decade?
Mr. Leachman. Thank you, Congressman, I appreciate that
question. As I briefly mentioned earlier, the Federal aid that
was provided under the Recovery Act, during the Great Recession
was really important, but it only covered about a quarter of
State budget shortfalls, and it ended too soon, when States
were still struggling to meet their needs. As a result, States
enacted lots of layoffs and cuts, and those layoffs and
spending reductions slowed the economy's recovery in a
significant way.
And the impact at the school level was pronounced, and so
just to take a couple of examples, in Georgia, the school year
was shrunk, there were reductions. Arizona ended its full-day
kindergarten. Those kinds of effects were widespread, and in
many cases are still with us today. I mentioned that there are,
even heading into the pandemic, there were 77,000 fewer
teachers and other school workers in our schools in this
country than there were when the Great Recession took hold, and
yet we are trying to teach one and a half million more kids.
Mr. Harder. Thank you, Dr. Leachman. What lessons do you
think we can learn from the Great Recession to better support
States and school districts during this pandemic?
What did we do right, that we should do again, or what did
we maybe not do that we should think about now?
Mr. Leachman. Well, substantially, it is really crucial,
the aid that was provided to States and localities made a big
difference. Numerous economists across the political spectrum
have looked at this issue and found significant bang for the
buck in State and local aid because it keeps economic activity
going. It makes sure that you are not laying off people at
exactly the worst time.
But we should take a lesson from the Recovery Act in
assuring that the aid that we provide is enough, so that States
don't have to do those layoffs and make those cuts, and that it
stays in place as long as it is needed. As I mentioned, the
Recovery Act aid ended in 2011. In 2012, you can see it happen,
you can see that States imposed cuts that year that are still
with us today. So it needs to be enough, and it needs to stay
on as long as it is needed.
Mr. Harder. Thank you. My next question is for Ms. Pringle.
Ms. Pringle, what actions can we take to make sure that we are
protecting teachers and students, especially those who are in
at-risk groups, from COVID-19? What can Congress do to help
them out?
Ms. Pringle. Well, the language in the HEROES Act,
Congressman, goes a long way to do just that. Making sure that
we have PPE for our students, as well as our educators, making
sure that we are addressing the needs that already existed in
buildings that were not safe for our students, that had issues
with rats and rodents, poor air quality, those kinds of issues
need to be addressed, and we--
And the funding that is provided for in the HEROES Act can
do some of that. It is not enough, as I said before, but at
least it is taking the steps in the right direction.
We also need to make sure that we have enough educators,
not only our teachers, but we need our support staff who
support them, from school secretaries to para professionals, to
bus drivers. We need to make sure that we have additional
counselors and nurses. We have to be able to address
[Inaudible.] as well. So we have got to make sure we have the
funding to do those things.
Mr. Harder. Thank you, Ms. Pringle.
Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. Thank you.
The gentleman from Idaho, Mr. Fulcher? The gentleman from
Idaho, Mr. Fulcher?
The gentleman from Kansas, Mr. Watkins? The gentleman from
Kansas, Mr. Watkins?
The gentleman from Texas, Mr. Wright? The gentleman from
Texas, Mr. Wright?
The gentleman from Pennsylvania, Mr. Meuser?
Mr. Meuser. Thank you, Chairman, and thank you, Ranking
Member Dr. Foxx. Appreciate all those testifying today being
here with us on a very important subject. Certainly it is
absolutely essential we safely and responsibly open our schools
to all of those who can attend. It is equally as important as
safely and responsibly opening our economy.
Mr. Johnson, the plans that you have outlined and work on
and discuss and strategize, do they include funding for PPEs
and other safety precautions, such as plexiglass and perhaps
new areas for spacing out the students properly?
Mr. Johnson. The short answer is no, we have not gotten to
that decision point yet. There is work for the North Carolina
governor's Department of Health and Human Services to work on
funding for the school nurses and PPE for them. But again under
the governor's requirements, we are not looking at having the
requirement for PPE.
The Federal CARES Act dollars that will be going to
districts, that is something districts could use that money for
if they decided to go beyond the guideline from our North
Carolina Department of Health and Human Services.
Mr. Meuser. Right. Are you looking at what other States are
doing? Are you having a good level of communication on seeing
who might have some best ideas and doing comparisons?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, absolutely. We have been--a lot of
education chiefs around the Nation have been in very frequent
contact to share best practices. We also have been making sure
that we listen to staff and teachers on the ground in North
Carolina, and also we are watching other Nations who have
already opened up schools to see how they are handling the
situation.
Mr. Meuser. Okay. Great. Are you beginning to figure out a
budget estimate for that first tranche that I asked about,
related to the PPEs and general safety within the classroom in
school?
Mr. Johnson. We are at the very beginning stages of that. I
would not be able to provide you a number now from North
Carolina. What we are watching is, again, North Carolina, the
State government gave $50 million to districts, we are watching
how that was spent. It has not all been spent yet.
And then we are watching very closely how the CARES Act
funding is spent. The highest priority from the districts, that
they note in their applications, are connectivity and devices,
as well as the extra supply that would be needed for when
students and teachers safely return to school in the fall.
Mr. Meuser. Are you beginning to weight it somewhat by
where a hotspot was versus a more rural area that had very few
cases? Have you taken that into consideration in your equation?
Mr. Johnson. Yes. Yes, that will be taken into
consideration. Our North Carolina State Board of Education will
be making a determination on where the funds go that they have
held back. And I do believe we will be addressing, with an eye
towards equity and where the need is, especially when it comes
to connectivity, in giving those dollars out.
And the governor of North Carolina has indicated that he
wants his plan to be statewide, but it could be regional based
on the metrics.
Mr. Meuser. Liability comes up all the time in higher ed.
It is a significant concern certainly within pre-K through 12.
What are your thoughts there? A State solution is one thing, a
Federal solution is probably better. What are your thoughts on
liability?
Mr. Johnson. We would welcome any help that we can get on
the Federal level. This is something we are looking at what
already--already the protections in place in North Carolina
State level, if we can do more, but the more we can do for our
educators, the better, and any Federal help would be very
welcomed.
Mr. Meuser. Okay. Is there serious consideration being
given to a safety officer in a school, for instance, to just
assure and monitor that the safety standards continue?
Mr. Johnson. We have not had discussions about that on a
State level. That is something that absolutely would be school
by school, but it is an idea that is on the table. And local
districts right now are in the process of making their plans,
to plan for the governor's requirements and guideline, and they
will be submitting those as they have been finalized.
Mr. Meuser. Great. Well, thank you.
Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. Thank you, and again, for people
in the room, if you would use earphones, it would eliminate
some of the feedback. We could hear all of the questions, so
thank you. I thank the gentleman from Pennsylvania.
The gentle lady from Georgia, Mrs. McBath.
Mrs. McBath. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you so much
for this timely and relevant hearing today, and I want to thank
all of our witnesses for testifying, lending your time and your
expertise. And I just want to say, you know, we are at a very
critical point in our Nation's history. And 3 months ago we hit
the coronavirus pandemic, and now in the midst of this
pandemic, we are finally addressing another pandemic that has
plagued our country for generations. We are talking about
really the racism and the systemic inequities that causes this
in our public school system.
So millions of jobs have been lost due to COVID-19, and
States, we are seeing, are decreasing the revenue for the
upcoming fiscal year. My own State of Georgia, we have just
been made known that--it has been announced that about 11
percent of a reduction there will be in our budget for next
year, which is just so devastating for us to undergo.
And unfortunately, as we all know, when States start
cutting their budgets, education is one of the first areas to
be cut, and you know, our students frankly really do deserve
much better.
This fall school districts will be faced with how they are
going to educate their students while staying socially
distanced and how to address the racial inequities in the
school system and the lack of diversity in our teaching
workforce. So all of which will be exacerbated by budget
shortfalls. And I am glad that we are here today to really
start talking about finding solutions to these problems.
And my first question is for Mr. Gordon. Mr. Gordon, there
has been a lot of discussion about reopening schools and the
normal, returning to normal, as we say, but you know it is
really going to be a new normal. Given the health, education,
and racial justice crisis in our country, what can Congress do
to make sure that our students receive an education that meets
or exceeds the standards that they deserve in the coming year?
And we know that Mr. Leachman just kind of touched upon this a
little bit earlier today, but could you expand on that, or do
you have any thoughts?
Mr. Gordon. Thank you, Congresswoman. I would just say that
I think that this is a really important moment. Tamir Rice was
my 12-year-old little boy in Cleveland who was shot 2 seconds
after police got to a scene, so this is personal for me. What
is different is that, in all of the past, we had to change the
existing system. That is what I have been doing in Cleveland
for the last 13 years is pushing against the existing system.
The current education system, as we know it, has been
obliterated. So we not only can't go back there, as you have
heard from my colleagues, but we don't have to. We can actually
design systems that are more fair and just and good for our
kids.
One of the things we know is that children who are living
in deep poverty--Cleveland has the highest childhood poverty of
any major city--it is not just education; it is the entire
environment. I actually, for a period of time, left urban
education and worked in one of the most affluent school systems
in Ohio, almost exclusively white, and the learning that was
happening was not just the time in my classroom, but it was the
learning happening when they were with family, all of the
enrichment experiences that they had, many of which my kids
will never have access to. And so I think that Congress really
has an opportunity to seize this, to say how do we, in the
short-term--and that being the next several years--continue to
support the most fragile children through the Federal programs
that I mentioned earlier, but how do we do it with an eye on
diversifying wealth in our communities, because that is the
exit.
If you can't own a home, like many Black and Brown people
simply cannot because they can't get a mortgage, you never have
wealth to leverage against to send your child to college or to
do the things that middle-income families have.
So, I would really urge Congress to take this opportunity
to evaluate how do we start reintroducing wealth into
communities so that these communities become self-sustaining
and carry forward as opposed to simply continuing to fund the
programming that has kind of reinforced the status quo. You
can't log out until there is something else for it, so I think
this is an opportunity unlike any other.
Mrs. McBath. But thank you so much for that answer.
And Ms. Pringle, according to the National Center for
Education, both statistics, the teacher workforce is nearly 80
percent white, while a majority, and growing, of the public-
school students are of color.
What are your thoughts to use this moment as a means to
reboot, to diversify the teacher workforce? And what happens to
students when they actually have the opportunity to be able to
be taught by individuals and teachers that look like them?
Ms. Pringle. Thank you, Congresswoman, and I want to thank
the chairman, because he has been leading those efforts as
well. We have known for far too long that our teaching
workforce does not reflect our--what our students are coming to
school facing from their communities, from their homes. We know
there is a racial disparity in our teachers versus our
students, and that has been for a long time.
So, we need to do something at this moment about that, and
I want to say this. Not only does it impact in a positive way
our students of color, but all students need to see teachers of
color as well. It improves the learning of all of our students.
And so as we think about how we are allocating resources
from the HEROES Act, which we know we will fight so hard to
make sure we have those funds, that some of those funds will be
used, not only to recruit Black and Brown teachers--and this is
really important to remember--we have our teachers of color
leaving the teaching profession at a disproportionate rate. So
we have to focus on their retention. We know we can do that, if
we have the resources to change what is happening in our
schools.
Mrs. McBath. Thank you so much, and my time is up. Thank
you for your answers.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman from South Dakota,
Mr. Johnson? The gentleman from South Dakota, Mr. Johnson?
The gentleman from Pennsylvania, Mr. Keller?
Mr. Keller. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Glad to be able to be
here in Washington to participate in this important hearing.
And again, having gone toward the end here, many of my
questions have been answered, but I do have a few things that
did pop up. You know, in looking at what we have already done
as far as CARES funding--and I will speak specifically to
Pennsylvania--between the governor's Emergency Education Relief
Fund, the Elementary and Secondary School Emergency Relief
Fund, and the Higher Education Emergency Relief Fund,
Pennsylvania has received over $713 billion. And when we look
at this--$713 million, sorry. And when we look at all the money
that has been received, it hasn't all been disbursed yet.
And when looking at what we are doing in going forward, I
think it is a little premature to say we need to do more,
because I think the point has already been made, that our kids
are going to be the--our students, the ones we care so much
about, are going to end up paying this debt back. So I think we
need to make sure it is very well invested.
And my good colleague from Pennsylvania, Mr. Meuser, asked
a couple questions regarding budgeting, and, you know, so do we
know if the States or what percentage of the States--and I
guess I will ask you, Mr. Johnson since you have been working
with North Carolina--do you know how much of the money in North
Carolina has already been distributed?
Mr. Johnson. It has not been much of the money. Again, $95
million was to the governor. That has not gone out yet; $230
million came from the General Assembly through the large relief
package. That is in the process of going out. Then the
Education Stabilization Fund is roughly $400 million in North
Carolina. That has just finished through its applications, and
districts will be applying, will be accessing those and drawing
down, but that has not happened yet.
Mr. Keller. So we think that many of the States are
probably in the same situation where they have not driven all
the money out yet?
Mr. Johnson. I can't answer for other States. It might be a
State by State, but I can tell you, North Carolina, we have not
done the governor's fund yet, we have not done the General
Assembly's fund. All that is in the works, of allotments and
getting it out, but also the school districts have not drawn
down their funds yet either.
And the State relief funds, which is just North Carolina,
the $50 million, not all that has been spent yet either. And so
we are watching that closely, but that will give us an
indication of where districts are spending for their need.
Mr. Keller. And I guess I would follow up on the need,
because I have heard many people tell us that this isn't
enough, but do we know what--any budget numbers for what
districts think they are going to need moving forward for their
plans, whether it is PPE, whether it is distance education, and
those things? Do we have any idea what that might be costing?
Mr. Johnson. There are definitely estimates out there. I
would say in North Carolina, we do not have hard numbers. We
have plans that range from recommendations from the governor to
requirements. At districts right now, we are trying to put
together how they will respond to those plans. So we should
have those numbers in the weeks ahead.
And then we also have the CARES Act funding that will help
support those plans as they come closer to fruition.
Mr. Keller. So would it be fair to say that some of the
plans that are forthcoming would have funding through money
already appropriated by Congress?
Mr. Johnson. Yes. That is absolutely fair to say for--
especially I can say that for North Carolina, yes.
Mr. Keller. Yeah, I think that might be a lot of the case,
you know, across our Nation. In looking at Pennsylvania, in
addition to the CARES funding--excuse me--the stuff for
education, there was also the $150 billion, and Pennsylvania
got $4.9 billion into the treasury. And they are still sitting
on, you know, over $1 billion of that money too.
So there has been a lot of things that have been done to
help the States, and I think the biggest--or the best thing we
can do as a Nation is safely reopen our economy. Because as
been mentioned, many of the things are because of budget
shortfalls.
And some States I would imagine have less of a budget
shortfall because of the way they handled their reopening,
their closing, their reopening, more so than other States.
Because I know in Pennsylvania, it was a total mess. The
governor didn't have a good plan and shut businesses and had
waivers and a whole bunch of different, a lot of confusion on
top of an already tenuous situation. So wouldn't you think that
reopening our economy safely might be helpful to our districts?
Mr. Johnson. Absolutely. We should reopen safely, and we
should get students and teachers back to school as safely as we
possibly can. That would be the ideal situation for--I believe
everyone would agree that would be the ideal situation. We have
to make sure we do it safely.
Mr. Keller. I appreciate that. And that even goes even for
our committee hearings, because I did hear some of our
educators on the meeting here today mention about how it is
good to be able to see the reaction of people where they are
students, between the student and the teacher, and how they are
interacting.
I think that is still valuable too when we are talking
about Members of Congress communicating with one another or
with the witnesses that are here in the room. I think there is
a lot of value in making sure that we lead by example and we
make sure that we are back doing the people's work. We are
supposed to be meeting in Congress, not in our living rooms.
Thank you.
I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentlelady from Washington,
Dr. Schrier?
Ms. Schrier. Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to our
witnesses for your compelling testimonies. I first just want to
say that it is a joy to be able to do this safely from my home,
to see your faces. If we were in person, we would be in masks,
and I just appreciate this effort to be in the 21st Century.
I have two areas of questions. The first is a really quick
one and just regards public education funding, and the second
is about issues with the reopening of schools. And so
education, no question, is one of the most important
investments we make as a country.
Dr. Leachman, could you break down super quickly, in terms
of percentage funding of K12 education, how much the Federal,
State, and local governments contribute?
Mr. Leachman. Yes, Congresswoman. States provide 47
percent, local governments, mostly school districts, provide 45
percent, and the remainder is from the Federal Government.
Ms. Schrier. And so given that data--I just want to really
drive home this point that I know you want to make--what is the
number one, single, most important thing Congress can do to
support K12 education right now?
Mr. Leachman. Provide aid to States and localities that
they can get to schools, so they don't have to lay people off
and make cuts that we know will hurt our kids.
Ms. Schrier. Thank you. I appreciate that. And, of course,
the need for State funding is even more important for
underserved communities because States can make up for
differences that local governments can't get from property
values, for example.
The second question is--I am a pediatrician. I like to make
evidence-based decisions. My first question, by the way, will
be for Ms. Pringle, but I first wanted to just say, there is a
lot we still don't know about this virus. We do know that in
the general population, 25 to 50 percent of the people with
this infection don't have symptoms. We know they can still
spread it. We know there are several days that they can spread.
We know that masks are effective, and so I am surprised that
North Carolina will not be requiring masks in the classroom.
We also know that children, at least acutely, are not so
much affected and that this inflammatory syndrome is rare. And
so the goal here is not necessarily to protect the children but
to protect the teachers and the community at large and the
families, and the families who are most at risk like the
families in Cleveland are exactly the ones whose parents are
more likely to die from this illness.
So I wanted to ask, Ms. Pringle, first of all, can we learn
anything from other countries that have opened schools, who has
done it successfully, and how have they managed to do that?
Ms. Pringle. So, Congresswoman, first of all, let me thank
you for taking care of our babies. It is absolutely essential
that we figure out how to open our schools safely. And there
are a lot of lessons for those countries who have taken those
safeguards, to protect their students. And by the way, you are
right, all that you just said is correct.
But here is the thing, everything impacts learning.
Everything. So if our students' families are not secure in
their health, in housing, in economics, then that is going to
impact their learning. So we can't only think about what is
happening in schools, we have to think about what is happening
in their communities.
And so when we look to other countries, they have those
social safety nets in place already. And with the pandemic,
they realize that is where they needed to invest. They needed
to make sure that the entire, the whole family, was healthy and
they got the support they needed. They needed to make sure that
their families--that the parents were earning an income so they
could feed their children. You know our babies can't learn if
they are hungry. So there are all of those lessons to look at.
Ms. Schrier. Oh, I ran out of time. Okay, thank you. I
yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentleman from North
Carolina, Dr. Murphy? Dr. Murphy?
Mr. Thompson. He is on. He is just trying to figure out how
to unmute is all.
Chairman Scott. Okay. He has to unmute.
Mr. Thompson. There we go.
Mr. Murphy. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you, Mr. Johnson
for--I know it has been a long day for all our witnesses, and I
appreciate you guys coming and sharing your expertise.
Obviously we are in a very, very challenging time. None of us
have lived through this before, and as I have said many times,
we are kind of building a plane while we are flying it.
I think everybody in this committee room and everybody
sitting at home shares in the belief that we should care about
our children and their education. That is what their future is
about, educating them. And I think we all share a deep concern
in that. I think we have some different ideas about how that
best can be achieved, but I think we are all together on the
same page about how we get there.
You know, parents with kids being at home have been
challenged. They are not trained teachers, and a lot of them
don't want to be after this episode, and are happy to give
their kids back. We need to get those kids back into school
because not only the education that comes from a book, but also
the education that comes from socialization, and that is
critical.
And you know, balancing these things, balancing their
safety, balancing their welfare, is critical. It can be done.
Other countries have demonstrated that it can be done. And I
believe if we keep hiding under the sheet, we are not doing our
children any good in the future. I do think that children do
not learn nearly as well from online learning as they do in
person. I don't believe they do--they learn from computers as
well as they do from textbooks and writing those things down.
Maybe I am old-fashioned that way.
But I think we are all on the same page, and I think we are
really working towards the same goal. I appreciate what you
guys are doing.
Just a couple questions because I know it has been a long
day that I am going to direct towards Mr. Johnson. Thank you
for the work that you are doing in North Carolina. Just, you
know, I just want to clear up a few things about charter
schools. Just if you don't mind answering these questions.
Charter schools teach students, correct, Mr. Johnson?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, that is correct.
Mr. Murphy. Okay. So they teach students. And in North
Carolina, charter schools are open to any student that applies
to them, correct?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, that is correct.
Mr. Murphy. Okay. So that would--that education in that
charter school is provided by public sources, correct?
Mr. Johnson. That is correct.
Mr. Murphy. Okay. So charter schools in North Carolina are
public schools?
Mr. Johnson. Yes. In North Carolina, we label schools
traditional public schools and public charter schools, yes. We
also have a menu of options of magnet schools and cooperative
innovative high schools, a lot of school choice in North
Carolina that ultimately helps students.
Mr. Murphy. Okay. Well, great. I just didn't want some
misconception that kids who are going to charter schools are
privileged or something. Every opportunity is affordable to any
student, and a lot of the burden is borne upon their parents to
take the initiative--which some parents do, some parents
don't--about educating their children. So I just wanted to
clarify that.
You know, I feel like sometimes some of my colleagues want
it both ways, where they want to get the kids educated, but
they also want to keep them sheltered, which we all do, but
understand the reality of things is that a lot of students--and
we talk especially about minority students--either don't have
access or don't have the social backing, you know, to get
online learning.
So how do you, in your opinion, in just a very short time,
how do we balance that moving forward? How do we do that for
our children in North Carolina? What is the best move forward?
Because I do believe that online learning, while it has its
place, does not have--it should not take the priority place for
our children.
Mr. Johnson. Well, what we are very much hoping to have a
decision on by July 1, we are really hoping that our governor
will implement his plan A, that is, getting students, as many
as possible, as safely as possible, back into school buildings.
That means that social distancing will be a part of that
strategy, but it won't hamper any students from getting into
the building. And there will be options for students who might
be at high-risk, for teachers who might be at high risk to
continue remote learning or to have other set-ups in the
physical school building.
But we know that we really want to get our students and
teachers back into the physical classrooms because that is
where most learning occurs.
Mr. Murphy. All right. I believe that is my time. I thank
you, all the witnesses for coming today, and I appreciate the
work that you guys all do.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I will yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. The gentlelady from Illinois,
Ms. Underwood?
The gentle lady from Illinois, Ms. Underwood?
The gentle lady from Illinois is recognized for 5 minutes
to ask questions. Ms. Underwood, can you hear me?
Ms. Underwood. On a press conference.
Chairman Scott. Oh, okay.
The gentlelady from Connecticut, Mrs. Hayes?
Mrs. Hayes. Thank you, Mr. Chair. A couple things. Can you
hear me okay? Wait, I can't hear you now.
Chairman Scott. I can hear you.
Mrs. Hayes. Oh, okay. I have heard many Members talk about
the fact that we are doing this hearing remotely. I just would
like to just make a statement that in the over a year since I
have been in Congress, I have sat in hours' long committee
hearings and markup, gavel to gavel, and seen empty chairs on
both sides. I have seen hearings where Members weren't even
there for testimony and just came in to vote, and I have always
assumed that they were working remotely and listening from
their offices or the anteroom. So I remind you that it is just
geography, and we can still continue this work.
Thank you, everyone, for being here. Thank you, Mr. Chair,
for holding this hearing.
Ms. Pringle, you brought up something earlier that I want
to touch on, and you talked about we need to--we have invested
in bailing out businesses and all these other things, and we
need to do the same thing for public education.
I have heard my colleagues use terms like Herculean efforts
that teachers have done or are referred to teachers as
superheroes. Yet we are not willing to make those investments.
And I think we all want to be good stewards over taxpayer
money. We invested $650 billion into the Payroll Protection
Plan. Half of that was allocated, and then we went back with a
second round of funding before that first round was even used
up, because we anticipated that this money would be needed.
The Constitution says nothing about small businesses, last
I heard, but we knew that because of the pandemic and what was
going on, that this was something that we needed to make an
investment in, for the impending crisis.
So again, as I have said so many times before, we are
always thanking teachers and talking about how wonderful they
are and the Herculean efforts that they are making, yet fail to
invest when teachers need us.
I would like for you to tell us just a little bit about--
you talked about something that we haven't really talked a lot
about--is those, the trauma that kids will have returning to
the classroom. Can you talk a little bit about that and talk
about why it is important to make those investments before we
get to the bottom of the pot, when there is no money left, and
it is empty? How can--since we already can anticipate what will
happen.
You are muted.
Ms. Pringle. Thank you. Congresswoman Hayes, it is so good
to see you. This was an issue brought up by teachers within
your own State that I talked with last week. And this is not
new. We know that particularly in our vulnerable communities,
our students with special needs, our Black and Brown students,
our students living in poverty, that they come to us already
with trauma. Food insecurity, housing insecurity, economic
insecurity, all of those things are finding those ways into our
schools anyway.
We know that too often they rely on schools for their
meals, not just for themselves but their families, as well as
healthcare. So that is already there.
Now on top of that, we have the pandemic. We know that our
students are seeing family members get sick, some who have
experienced tragic losses, and we know they will come back to
us having the need for someone that is there, trained
professionals, who will help to meet those needs. You are a
teacher. You know if you don't meet those needs, they are not
going to learn. It is not going to happen.
And so for us to be thinking about starting school with
less teachers, less counselors, less nurses, are you kidding
me? It is when we need more of those educators to surround our
students with that support. This is what we need our Members of
Congress to step up to. We need those additional supports for
our students.
They are watching. Congresswoman Hayes, they are watching,
right? They are already traumatized by what is happening with
the uncertainty in the world. And now we are seeing killings in
our communities of color, and they are wondering why, why is it
happening, will they be next? We have got to create the space
for them to have those conversations, and we have got to know
that we have educators there to provide them with the
individual attention they must have so they can learn.
Mrs. Hayes. Thank you, Ms. Pringle. You are absolutely
right, I do know these things. It is just, I wanted it on the
record for my colleagues to hear, because I questioned when we
start our first COVID relief package, included airlines, and
now we are talking about budget cuts for schools. Blows my
mind.
My next question is for Mr. Gordon. How do you plan to
address the needs of students who come from vulnerable--who
themselves are vulnerable or come from households where they
have members of their family with health conditions and may not
feel comfortable returning to school in the fall?
So even if the schools open, if kids or families don't feel
safe, how do we address those needs?
Mr. Gordon. So in our district, we are anticipating having
three to five different scenarios that we can turn on or off,
dependent on the health and safety factors that are in our
community, and one of those is those families that are either
physically vulnerable and cannot return, or emotionally
vulnerable and will not. And so we are planning to deepen our
investments in homeschooling and E-school options. We used to
have that in kind of a contract. We think we need our teachers
trained to do that, as well as deepening our investments in
social and emotional learning practices.
We have had over a decade of working with a collaborative
of academic, social and emotional learning, so that we can help
kids and families make these transitions safely and emotionally
safely back into our school.
We are right now running remote hotlines where we are
watching for signs of neglect or anxiety or those sorts of
things, so that we can connect our students to social workers
or mental health services, and we will keep deepening those
practices as well.
So it is a blend of creating environments where students
and families can be physically and emotionally safe, and then
providing the support to move them into more open environments
to the extent that it is reasonable and safe to do so.
Mrs. Hayes. Thank you, Mr. Chair. That is all I have.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. Did the gentleman from South
Dakota have an opportunity to ask questions?
Mr. Johnson of South Dakota. I have not yet, sir, no.
Chairman Scott. All right. The gentleman is recognized for
5 minutes.
Mr. Johnson of South Dakota. Thank you very much. My
question would be for Mr. Johnson.
Mr. Thompson, the gentleman from Pennsylvania, asked some
questions about school lunch, but I was just curious, as we
look forward, what should we--I mean, the next time we have
this incredibly disruptive experience to onsite education, what
do we make sure we do differently as far as the nutritional
needs of the students?
Mr. Johnson. Well, this is surely something that has been
amazing from school nutrition services in our State. We really
have done an amazing job, and thank you for the Federal waivers
that actually allowed us to get so many meals out to so many
students.
One thing that we could do better is obviously as we know
more about this virus and what we need to avoid, what we can do
safely, getting students and families more access to the
nutrition sites would be better.
I mean, it is great that we had the ability to deliver
school bus meals, but obviously getting families, and entire
families, meals, is something that would be very important as
well.
Mr. Johnson of South Dakota. So I mean, I will be a little
unfair to you, so feel free to beg off or dodge, because I am
not asking just about your State but what you know about being
involved, you know, nationally. Were there particular things
that the Federal Government didn't do, that we should have
done, to provide your State or others the flexibility they
needed to get this job done, feeding kids?
Mr. Johnson. You know, it is not in my wheelhouse of
expertise, but like many other Americans, we did see that once
the demand at restaurants started going down, there were the
crops and the food that was not in the supply chain. I know
there have been lots of efforts to get that supply chain
focused on helping feed students and families that need it.
That would be something to look at if, heaven forbid, we have
to go into a shutdown again.
But again, we are all hoping that we are not going to be
back in the same situation we were in March come this fall.
Mr. Johnson of South Dakota. Yeah. Very good, very helpful.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for doubling back and giving me an
opportunity. I appreciate it.
You are muted, sir.
Chairman Scott. The gentle lady from Florida, Ms. Shalala?
Thank you.
Ms. Shalala. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, and thank
you for your leadership. I have sat through this whole thing.
It has been a very substantive and I think very thoughtful
hearing.
Mr. Gordon, I am a proud graduate of the Cleveland public
schools. I grew up in Cleveland, and I know the schools very
well, and I am very appreciative of your leadership. I am
interested in data. Many national educational policy
researchers are highlighting the importance of having accurate
and publicly accessible data surrounding the at-home, virtual,
and distance learning. They are doing this to shine a light on
the inevitable gap that you talked about, that will
disproportionately affect low income and minority students who
are already struggling the most, particularly when it comes to
attendance.
While we don't have national or a State database system, of
the 82 or so school districts that have publicly shared some
information on distance learning, only 19 are tracking
attendance. And I am proud to say that one of those is my own
Miami-Dade County public schools--I represent most of Miami-
Dade, of Florida 27--and they are following up with a strategy
to identify those young people.
This has resulted in data showing which students have made
the least progress or spent the least amount of hours taking
classes online, which they are going to use to build an
enhanced summer school program to help them catch up. But
again, this is not the case for every school district in the
country.
How important is it that we collect this kind of data, and
once we have it, how important is it to identify students and
parents who haven't participated in virtual classes and target
them with phone calls, emails, text messages, and actual visits
to get the kids into these summer programs?
Mr. Gordon. Thank you, Congresswoman. And I know you are a
proud Cleveland graduate, so greetings from home.
I would say that it is absolutely critical, but we also,
many of us across the country, did not have the infrastructure
to do the kind of job that Miami-Dade did. I am very familiar
with the work they have done. Fortunately, they had already
made deep investments in one-to-one technology and a single
platform which made it a lot easier for them to do that.
We were not that far along in Cleveland. As an example, we
had a much more autonomous system of choice, which means our
students and families found themselves having multiple
different platforms to work with, if they even had access to
the platform.
We--you know, obviously much more difficult to measure how
many students completed a learning package that we mailed into
a home, than to monitor the dashboards of with these digital
tools.
We are currently researching through, as I mentioned
earlier, our student, teacher, and parent surveys. We have been
harvesting dashboards from all of the platforms to get some
estimates of performance. And when we are permitted to be back
with students, which we are not yet permitted in Ohio, we
expect it is going to be individual assessments to see exactly
where each child is.
We did use some of our summer school resources, though, to
extend learning, remote learning, for those students and
families that we knew we had not reached effectively. And so,
our teachers are still reaching out to those students and
families, and we are still deploying all of our other
enrichment activities that we did in the year, all summer, just
so that we stay connected with those families until we can see
them personally again.
Ms. Shalala. Thank you very much.
Ms. Pringle, if we don't pass the money for State and local
governments that can be passed on to the school districts, do
you expect more layoffs of teachers? I think that is a yes or
no question.
Ms. Pringle. Yes, Congresswoman. We already have had
500,000. We expect, within the next 3 years, probably about 2
million.
Ms. Shalala. Thank you very much. And I resent any
suggestion that the NEA or the AFT are not interested in the
quality of education. My experience is just the opposite.
Mr. Johnson, a quick question. The CDC guidelines have not
been followed in North Carolina. North Carolina still has an
increase in COVID-19 cases. Why is North Carolina talking about
opening schools when they are not following the CDC guidelines?
Isn't it dangerous to open schools when you are still seeing
increases in COVID-19?
Mr. Johnson. We are relying on the decisions by our North
Carolina governor and his health advisers. We hope to get back
to school as safely as possible, because we know that is where
we want students and teachers. But obviously the metrics are
going to determine the decisions that are made by his team.
Ms. Shalala. But the metrics are showing the opposite, that
it is not safe to reopen, according to the CDC. That is my
concern. My concern is, it is hard to open up safely when you
still have increases.
Thank you, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you. Dr. Van Drew of New Jersey--
I understand Ms. Underwood is back.
Ms. Underwood. Yes, Mr. Chairman. Thank you very much.
Our public schools in northern Illinois are the pride of
our community, and like schools across the country, they are
facing incredible financial and educational challenges from the
coronavirus pandemic, which is why Congress prioritized
emergency funding for K12 schools through the bipartisan CARES
Act. And that was almost 3 months ago.
Schools and students are still hurting. They need all of
that money, but Secretary DeVos is holding it hostage,
blatantly violating the intent of the CARES Act. Instead, she
is pushing new, quote, ``equitable services,'' end quote,
guidance, that redirects that funding away from public schools,
counter to decades of education law.
Under Secretary DeVos' guidance, public schools in West
Aurora School District, just down the road, will lose $370,000
of their CARES Act funding. And the Woodstock Community School
District will lose over $75,000 in funds meant to support low-
income students.
Mr. Gordon, these are not just numbers on a page. These are
our kids and our teachers. You wrote in your testimony that
your school district stands to lose a similar share of its
CARES funds under this guidance. What would this mean for the
students and teachers that you serve?
Mr. Gordon. Thank you, Congresswoman.
In our estimate, it is up to $2 million of money that would
otherwise be going to my district which serves the highest
childhood poverty in the Nation. I want to be clear that I am
not opposed to equitable services. The Cleveland parochial
system does serve a number of children in poverty, and those
children deserve every bit of Congress' support as my children
do.
What this guidance is doing, though, is pushing dollars to
children who do not live in poverty and away from those who do,
and that is the problem with it.
I represent the Ohio 8 Coalition. Across our coalition is
$10 million in the State of Ohio's eight large urbans alone,
and we know from the national look that it is millions and
millions more. So it is really critical that the dollars be
distributed in the way that Congress intended because, as I
mentioned, of the $24 million that we believe will be--well, we
know will be drawing down from Ohio, $15 million will be going
to already unplanned expenditures, another $5.6 to my State cut
that already occurred, leaving only $4 million left to even
begin thinking about investing in the next school year.
Ms. Underwood. Thank you so much.
Can you expand on--to Ms. Pringle, can you expand on just
how unprecedented and harmful to public education Secretary
DeVos's actions are from a policy perspective?
Ms. Pringle. So from the beginning--thank you,
Congresswoman Underwood.
From the beginning, Secretary DeVos has made clear that her
goal is to destroy public education, by siphoning money away
from our public schools, by putting it in the hands of those
who are not interested in making sure that our public schools
have the funds they need so they can successfully educate all
of our students. And we know that it is an issue of equity.
We need to understand that for all of our students to be
successful, we have to ensure that we provide the resources
they need when they need it. And the Secretary is doing
everything she can to undermine the will of Congress. And so
let me say again to you, thank you for underscoring that in the
Heroes Act, that she is not given the authority to change what
your intention is to direct those funds to public schools.
Public education is the foundation of this democracy.
Ms. Underwood. Thank you.
Ms. Pringle. And that was the intent of that act.
Ms. Underwood. That is right.
I am also concerned about the facts of this pandemic on
students' mental health, especially those who may be
experiencing increased stress or trauma during this time. A
number of educators in my district have reached out to me
needing additional resources in order to fully support kids'
mental health.
Ms. Pringle, can you tell us more about how you and other
educators are seeing this pandemic affect students' mental
health and any specific resources, personnel, or funds, or
anything else, that the schools would need in order to best
serve these students in the short and long term?
Ms. Pringle. Absolutely. Our students are experiencing
trauma. They are experiencing loss. They are experiencing being
away from their fellow students. They are experiencing a level
of uncertainty that makes it very difficult for them to learn.
And so we have got to make sure that we have the healthcare
professionals, enough teachers, enough nurses and counselors.
All of those things are important, but most especially they
need to know that they are coming back to safe schools, safe
schools. So, we have to make sure that when we welcome them
back, they feel like they are safe and are prepared to learn.
Ms. Underwood. Thank you so much for all you do. Thank you
for the witnesses for being here.
And, Mr. Chairman, I yield back. Thank you very much.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
Mr. Levin, the gentleman from California.
Mr. Levin. Yes. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman, for
holding this really important hearing.
I want to--I have been listening right along, and I have a
feeling we may have some agreement on something.
Mr. Johnson, I read that according to the North Carolina
Department of Public Instruction, 300,000 students in North
Carolina lack internet access at home. And you have mentioned,
and I so agree with you, that we would all love to get kids
back to the classroom as soon as we can do it safely. But even
when we do, around the country there are likely to be outbreaks
and kids will have to deal with this remote learning.
So, would you consider it a public policy priority to make
sure everybody has access to the internet at home through high-
speed access?
Mr. Johnson. Yes, I think that is something that Congress
should definitely look into. I will not, again, get out of my
wheelhouse and claim to be the expert on this. How that is done
can take many different forms.
Mr. Levin. Right.
Mr. Johnson. There are a lots of different ways now coming
up--
Mr. Levin. But as an educator, you think it would be a
priority.
And, Mr. Gordon, you represent a large urban school
district. Would you consider that to be a priority as well?
Mr. Gordon. Yes, not only for education, but for everything
else that we rely on by accessing the internet.
Mr. Levin. Right. So I really hope that as we move forward
on infrastructure, Republicans and Democrats will work together
to provide all of our people, our rural and urban kids, access
to broadband because, as Congresswoman Shalala said, we have a
ways to go before we are going to have everybody in classrooms
safely all around this country.
Ms. Pringle, let me turn to you. It is good to see you. You
were talking with my colleague, Representative Underwood, about
Secretary DeVos just a few minutes ago. You know, as a
Michigander, I know all about Ms. DeVos and her long crusade to
destroy public education in this country. But I want to talk
about systemic racism.
You know, the rules she proposed would funnel money away
from school districts and the students most impacted by COVID-
19 to private schools. She claims all students are impacted by
COVID-19 and so all students deserve funding. That is like
yelling ``All lives matter'' in response to the Black Lives
Matter Movement.
I wanted to ask you about this question. You know what, a
2016 study in Michigan by Bridge Magazine found that in the
2009-2010 school year, about 64 percent of choice students
moved to a less diverse district, and that rate is now
approaching 70 percent.
So, talk to me about Ms. DeVos's policy and our effort at
long last to deal with the systemic racism that has shaped this
country since before we were a country.
Ms. Pringle. So, Congressman, you know all too well that
Michigan was a canary in the mind, right--
Mr. Levin. Yes.
Ms. Pringle.--of what Ms. DeVos intends to do with public
education throughout this Nation. There is no question that we
have--the country has been wrestling with this issue and
unsuccessfully addressing the inequities that have persisted,
quite honestly, forever.
When the Elementary and Secondary Education Act was passed
back in the sixties, the intent was for the Federal Government
to step in and try to alleviate some of these inequities. We
have gotten so far away from that.
With ESSA being passed a couple of years ago, we tried to
recenter that conversation around equity and access and
opportunities. I know right now, I could take a clipboard into
our best public school and list all of the things those
students have, from AP courses to healthy environments where
they can learn.
I disagree, our public infrastructure--the infrastructure
in our public schools must be addressed. It has always been
there in the face of our students saying they don't deserve
better than that.
It is absolutely unacceptable that we have a Secretary of
Education who doesn't understand what equity means. This is an
opportunity for us to actually change what is happening in our
public school systems, to change how we fund them, to make sure
that when we say ``every,'' we mean every, that every one of
our students has what they need.
Mr. Levin. Really we couldn't say that we have taken on
systemic racism in this country until we deal with the equity
of funding in education, could we, in public education?
Ms. Pringle. We absolutely cannot, absolutely cannot. And,
by the way, we need to be talking about structural racism
because all of those systems from housing to healthcare to
economics impact whether our students can learn, all of them.
We must do better as a country.
Mr. Levin. Thank you so much.
It is certainly true, Mr. Chairman, that even if you have a
good school, if you don't have a home to live in, if you are
hungry, you don't have food in your belly, if you don't have
access to healthcare that you are not going to be able to
thrive.
So with that, I know we have passed the 4 o'clock hour, Mr.
Chairman. I yield back, and I thank you again so much for your
leadership on this issue.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
Let me see, the gentlelady from Minnesota, Ms. Omar.
The gentleman from Maryland, Mr. Trone.
Mr. Trone. Mr. Chairman, am I coming through?
Chairman Scott. Yep, yep.
Mr. Trone. Great. Thank you, Chairman Scott and Ranking
Member Foxx, for holding this important hearing and a really
big thank you for doing it remotely. I am right here on the
Hill in my office safely and separated from the rest of the
Members. So, it is great to be able to do this remotely, and
thank you for your leadership and thinking about everybody's
safety.
The other thing I want to touch on was touched on by Member
Levin, and I think we have seen this back and forth,
Republicans, Democrats, we are all on the same page, but we
have got to get something done on the broadband issue. It has
hampered us here in tele-education, it has hampered us on
telehealth, and it has hampered many areas like some of my
counties on telework.
Up to 40 percent of my students got zero because they don't
have the broadband in certain counties. So, we have got to get
this fixed. We owe it to the American people.
Ms. Pringle, when the schools reopen, States will need to
invest in meeting the social, emotional, mental health needs of
their students, ensuring support for trauma and for healthcare
and social and emotional learning, including offering
professional development. Redesigning schools for stronger
relationships and providing curriculum support is so important
so we can build the tools to help our students, our kids work
through all of the stress. Children can be confined at home.
The families experience job loss, COVID. Hospitals are seeing
severe cases of child abuse.
So, building on what Member Underwood talked about, what is
the percentage of schools that you think currently have enough
counselors to help students cope with the trauma of this
pandemic and how important is it that they get those resources?
Give us a number.
Chairman Scott. Who did you address that question to?
Mr. Trone. Ms. Pringle
Ms. Pringle. Thank you, Congressman. Thank you for that
question.
I don't know what that percentage is, but this is what I
know. Far too many of our students, especially our students of
color, those living in poverty, attend schools that are
understaffed, from teachers to support professionals,
especially nurses and counselors, and we know those healthcare
professionals, specifically those who are trained in mental
health services, are going to be more needed now than before,
and we already had that need for them.
We are so worried about the fact that even with the money
that is allocated in the Heroes Act, that we are not going to
have enough funds to meet the needs that are growing because of
this pandemic. We are worried that we will not have the
educators available to come into our schools and teach.
We talked earlier about the fact that it is so important to
have a diverse work force. We know that our students graduating
from college, particularly our students of color, have more
debt and are less likely to go into teaching or stay in
teaching because they are overburdened by that debt.
These are all issues we as a society must confront, and we
are asking for our elected leaders to finally do something to
change what is happening for our students. We know what they
need. We need your support in giving them everything they need
to be successful.
Mr. Trone. I think we should add we need it now. We have
got 2 months to go, and all of the trauma the Nation is going
through now, on top of the financial collapse, on top of COVID,
it is a trifecta that our kids are paying a price for. We have
got 2 months to make some decisions and provide the assistance.
Ms. Pringle. Right now. Thank you.
Mr. Trone. The stress and trauma of COVID-19 can be
mitigated by trauma-informed practices, fostering trusting
relationships. This is for you, Mr. Gordon. Strategies include
keeping or looping teachers with the same students, doing
grades and incorporating social and emotional learning and all
of the school experiences digital and in person.
Mr. Gordon, how should the schools plan on meeting the
social and emotional learning needs of students when they get
reopened?
Mr. Gordon. Congressman, thank you for the question.
Fortunately, this is an area my district has been investing
in for over a decade. There are great resources out there, from
the collaborative of academic social and emotional learning
that are guides for how we integrate social and emotional
learning into every classroom experience so that our students
are able to self-regulate, self-monitor, and participate. But
it is also going to provide a lot more of the adult supports
that you just were speaking of.
And just to answer your question very directly, we know we
have far too little in this community or the high need our
children had before COVID-19, so we have been investing through
philanthropy and partnerships with our county in additional
social workers that our schools don't have. We don't have
enough nurses, enough guidance counselors, things that when I
worked in an affluent suburb community, I had access so even
though my kids had less need.
So it is got to be both integrating into the actual
experiences, classroom experiences, the content development,
but also having that support network in place, and that is why
these resources are going to be so critical for us because, you
know, communities like mine, our social and emotional learning
work came out of a school shooting in 2007 where a young man
took--shot two teachers, two students and took his own life.
And we invested deeply in social and emotional learning, but we
also invested in a hardening of security, and so we have more
safety personnel in our district than we have counselors for
social and emotional health.
Mr. Trone. Thank you.
I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you, thank you.
Next, the young lady from Michigan, Ms. Stevens.
Ms. Stevens. Thank you, Mr. Chair, and greetings from my
office in Livonia, Michigan. It has been a wonderful hearing. I
have been here for all of it. Thank you so much to our
witnesses for your testimony.
I will say I am so proud, I have been able to give the
taxpayers a bang for their buck this morning. As part of my
Manufacturing Monday Program, I visited Unified Business
Technologies, which is a women-owned, minority-owned business
in Troy, Michigan. It is owned by Michelle D'souza who came to
this incredible country with $500 in her pocket and has grown
this incredible business that today is making masks, is fixing
electronic circuit breakers for the FAA, and also they have
used this pandemic period to create a new tool called IRRUPT.
IRRUPT is a machine that uses UV light to disinfect all
types of surfaces. I don't know if any of you have yet had a
chance to see the IRRUPT machine, but here is a picture of me
using it today. It was just remarkable. I want to see this in
our schools.
I know our schools want to see this piece of equipment in
their schools. It also works the arms while you are using it,
and it is about 700 bucks. That is how much IRRUPT costs. And,
again, it cleans, it disinfects the surfaces using UV light.
And it was made right here in Michigan. And we want our
schools--
Ms. Pringle, I have heard you repeatedly. Mr. Gordon, thank
you so much, safety, safety, safety, get back to certainty.
And, Mark, I know--Mr. Johnson, you are at statewide
superintendent. It has been nice to hear what is been going on
in North Carolina.
Mark, do you have any idea how much Michigan's budget
shortfall is for our schools projected for next year?
Mr. Johnson. I don't.
Ms. Stevens. It is $1.3 billion, Mark, $1.3 billion for
Michigan. And I got the Farmington School District, they are
looking at a $3.5 million cut alone just for this next year.
And then I have got the Rochester School District. They put
together this brilliant safety plan, and I am a product of
these Rochester Public Schools. I saw the blueprint of my old
middle school, 219 new buses if they are going to do this
safely.
So, okay. Now, Mark, okay, are you familiar with this
House--just on the off chance--State House Resolution No.
267? Are you familiar with it? Okay, I will tell you, it is
a resolution, quote, a resolution to memorialize the Congress
of the United States to not enact a Federal bailout for the
States.
This came from the Michigan State House Republican
conference, okay. This was introduced by Crawford, who is
neighbors with Farmington, who represents Novi, Burmann of
Commerce and West Bloomfield. I am just scratching my head
because what does it mean for the state to reject the Federal
assistance dollars?
Who can talk to me about this? Maybe Gordon or Leachman,
just real quick, if you are going to reject Federal assistance
dollars similar to CARES, would that get your schools back on
track?
Ms. Stevens. No
Mr. Gordon. Congresswoman, this is Eric Gordon. It wouldn't
get our schools on track. We have already had a $5.6 million
cut this year from my State.
Ms. Stevens. Yeah. So this is a big issue, and so we are
wondering about this. And then I hear my colleagues, who I have
got respect for. I respect all of my fabulous colleagues in
this committee. You know, they are saying we want to get back
to work, right? They are saying we want to get back to work,
but we have got to do it safely.
So, tell me how an amazing company like the Unified
Business Technologies gets this machine sold, right, it is
getting people back to work, if our schools can't buy it? Do we
have an answer for that? I don't think so.
So, we need to get back to robotics training. That is being
cut. We need to get our guidance counselors secured, and we
have got to get the people who have been funded by Betsy DeVos
to stop making our laws in Michigan.
Thank you all so much.
Chairman Scott. Thank you, thank you.
The gentlelady from Nevada, Mrs. Lee.
Mrs. Lee. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, thank you,
Ranking Member, for having this important hearing.
Also, I want to thank all of our witnesses today. First of
all, thank you for your service to the students across this
country and thank you for being here.
I have to give a special shout-out to all of the teaching
professionals and support professionals who literally at the
drop of a dime went from teaching in person to online learning,
dealing especially in a state like Nevada where we saw almost a
third of our students lacking devices to do distance learning.
And, you know, Nevada, like many States, we are planning
for drastic reduction in our State revenues at a time when we
are trying to plan to get back to school in an environment
where we are already dealing with overcrowded classrooms.
We don't know how we are going to pay for additional
transportation, continue to have high quality distance
learning, which I believe needs to include some high quality
professional development as well, additional school meals.
You know, our education shortfalls are running into the
hundreds of billions of dollars, and we are already seeking
cuts in Nevada where we have an $812 million budget hole caused
by coronavirus.
As a result of these closures to our local businesses and
losses from crucial tax sources to pay for that budget, we are
looking at an anticipated $265 million projected shortfall K to
12 funding. We know many states across this country are
planning for budget cuts in the 2020-2021 school year, but we
have to be prepared to see continued shortfalls into the 2021-
2022 school year, and it is clear that incredibly tough
decisions are going to have to be made.
And I would like to ask Mr. Leachman and Mr. Gordon, can
you please share with the Committee some of the cuts to the K
to 12 education budgets that we can expect to see, including
the likely impact of these cuts on programs and staff?
Mr. Leachman. Sure. Thank you, Congresswoman.
The first thing is because teachers will be laid off, other
school workers that are crucial to the experiences of our kids
will be laid off, librarians, counselors, nurses, and others,
and that will really affect the experiences of our kids.
That will be the first thing because labor costs are so
important. You need those people in order to properly educate
our kids; but there are other things, too. We won't be able to
make equipment purchases that would help to improve the
technology in our schools.
We won't be able to make building upgrades that would help
or even keep up with maintenance that is needed in our school
buildings. We talked earlier about some of the problems with
asbestos and lead in some of our schools, those sort of things
would be put off.
So all of those effects--and you can see them playing out--
you saw them playing out during the Great Recession. Well, this
is even worse.
Mrs. Lee. Thank you.
Mr. Gordon?
Mr. Gordon. Thank you, Congresswoman.
If we sell the 25 percent budget reduction that we could
possibly see, we would cut like we did in 2010, where at that
time we closed 23 schools, we laid off over a thousand
educators at all levels of the system. We eliminated student
transportation. We eliminated sports and extracurricular
activities.
We cut art, music, physical education, and library media
out of our K-8 schools and electives out of our high schools.
And we would be forced to do exactly those things again, simply
keeping the lights on, if we saw the worst of the cuts that we
could forecast.
Mrs. Lee. Thank you.
Mr. Leachman, I just want to follow up on the issues I just
brought up. We can look back to the Great Recession during
which Congress provided $160 billion under the Recovery Act to
K to 12-- this included $60 billion to K to 12 education. The
CARES Act allocated $13.2 billion primarily for K to 12.
Is this enough funding to meet the needs of States and
school districts? And do you have any recommendations for this
Committee on what the CBPP believes would be an appropriate
response given the circumstances that we are facing?
Mr. Leachman. No. $13.2 billion is not remotely close to
what will be needed. As I mentioned at the top of my testimony,
we are projecting overall state only shortfalls of $615 billion
over the next 3 fiscal years. This is an extraordinary crisis,
and providing way less funding than we provided during the last
recession is not going to cut it.
You know, we believe that the additional amount that should
be provided to states and local governments should be
sufficient to meeting the shortfalls that states face. So 615--
now, States have received some aid and they have some rainy day
funds; but even after you use those things, overall States only
face shortfalls of $440 billion, and then you add on the local
government shortfalls and the other needs that we have in terms
of addressing the COVID crisis, and we need to get much higher
than $13 billion.
Mrs. Lee. Thank you.
Yeah, I think it is rather clear to us that the discussion
about letting state and local governments go bankrupt is really
bankrupting the future of our children.
So thank you.
And I yield. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
The gentlelady from Massachusetts, Ms. Trahan.
The gentleman from Texas, Mr. Castro.
I don't see anyone who hasn't been recognized, so I will
recognize myself for 5 minutes for questions.
Mr. Gordon, can you say just very briefly what the
difference is between equal and equitable in terms of providing
educational services?
Mr. Gordon. Equitable is giving students what they need to
create an equal experience. That is how I would say it, is that
giving every child what they need so that they have an equal
opportunity and that is different for each child.
Chairman Scott. Okay. Thank you.
And, Mr. Johnson, you indicated that you are trying to get
devices to students that didn't have those, and I assume that
would be consistent with an equitable distribution, not equal
distribution; is that right?
Mr. Johnson. Absolutely.
Chairman Scott. And you said something nice about school
meals. That is one of the first things that Congress recognized
in the coronavirus response, making sure that we gave waivers
and extra funding to make sure students could receive their
school meals even though the schools were closed.
Can you say a word about why those meals are important and
how the provision of meals is absolutely consistent with the
educational experience?
Mr. Johnson. Oh, it is so important because you can't just
nurture the mind, you have to nurture the body, and that is
exactly what school nutrition does. And we all wish that we
were not in a place where we relied so heavily on school meals
for students to get their nutrition, but we are, and we have to
make sure those students get what they need. And that is really
where it has truly been amazing that the school nutrition
services has stepped up in this crisis. Thank you all for your
support and waivers. And we are using some of our CARES funding
to even go beyond with school nutrition. It is so important for
students to have that healthy meal as often as we can provide
it from our schools.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
Ms. Pringle, can you say something about the importance of
summer programs and what kind of summer programs are needed?
Everyone doesn't need a summer program, but some desperately
do. What should we be looking at in terms of our summer
experiences to deal with the summer slide?
Ms. Pringle. Your question--Congressman Scott, first of
all, thank you for having this hearing. Your question earlier
about equal versus equity comes into play here, too. We know
forever that when our students are not with us during the
summer, if they don't have the opportunities for enrichment, if
they don't have the opportunities to continue to learn, they
are going to experience a gap.
And so, we always try to provide them with either learning
packets or provide them with extra services during the summer
to meet those needs.
Of course, in this moment of COVID-19, that provides a lot
of challenges for us because we can't do what we normally do. I
would say that any kind of summer services, we would say the
exact same thing, that we can't provide those unless we are
ensuring that our students are safe. So the digital divide that
we are experiencing right now while school is still in session
will exist over the summer.
We need to have the funds that you provided in the Heroes
Act right now so that we can begin to close that digital divide
so that we can begin to make up any of those learning losses
throughout the summer. That is exactly what I know you
intended, and we hope that the Senate will act quickly to
provide those resources.
Chairman Scott. Well, if you have a 2-month summer slide
every summer, K through 12, that is a couple of years' worth of
achievement gap. That is just normal. How do you--what kind
of--how do you deal with that? What should we be looking at in
terms of programs and funding to make sure it is not any worse?
Ms. Pringle. Well, we have to make sure we have educators
available to provide the teaching that our students will need.
So we know that with so many of our educators being laid off
already, we have to make up that gap. So that is first of all.
We know we need additional tools, digital tools for our
students. So we need that additional $4 billion for that
funding for technology for our eWay Program.
We know that we need to ensure that our students have
access to mental health professionals and counselors so that we
can take care of their social and emotional needs. We need to
do that right now so we can begin to try to fill those gaps
today.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
And, Mr. Leachman, you indicated automatic stabilizers,
automatic triggers. How does that work? Are there education
specific stabilizers that you are talking about or is that just
dealing with the unemployment compensation, food stamps,
Medicaid? Anything specific that you were talking about?
Mr. Leachman. No. I am describing here the way in which aid
is generally distributed. It is best if it goes out based on
economic conditions so that it stays in place as long as it is
needed. And, you know, this situation is uncertain, so you set
it up so that the aid provided matches how the economy evolves.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
And one final question to Mr. Johnson.
Mr. Johnson, are you familiar with discounts that low-
income families can get to get broadband services?
Mr. Johnson. Yes. We have had that offered in North
Carolina during the height of this pandemic a few months ago,
yes.
Chairman Scott. Are there general discounts that are
available?
Mr. Johnson. Yes. And there were some services offered for
free. One big question, obviously, is going to be how that
continues going into next school year and over the summer.
Chairman Scott. Okay. Thank you very much.
I want to thank all of our witnesses for your testimony. I
think we are at the end of the questions, and I will call on
the ranking member to see if she has closing comments.
Dr. Foxx, do you have a closing statement?
Ms. Foxx. I do, Mr. Chairman.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
Ms. Foxx. Thank you very much.
I want to thank the witnesses again for their testimonies
and particularly Superintendent Johnson for being with us here
in person today.
There has been a lot of talk about the need for more
funding. It is possible that after we have evaluated the impact
of the CARES Act, we will consider whether or not additional
aid from Federal taxpayers will be necessary; but first we must
evaluate how the money that has been spent, what effect it has
had.
But I want to make one important point. Mr. Cline talked
earlier about the total amount of funding spent by private and
public schools in 2018-2019 and the breakdown of that funding
by source. Looking at just public schools, those schools spent
$726 billion nationwide in 2017-2018 according to the National
Center for Education Statistics. If the worst projections do,
in fact, occur and schools experience as much as the 25 percent
cut to their budgets, that would be a $181.5 billion loss.
That is significant, but that would leave schools 544.5
billion, 544.5 billion, or more than was spent in 1998-1999
calculated in 2017-2018 dollars. That needs to sink into
people.
In other words, even if the worst happens, education 2
years from now will still be more expensive to taxpayers than
it was nearly 25 years ago, and I think any of us would be okay
with that if education was delivering better results than it
was 2 decades ago.
But to pick one measure and one measure only, eighth
graders scored 263 on the NAEP Reading Assessment in 1998. Let
me repeat that. Eighth graders in 1998 scored 263 on the NAEP
Reading Assessment. And in 2019, guess what? They scored 263,
the exact same score for a lot more money. Only in the Federal
Government do people ask for more and more money but make no
pledges to improve delivery of services or to get better
results.
This is unacceptable. So, as we rush to again throw more
and more taxpayer money that taxpayers can't afford at the
current challenges, we must pause for at least a moment to
consider why all the money we have spent in the last two
decades hasn't produced better results.
And we can go back even farther, Mr. Chairman, to all of
the money being spent in other areas, and we will show the same
thing: Lots of money spent; no better results.
I want our children to get the best possible education they
can get. People know I came from very, very poor, very poor,
disadvantaged background, and I got an excellent education.
That isn't happening now, and we need to look at why, and maybe
it is not just the result of what's happening in the schools.
Mr. Chairman, I yield back.
Chairman Scott. Thank you.
I, too, want to thank our witnesses for the information
that they have brought to us. It is extremely important as we
consider legislation to help students survive the COVID-19
pandemic. We have heard about the urgency to use equity to
address this challenge because many students are showing up in
school with more challenges than before.
We need to focus on achievement gaps, the summer slide
starting months earlier than usual, and revenue challenges. And
so we have a lot to work on, and I want to thank our witnesses
for helping us today.
We have heard about the fact that we are incurring debt.
That is true. Many experts have said that if we don't spend the
money now, it could get even worse, we could go further in
debt, because if we don't support the economy today, we could
go so deep into a recession that it may take years and even
decades to come out of.
The Great Depression of the 1930s really never ended until
we went into World War II. We don't want that to be the case.
So, we have to make the investments, and when we recover the
economy, then we have to address the fiscal situation that we
find ourselves in.
A lot has been made about the virtual hearing. Over the
past few months, the Committee and Congress has demonstrated
the ability to work in a virtual setting, using the directions
of the CDC, the Attending Physician, and the Architect of the
Capitol.
And we should focus, in my judgment, not on where we are
doing the work, but the work that we are actually doing. Over
the past few months, we've gotten a lot of work done. We passed
the Families First Coronavirus Response Act, the CARES Act, the
CARES Follow-Up Act, because the money ran out, and the Heroes
Act, all of that was done.
This committee has held briefings on remote learning,
workplace safety, challenges facing aging Americans and
individuals with disabilities, child care, contact tracing,
union representation elections, and today's hearing on
challenges that are caused by the pandemic in terms of
education.
Unfortunately, some of our Republican colleagues have been
invited to participate in all of these briefings and to offer
expert panelists to ensure that the conversation reflects a
range of views, but, except for one previous hearing, they have
declined to do so. But I think this hearing today shows the
value of everybody working together.
And so, we have additional briefings planned, one
additional briefing planned for Thursday on Work Force
Investments, Relaunching America's Work Force Act which would
provide critical investment on our work force development, as
we restart the economy. A lot of people have lost their jobs,
over 40 million have filed initial unemployment compensation
claims and, regrettably, a lot of them may think they are going
back to their old job, but a lot of them aren't, and they will
be looking for work force investment investments.
At this point, people should be comfortable with the
virtual technology, and we've seen how this works. Most of the
problems we have had in this have occurred because everybody
tried to get into the same location, and the bandwidth in the
committee room could only accommodate so many computers, so we
had a little problem there. But we look forward to working with
everyone in the briefings and hearings coming up.
And if there is nothing else to come before the Committee,
we want to thank our witnesses again. This has been a great
hearing. All of the witnesses have just been tremendous.
Is there is anything else to come before the Committee? If
not, the committee hearing is now adjourned.
And thank you very much.
[Additional submission by Mr. Courtney follows:]
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[Questions submitted for the record and their responses
follows:]
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[Whereupon, at 4:39 p.m., the committee was adjourned.]
[all]