[House Hearing, 116 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]
OVERCROWDING AND PROLONGED DETENTION AT CBP FACILITIES
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HEARING
BEFORE THE
SUBCOMMITTEE ON
IMMIGRATION AND CITIZENSHIP
OF THE
COMMITTEE ON THE JUDICIARY
HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
ONE HUNDRED SIXTEENTH CONGRESS
FIRST SESSION
__________
JULY 15, 2019
__________
Serial No. 116-36
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Printed for the use of the Committee on the Judiciary
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Available via the World Wide Web: http://judiciary.house.gov
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COMMITTEE ON THE JUDICIARY
JERROLD NADLER, New York, Chairman
ZOE LOFGREN, California DOUG COLLINS, Georgia,
SHEILA JACKSON LEE, Texas Ranking Member
STEVE COHEN, Tennessee F. JAMES SENSENBRENNER, Jr.
HENRY C. ``HANK'' JOHNSON, Jr., Wisconsin
Georgia STEVE CHABOT, Ohio
THEODORE E. DEUTCH, Florida LOUIE GOHMERT, Texas
KAREN BASS, California JIM JORDAN, Ohio
CEDRIC L. RICHMOND, Louisiana KEN BUCK, Colorado
HAKEEM S. JEFFRIES, New York JOHN RATCLIFFE, Texas
DAVID N. CICILLINE, Rhode Island MARTHA ROBY, Alabama
ERIC SWALWELL, California MATT GAETZ, Florida
TED LIEU, California MIKE JOHNSON, Louisiana
JAMIE RASKIN, Maryland ANDY BIGGS, Arizona
PRAMILA JAYAPAL, Washington TOM McCLINTOCK, California
VAL BUTLER DEMINGS, Florida DEBBIE LESKO, Arizona
J. LUIS CORREA, California GUY RESCHENTHALER, Pennsylvania
MARY GAY SCANLON, Pennsylvania, BEN CLINE, Virginia
Vice-Chair KELLY ARMSTRONG, North
SYLVIA R. GARCIA, Texas Dakota
JOE NEGUSE, Colorado W. GREGORY STEUBE, Florida
LUCY McBATH, Georgia
GREG STANTON, Arizona
MADELEINE DEAN, Pennsylvania
DEBBIE MUCARSEL-POWELL, Florida
VERONICA ESCOBAR, Texas
Perry Apelbaum, Majority Staff Director & Chief Counsel
Brendan Belair, Minority Staff Director
----------
SUBCOMMITTEE ON IMMIGRATION AND CITIZENSHIP
ZOE LOFGREN, California, Chair
PRAMILA JAYAPAL, Washington, Vice-Chair
J. LUIS CORREA, California KEN BUCK, Colorado,
SYLVIA R. GARCIA, Texas Ranking Member
JOE NEGUSE, Colorado ANDY BIGGS, Arizona
DEBBIE MUCARSEL-POWELL, TOM McCLINTOCK, California
Florida DEBBIE LESKO, Arizona
VERONICA ESCOBAR, Texas KELLY ARMSTRONG, North
SHEILA JACKSON LEE, Texas Dakota
MARY GAY SCANLON, W. GREGORY STEUBE, Florida
Pennsylvania
David Shahoulian, Chief Counsel
Andrea Loving, Minority Counsel
C O N T E N T S
----------
JULY 15, 2019
OPENING STATEMENTS
Page
The Honorable Zoe Lofgren, California, Chair, Subcommittee on
Immigration and Citizenship, House Committee on the Judiciary.. 1
The Honorable Ken Buck, Colorado, Ranking Member, Subcommittee on
Immigration and Citizenship, House Committee on the Judiciary.. 3
The Honorable Jerrold Nadler, Chairman, House Committee on the
Judiciary...................................................... 52
WITNESSES
Ms. Diana Shaw, Assistant Inspector General for Special Reviews
and Evaluations, Department of Homeland Security, Office of
Inspector General
Oral Statement............................................... 4
Prepared Statement........................................... 7
LETTERS, STATEMENTS, ETC. SUBMITTED FOR THE HEARING
Department of Homeland Security Office of Inspector General
Management Alerts entitled, ``DHS Needs to Address Dangerous
Overcrowding Among Single Adults at El Paso Del Norte
Processing Center (Redacted)'' and ``DHS Needs to Address
Dangerous Overcrowding and Prolonged Detention of Children and
Adults in the Rio Grande Valley (Redacted)''; Submitted by the
Honorable Zoe Lofgren.......................................... 20
APPENDIX
Prepared Statement of the Honorable Sheila Jackson Lee........... 78
Prepared Statement of Church World Service; Submitted by the
Honorable Zoe Lofgren.......................................... 83
OVERCROWDING AND PROLONGED DETENTION AT CBP FACILITIES
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MONDAY, JULY 15, 2019
House of Representatives
Subcommittee on Immigration and Citizenship
Committee on the Judiciary
Washington, DC.
The subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 5:30 p.m., in
Room 2141, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Zoe Lofgren
[chairman of the subcommittee] presiding.
Present: Representatives Lofgren, Nadler, Jayapal, Correa,
Garcia, Mucarsel-Powell, Escobar, Jackson Lee, Scanlon, Buck,
McClintock, Armstrong, and Steube.
Staff Present: Madeline Strasser, Chief Clerk; Susan
Jensen, Parliamentarian/Senior Counsel; Joshua Breisblatt,
Counsel; Rachel Calanni, Professional Staff Member; Sarnata
Reynolds, Counsel; Andrea Loving, Minority Counsel; Andrea
Woodard, Minority Professional Staff Member; and Jon Ferro,
Minority Parliamentarian.
Ms. Lofgren. The Subcommittee on Immigration and
Citizenship will come to order. Without objection, the chair is
authorized to declare recesses of the subcommittee at any time.
We welcome everyone to this afternoon's hearing on
overcrowding and prolonged detention at CBP facilities. And I
would now recognize myself for an opening statement.
In just 5 weeks' time, the DHS Inspector General has
released two management alerts detailing dangerous conditions
at U.S. Customs and Border Protection facilities in Texas.
According to the IG, at some of these facilities, conditions
are so bad that they require immediate attention and action.
The first alert focused on the detention of single adults
and detailed, quote, the dangerous holding conditions at the El
Paso Del Norte Processing Center. Unfortunately, this report
was not a surprise to me and my colleagues.
Along with Vice Chair Jayapal and Chairman Nadler, I
visited this same facility just a few months ago. Even then,
the conditions we observed were unacceptable. Women, children,
and families were either outside waiting to enter the facility,
shoved into overcrowded cells, or sitting in hallways.
Prior to our visit, we understood that hundreds of families
had been housed outside for days in a tent behind the Border
Patrol facility. We expected to meet with them, but to our
surprise, the tent was empty. It was not until after our visit
that we learned that the families had been transported to
another facility the night before. It's unfortunate, but also
not surprising, that the IG's observations are even more
disturbing.
As demonstrated in the IG report, although the facility's
maximum capacity is 125 detainees, approximately 750
individuals were detained on May 7, and 900 individuals were
detained on May 8. Overcrowding to this extent is a clear
violation of CBP's own standards, which provide that, quote,
under no circumstances should the maximum cell occupancy rate
as set by the fire marshal be exceeded.
The IG also found that a significant number of individuals
were being held longer than the maximum 72 hours set forth in
CBP's standards. And although CBP is required to make a
reasonable effort to provide showers for adults after 72 hours,
most adults had not received showers at all and some had not
showered in as long as a month.
In June, the IG completed another round of inspections,
this time in the Texas Rio Grande Valley sector. Here the IG
found serious overcrowding and other dangerous conditions at
facilities holding families and unaccompanied children.
According to the IG, 31 percent of children, including children
7 years old and younger, had been held in custody for more than
72 hours, some for more than 2 weeks. This violates, not only
CBP's standards, but the Flores Agreement.
Sadly, we know the conditions documented by the IG are not
limited to the facilities they visited. In June, lawyers
reported horrific conditions at the Clint, Texas, Border Patrol
facility, where some children had been held for weeks, sleeping
on cold floors, and taking care of one another because of the
lack of attention from guards.
Just last week, it was reported that a 15-year-old girl
from Honduras was sexually assaulted by a Border Patrol agent
in Yuma while other agents watched. There is a crisis on our
border, and, yes, Health and Human Services needed and now has
additional resources so that children can be moved out of CBP
facilities more quickly and into facilities built with their
needs in mind.
However, a lack of money is not the primary reason for this
crisis. The Trump administration has made no secret of its
intent to do all it can to deter children and families from
seeking protection in the United States, as the law allows,
without addressing the root causes that are driving migration
to our border. This is sad. The mistreatment of these children
and families is a moral stain on our Nation.
I appreciate the willingness of the inspector general to
testify before us today. The spot inspections conducted by the
IG has shed a light on some of the Trump administration's worst
practices. We cannot look away. It is well past time for the
cruelty of these policies to be exposed and for those who led
the United States into this disaster to be held accountable.
Today's hearing is just the beginning of the oversight we will
conduct on this important issue.
It is now my pleasure to recognize the ranking member of
the subcommittee, the gentleman from Colorado, Mr. Buck, for
his opening statement.
Mr. Buck. Thank you, Chairwoman Lofgren.
As I have been saying now for months, there is a crisis on
the southern border. It comes as no surprise that given the
record number of individuals crossing the border illegally,
Border Patrol facilities are overwhelmed and over capacity.
I applaud the assistant inspector general for her office's
work on exposing the conditions this crisis is causing, and I
hope that her office will continue their investigations,
especially as the crisis affects the most vulnerable among us,
children.
After months of the President, DHS officials, and other
administration officials sounding the alarm about the security
and humanitarian crisis on the southern border well before the
inspector general's reports were first published, I am now
encouraged that our colleagues finally agree that there really
is a crisis. And I am hopeful that we can now engage in the
difficult work of solving this crisis head-on.
The inspector general's office issued two reports on
overcrowding and prolonged detention at Border Patrol
facilities in the El Paso and Rio Grande Valley sectors. These
reports provide an objective perspective on the factors outside
of CBP's control that are fueling this crisis, prolonging
migrants' stay in CBP custody, and causing the overcrowded
conditions identified in the inspector general's reports.
As of the July 2, 2019, report says, CBP detains
individuals on a short-term basis to allow for initial
processing and then transfers the individuals to other
government agencies, but that short-term system has been
completely broken. Due to a failure to update our laws, there
is an unprecedented influx of migrants crossing our border
illegally, and many of these individuals are more vulnerable
than individuals who came during prior influxes.
So what do we need to do to fix this problem? We need a
multilayered approach to a multilayered problem. We must
continue to work with our partners internationally to support
their own law enforcement and anticorruption efforts. I have
worked closely with officials in Guatemala, and I have seen the
good work that can be done when close friends collaborate in
their common interests.
We must continue to expand these initiatives to other
countries, especially in Honduras and El Salvador. We must
support economic development efforts in these countries to
further elevate our hemisphere and let people have a chance to
prosper in their own countries. We must also reform our
immigration laws, including the TVPRA and the Flores Settlement
Agreement, to ensure that our laws do not provide incentives to
enter our country illegally and to use children to do it.
The exploitation of children incentivized by our laws must
stop. We must ensure that all of our diplomatic efforts, legal
reform efforts, and law enforcement efforts combine to ensure
that we are protecting vulnerable children.
I look forward to hearing from the witness today about the
IG's reports and the root causes of the crisis on our border.
And I hope to work together with my colleagues, Republican and
Democrat, to quickly provide commonsense bipartisan solutions
to meet this crisis head-on.
The chairwoman and I recently collaborated on a bipartisan
immigration bill to fix a problem in our legal immigration
system, and I am optimistic that we can repeat that success on
issues as important as these. I look forward to the witness'
testimony, and I yield back.
Ms. Lofgren. Thank you. I thank the ranking member.
It's now my pleasure to introduce today's witness, Ms.
Diana R. Shaw. Diana Shaw was appointed the assistant inspector
general for Special Reviews and Evaluations for the Department
of Homeland Security, Office of Inspector General, in March of
this year. She has also served in several other leadership
positions with the inspector general's office, including
assistant inspector general for Legal Affairs, acting counsel
to the Inspector General, Director of Special Review Groups,
and acting assistant inspector general for External Affairs.
Prior to joining to Office of Inspector General, Ms. Shaw
practiced law with a firm's white collar crime groups
specializing in internal investigations and compliance
counseling.
Ms. Shaw, we thank you for taking the time to participate
in today's hearing on this critical issue. We welcome you to
the committee and we look forward to your testimony. And I
would ask you now to please rise so that I can swear you.
Raise your right hand.
Do you swear or affirm under penalty of perjury that the
testimony you are about the give is true and correct to the
best of your knowledge, information, and belief, so help you
God?
Ms. Shaw. I do.
Ms. Lofgren. Thank you very much.
Let the record show that the witness answered in the
affirmative.
And we are now happy to receive your written testimony.
Please know that your entire testimony will be entered into the
record, and we would like to hear a summary in 5 minutes or so.
We have a light, or usually we have a light, that tells you
when your time is up. When it goes yellow, there's a minute
left. When it's red, the 5 minutes are up. And we would love to
hear from you at this moment.
TESTIMONY OF DIANA R. SHAW, ASSISTANT INSPECTOR GENERAL FOR
SPECIAL REVIEWS AND EVALUATIONS, DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND
SECURITY, OFFICE OF INSPECTOR GENERAL
Ms. Shaw. Chairwoman Lofgren, Ranking Member Buck, and
members of the subcommittee, thank you for inviting me to
discuss DHS OIG's recent work on conditions at Customs and
Border Protection holding facilities at the southern border.
My testimony today will focus on the dangerous overcrowding
and prolonged detention recently observed by DHS OIG inspectors
in both the El Paso Del Norte Processing Center and at
facilities in the Rio Grande Valley. These issues pose a
serious and imminent threat to the health and safety, both of
DHS personnel and detainees, and require the Department's
immediate attention and action.
DHS OIG conducts unannounced inspections of CBP facilities
to evaluate compliance with CBP's transport, escort, detention,
and search standards, otherwise known as TEDS standards.
TEDS standards govern CBP's interactions with detainees,
providing guidance on things like duration of detention, access
to food and water, access to medical care, and hygiene.
Our unannounced inspections enable us to identify instances
of noncompliance with TEDS and to propose appropriate
corrective action. In doing so, we seek to drive transparency
and accountability at the Department of Homeland Security.
Although CBP has struggled at times to achieve full
compliance with detention standards, our recent unannounced
inspections revealed a situation far more grievous than any our
inspectors had previously encountered. For instance, when our
team arrived at the El Paso Del Norte Processing Center, they
found that this facility, which has a maximum capacity of 125
detainees, had more than 750 detainees onsite. The following
day, that number had increased to 900.
At all the Border Patrol facilities we visited in the Rio
Grande Valley, we also observed serious overcrowding among
unaccompanied alien children, or UACs. Additionally, we found
that individuals, including children, were being detained well
beyond the 72 hours generally permitted under TEDS standards
and the Flores Agreement.
For instance, at the Centralized Processing Center in
McAllen, Texas, many children had been in custody longer than a
week. Some UACs under the age of 7 had been in custody for more
than 2 weeks.
Under these circumstances, CBP has struggled to comply with
TEDS standards. For instance, although all facilities we
visited in the Rio Grande Valley had infant formula, diapers,
baby wipes, and juice and snacks for children, two facilities
had not provided children access to hot meals, as required,
until the week we arrived for our inspections. Additionally,
children at three of the five facilities we visited had no
access to showers, limited access to a change of clothes and no
access to laundry facilities.
Space limitations also affect single adults. The lack of
space has restricted CBP's ability to separate detainees with
infectious diseases, including chicken pox, scabies, and
influenza, from each other and from the general population.
According to CBP management, these conditions also affect
the health of Border Patrol agents who are experiencing high
incidence of illness.
Further, there is a concern that the overcrowding and
prolonged detention may be contributing to rising tensions
among detainees. A senior manager at one facility in the Rio
Grande Valley called the situation, quote, a ticking time bomb.
Despite these immense challenges, we observed CBP staff
interacting with detainees in a professional and respectful
manner, and in general, attempting to comply with standards to
the extent possible. Notwithstanding these efforts, Border
Patrol requires immediate assistance to manage the overcrowding
in its facilities.
CBP is not responsible for providing long-term detention,
and CBP facilities like those we visited are not designed to
hold individuals for longer periods. However, with limited bed
space available at ICE and HHS long-term facilities nationwide,
detainees are left in CBP custody until a placement can be
found.
In its response to our recent management alerts, DHS
described the situation on the southern border as, quote, an
acute and worsening crisis. Our observations comport with that
characterization which is why we have called on the Department
to take immediate action to begin to remedy the situation.
Although DHS has asserted that it has reduced the number of
UACs in custody in the last few weeks, we remain concerned that
it is not taking sufficient steps to address the overcrowding
and prolonged detention we observed, particularly with respect
to single adult detainees.
We will continue to monitor the situation at the border,
and have already begun new work aimed specifically at
identifying the root causes of some of these issues. We hope
this work will assist the Department in addressing these
challenges. In the meantime, however, DHS leadership must
develop a strategic coordinated approach that will allow it to
make good on its commitment to ensure the safety, security, and
care of those in its custody.
Ms. Chairwoman, this concludes my testimony. I'm happy to
answer any questions you or other members of the subcommittee
may have.
[The statement of Ms. Shaw follows:]
[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Ms. Lofgren. Thank you very much for your testimony, for
your work, and for your report.
I would ask unanimous consent that the report itself be
made a part of this record.
[The information follows:]
CHAIR LOFGREN FOR THE RECORD
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[GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]
Ms. Lofgren. Before moving to questions, I'd like to
recognize the chairman of the full committee, Mr. Nadler, for
his opening statement.
Chairman Nadler. Thank you, Madam Chair.
The title of today's hearing, ``Overcrowding and Prolonged
Detention in CBP Facilities,'' barely begins to convey the
inhumane conditions children and families in CBP custody are
experiencing in facilities along the southern border.
Today, we'll focus on six Texas CBP facilities recently
examined by the inspector general's office, which documented a
culture of utter neglect and disregard for migrants that is
profoundly disturbing. The IG's report is bad enough that it
must not be read in a vacuum. We also cannot ignore the reports
of sexual assault and retaliation against children at the Yuma
Processing Center in Arizona, nor can we overlook the racist
and misogynous Facebook postings by current and former CBP
officers that dehumanize migrants and disparaged female Members
of Congress.
Not only did CBP leadership know about this group, it now
appears that the chief of the Border Patrol herself was a
member. This is the context in which we must consider the
horrible conditions in CBP facilities.
On May 30, 2019, the IG issued a management alert that
focused on dangerous overcrowding of single adults at the Del
Norte Processing Center, including the packing of 900
individuals into a space with a maximum capacity of 125, and
holding 41 individuals in a cell designed to hold 8. This
overcrowding made it impossible for men and women to lie down,
and some were forced to stay in standing room only conditions
for days and even weeks. The photos accompanying the management
alert powerfully illustrate the misery and suffering at these
facilities.
Although the DHS concurred with the IG's recommendations,
the agency claims that it will not be able to correct these
problems until November 30, 2020, nearly 18 months from now. It
is outrageous that DHS leadership could read this report and
decide that men, women, and children could be detained in these
deplorable, horrible conditions for 18 more months.
Just 5 weeks later on July 2, the IG issued another
management alert that focused on the dangerous overcrowding and
prolonged detention of children and adults at five CBP
facilities in the Texas Rio Grande Valley. The IG documented
that some 1,500 children and adults were held in short-term
holding rooms longer than the 72 hours generally permitted,
including more than 50 children 7 years old or younger who had
been detained for over 2 weeks.
Most of these individuals had not showered for the entire
duration of their detention, even though several of them had
been held for as long as a month. And most were still wearing
the clothing they arrived in, days, weeks, and even up to a
month before. That we would treat any human being this way is
unconscionable. And this situation cannot be blamed solely on
the increased number of asylum seekers arriving at the southern
border.
CBP made a choice here. ICE and the Department of Health
and Human Services have the mandate and infrastructure to
detain individuals for longer than 72 hours. If those
facilities are full, however, CBP has the authority to release
individuals and families after completion of intake processing.
There is no doubt that the overcrowding and conditions
documented in the six Texas facilities warranted release of
some--of at least some of these asylum seekers. But it appears
to be the Trump administration's policy to continue holding
children and families in such conditions as a form of torture
in order to deter others from coming. This is neither necessary
nor conscionable nor sustainable.
There is a humanitarian crisis in Central America and the
Trump administration's policies are now creating a humanitarian
crisis in our country too. The IG has done a great service to
our Nation by regularly and impartially reviewing CBP
conditions. Their findings require prompt action consistent
with American laws and American values. Later this week, the
Judiciary Committee plans to take up legislation to address
deficiencies in CBP custody facilities.
I thank the chair of the subcommittee, Ms. Lofgren, for
holding this important hearing. I appreciate Ms. Shaw appearing
today to discuss her office's findings. I'm glad for her
testimony, and I yield back the balance of my time.
Ms. Lofgren. The chairman yields back.
Mr. Collins will certainly be recognized, if he is able to
come. Otherwise, we will invite him to put his statement into
the record.
But to be even, I'll go to Mr. Armstrong for his questions,
since Mr. Buck has asked that we go to him next.
Mr. Armstrong. Thank you, Madam Chair.
On May 30, 2019, the OIG report found conditions of
overcrowding at the El Paso Del Norte Processing Center. The
report on page 2 noted that total apprehensions during the
first 7 months of fiscal year 2019 have already surpassed that
of the total apprehensions of each of the same time period this
fiscal--or for the past 4 years.
It also has a chart comparing, just for the El Paso sector,
that same time period, this fiscal year between October and
April, compared to last year. And it states that the El Paso
sector has seen an increase of 374 percent of unaccompanied
alien children, 1,816 percent family units, and 82 percent of
single adults. Are those numbers correct?
Ms. Shaw. Yes, sir, that's the data we received from CBP.
Mr. Armstrong. And the El Paso sector has experienced the
sharpest increase in apprehensions as any other sector,
according to the report?
Ms. Shaw. That's correct.
Mr. Armstrong. So if there were no individuals--I mean, if
there were no illegal crossings at the border, there wouldn't
be overcrowding at these facilities?
Ms. Shaw. Well, Border Patrol facilities are specifically
for individuals apprehended between ports of entry, so those
who present at ports of entry remain there, those who cross the
border between go to the BP facilities, Border Patrol.
Mr. Armstrong. So yes?
Ms. Shaw. Yes. If we had no one crossing between points of
entry, there would be no one in those facilities.
Mr. Armstrong. Your May 30 report noted that further
limiting space--available space was the need to separate
detainees with infectious diseases, such as chicken pox,
scabies, and the flu, from each other and the general
population, and that the facility only had seven general cells
and three small isolation cells, right?
Ms. Shaw. That's correct.
Mr. Armstrong. And the report also noted that the ability
of ICE to accept single adults into its detention
infrastructure is strained, stating that ICE does not currently
have sufficient detention bed space to take all Border Patrol's
adult detainees, even though the report states in its footnote
that ICE accepts single adults into ICE detention facilities as
soon as space becomes available.
So even though CBP completes processing of these
individuals in a few days, these single adults are backing up
in CBP custody because ICE doesn't have the room for them?
Ms. Shaw. That's correct. And that's according to CBP
management.
Mr. Armstrong. And the report indicates that overcrowded
conditions are a result of, one, high numbers of people
crossing; two, the need to separate detainees with infectious
diseases; and, three, the inability of ICE to accept single
adults from CBP due to lack of bed space.
Ms. Shaw. Those do seem to be some of the factors driving
the issue.
Mr. Armstrong. So if Congress doesn't act to do things,
such as providing more ICE bed space or by addressing the root
causes of the large numbers of migrants arriving on the
southern border in the first place, CBP's only option to
address the overcrowded conditions would be, what, to release
them?
Ms. Shaw. That could be one option, creating more space to
detain them, but that wouldn't address the prolonged detention
issue.
Mr. Armstrong. And that's kind of one of the problems with
the word ``immediately.'' I mean, we say immediately, we want
something to happen. But creating more space cannot happen
overnight, right? I mean, you have to--I mean, whether it's a
tent facility, I mean, it still has to be something that can
work.
So, I mean, what's a timeframe to put one of these
facilities up if everybody moved as quickly as possible?
Ms. Shaw. I don't have precise statistics on that. I do
know that the soft-sided structures are able to be deployed
fairly quickly. And in the management response that we received
from DHS to the management alert, they indicated that some of
those facilities were up and ready to accept individuals, but
the more complicated structures were going to take more time.
Mr. Armstrong. And the reason I talk about immediately is
the OIG response to DHS' response reiterated that immediate
action is needed, and I think everybody agrees with that. But
other than those steps that DHS is taking within the confines
of the resources Congress has given them, what specifically
does the OIG office expect DHS to do?
Ms. Shaw. What we put in our management alert was we were
looking for some action to address the issue. The response that
we got was that the larger structure would not be ready until
2020. And so we couldn't consider that a resolved
recommendation when we're looking for something immediate.
Mr. Armstrong. Well, and that is even before we talk about
judicial injunctions and lawsuits and, I mean, those are going
on. I mean, none of this is occurring in a legislative vacuum
either.
Ms. Shaw. Uh-huh.
Mr. Armstrong. I mean, we can't prevent people from
arriving sick and in need of medical care a segregation in that
we've already maxed out ICE bed space. I just go back to, is
the only other alternative just to release everybody?
Ms. Shaw. I can't give you an answer on that at this point.
What I can tell you is that part of the work that we have
ongoing is to look at the root causes and allow us to do the
deeper dive that would help us present some recommendations
that we think could help solve the problem.
Our management alerts are really meant to shine a light on
an issue that is so important or emergent that we don't want to
wait to do complete reporting and do the work that goes into
creating solutions and recommendations. So this is a
preliminary snapshot of the issue. We are doing that more in
depth dive at this point and hope to have some very helpful
recommendations come out of that work.
Mr. Armstrong. Well, and I appreciate that because I think
we need triage and long-term solutions. Thank you.
Ms. Lofgren. Thank you.
The chairman of the committee, Mr. Nadler, is recognized
for 5 minutes.
Chairman Nadler. Thank you, Madam Chair.
And thank you for testifying here today. We appreciate you
being here. I want to discuss the two management alerts you put
out recently focusing on the inspection of the El Paso Del
Norte Processing Center.
As Representative Lofgren mentioned in her opening
statement, we visited that facility back in late March, and
even then, the facility was extremely overcrowded with people
being held for long periods of time. Your inspection found
things had deteriorated even further.
Your report provides the following evidence of
overcrowding, including photographs. A cell with a maximum
capacity of 12 people holding 76, a cell with a maximum
capacity of 8 holding 41, a cell with a maximum capacity of 35
holding 155 people.
For each of these cells, which we understand were only
examples of the overcrowding at Del Norte, could you please
estimate the size of the cell in terms of length and width?
Ms. Shaw. I was not personally there, so I'm going off the
same photographs that you have. I could get that information
for you as a take-back.
Chairman Nadler. Okay. Can you describe the conditions of
the people and the insides of these cells, and understanding
that you were not able to speak--as you witnessed them and
understanding you were not able to speak with them directly?
Ms. Shaw. Yes. So based on the photographs and the reports
back from my team, many of the people in the cells that were
overcapacity were standing shoulder to shoulder. There wasn't
room to sit down. There certainly wasn't room to lie down.
Chairman Nadler. So how do they sleep, standing up?
Ms. Shaw. It was a challenge. I think we also reported that
in some instances, individuals were standing on top of the
toilets in order to get a little extra breathing room. So it
was very, very crowded. And, of course, that, you know,
contributes to a lot of issues, including possibility for
transmitting infectious disease and potentially----
Chairman Nadler. And lack of accessibility of that toilet
for use?
Ms. Shaw. Correct.
Chairman Nadler. What steps, if any, was CBP taking to
remedy the situation, the situation about the toilets being
used for standing on instead of for use?
Ms. Shaw. My understanding is that the conditions were what
they were. They were trying to triage as best as possible. As
you saw from some of the photographs, many of the individuals
at that facility were outside for processing and would never
have even seen the inside of the facility. So they're making
use of that outside parking lot space as an effort to triage
and release some of the pressure on the inside of the facility.
Some of the detainees are moved to other facilities as
quickly as possible, but even with those measures in place, it
was still overcrowded in a way that our inspectors----
Chairman Nadler. The report says that Border Patrol agents
told us, that is your office, some of the detainees have been
held in standing room only conditions for days and weeks.
Ms. Shaw. That's correct.
Chairman Nadler. Based on these admissions, is it your
understanding that there were people in the facility who had
not been able to sit or lie down for days or weeks?
Ms. Shaw. In the most crowded cells, we did not go in to
speak directly with the individual detainees, so I can't
comment on the personal circumstances. But in standing room
only conditions, it's hard to imagine how anybody could have--
--
Chairman Nadler. And they were there for days and weeks in
those conditions?
Ms. Shaw. Correct.
Chairman Nadler. Have you ever been in a CBP detention
facility before where there were individuals who were not able
to stand for 24 hours, let alone--or to sit for 24 hours, let
alone multiple days or weeks?
Ms. Shaw. I have not personally. I know my team has seen
overcrowding in its day, but this certainly rose to a new
level, which is part of what prompted us to write the
management alerts.
Chairman Nadler. And, lastly, I want to draw your attention
to a photo on page 6 of the report. Your team observed staff
discarding personal items, including backpacks, suitcases,
handbags, and a child's doll in a dumpster.
Did you witness CBP staff opening up, reviewing, assessing
the condition and/or inventorying the personal items of
immigrants before throwing them into a dumpster?
Ms. Shaw. Again, I did not personally witness it, but our
team did watch as they confiscated the materials and discarded
them, and they were not being individually reviewed.
Chairman Nadler. They were not being individually
inventoried, so we don't know what they were throwing out?
Ms. Shaw. Right, for the items in that dumpster. Now, when
people did present, their valuables were tagged, things like
phones and wallets, but the larger items got discarded.
Chairman Nadler. Now, to the extent you were able to watch
CBP staff handling personal items, could you estimate how long
an officer took to assess the condition of an item before
throwing it in the dumpster?
Ms. Shaw. I don't know. I think it was a fairly fast
assessment, but I could get more details on that for you.
Chairman Nadler. Thank you. And, finally, staff told you
and your investigators that it was necessary to dispose of all
these personal items because they presented a, quote,
biohazard, unquote.
Based on your observations regarding staff's treatment of
these personal items, were staff in a position to make this
assessment that these were all biohazards, and were you
satisfied with this justification?
Ms. Shaw. I'm afraid I don't have information on that. I
can tell you that under the TEDS standards, typically what
should happen is that all of the property should be tagged and
should move with the individual through the facility. This was,
I think, a relatively new explanation that we've received, the
issue of biohazard. It was clear that some of the items were
wet and muddy, but others did not appear to be visibly----
Chairman Nadler. It was clear that a lot of the belongings
were just being thrown out pell-mell with no regard given to
safeguarding the belongings of these people?
Ms. Shaw. They were being collected and discarded, that's
correct.
Chairman Nadler. Thank you very much.
My time has expired.
Ms. Lofgren. The gentleman from Florida, Mr. Steube, is
recognized.
Mr. Steube. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Ms. Shaw, isn't it true that these locations, El Paso and
the Rio Grande Valley, were specifically selected for
inspections because those sectors had seen unprecedented
increase in the numbers of apprehensions?
Ms. Shaw. That's one of the factors we consider. We also
look at complaints we've received through the OIG Hotline,
information that we've collected on past inspections. And we
also rely on our investigators who are in the field and
familiar with the facilities to help us identify where we ought
to be looking.
Mr. Steube. And by law, CBP is required to place
unaccompanied alien children in its custody with Health and
Human Services, correct?
Ms. Shaw. I don't know that that's actually the case, but
typically, for long-term detention, UACs are handed off from
CBP to HHS ORR.
Mr. Steube. Yeah. It's my understanding it's required by
law that that occurs, and it's supposed to happen within 72
hours. But if HHS doesn't have a shelter space for a child in
CBP custody, well, I mean, I don't understand what they're
supposed to do if there's not a place to take them. So should
CBP simply release the child out onto the streets within the
72-hour period provided for in law for that transfer to occur?
Ms. Shaw. No, I don't think that they should do that. I
think that's exactly the issue; they're having to hold people
much longer than what's anticipated under the law.
Mr. Steube. So it's not really CBP's problem--well, it's a
problem, but it's not really their responsibility if they
physically don't have anywhere to legally put this child.
They're not going to just--as you said, you don't want them to
just release the child out and let the child go, because that's
going to create a number of different issues. So what are they
supposed to do if there's not a place to transfer them to in an
HHS bed?
Ms. Shaw. That's exactly the problem that we're seeing.
They have limited options, and so they're holding people for
longer periods of time than the 72 hours.
Mr. Steube. So it's not that Customs and Border Patrol is
actively preventing children from being transferred to HHS
custody; it's because they don't have a place to take them?
Ms. Shaw. So we did not observe any indication that CBP was
actively holding UACs or minors back from transfer. I can't say
with absolute certainty, because we haven't finished our work
yet, whether CBP has some role in the delays in transfer.
That's something we would be looking at. For instance, if it's
a manual process and there's missing information.
But CBP has certainly suggested that lack of space at the
HHS facilities is part of the problem in terms of the prolonged
detention of UACs.
Mr. Steube. So in your observation, then, the unaccompanied
children are being moved to HHS bed space as soon as possible?
Ms. Shaw. As soon as HHS can notify them of a placement and
transportation can be arranged, yes.
Mr. Steube. Okay. Both of your reports express concern for
the welfare of the CBP officers and agents as well as the
individuals in custody. Wouldn't you agree that congressional
inaction to address the border crisis is putting our law
enforcement personnel at increase in unnecessary risk of
illness, anxiety, and violence?
Ms. Shaw. I don't have an opinion on that. I can tell you
from our work that it is creating a pressure situation for the
agents. We did observe agents stressed, anxious, high incidence
of illness, not only of the agents but their families. So it is
creating a difficult situation.
Mr. Steube. When you talk about disease amongst the
individuals coming into custody, and some of those are
contagious diseases, so if the officers are being suspected to
that--susceptive to that, then that's obviously putting them at
risk to get those illnesses?
Ms. Shaw. That's true.
Mr. Steube. Your office remained unsatisfied with DHS'
responses to the management alerts. And you stated in your
testimony that you remain concerned that DHS needs to take
immediate steps, and this is along the lines of what Mr.
Armstrong was asking. So wouldn't the only other immediate
steps to be taken simply to release all single adults, like we
are forced to do with family units, and then admit that we have
a broken system? What else are you supposed to do with these
single adults?
Ms. Shaw. Right. Unfortunately, I don't have an answer for
you on what the solution to the problem is. We are doing a
deeper dive to try to understand all of the factors and be able
to put forward a more comprehensive set of recommendations. But
based on our initial observations, which we reported in the
management alert, we don't have a position yet on what would
solve the problem.
Mr. Steube. Well, I mean, we're talking about single adults
here. So what if some of those were criminals? I mean, wouldn't
it be your position that you don't want criminals released into
the American society?
Ms. Shaw. So when we go in, we're looking at compliance
with TEDS standards, and the standards lay out how long people
are supposed to stay with CBP. And so we document and report on
issues of noncompliance. I'm not going to state an opinion on a
broader question about immigration policy.
Mr. Steube. So you don't have an opinion as to whether we
release criminals from other countries into our country. You
don't have an opinion on that?
Ms. Shaw. I have an opinion, but I'm here in my official
capacity as a member of the IG community. I'm not here to
express my personal opinion.
Mr. Steube. Okay. I yield back to the chair.
Ms. Lofgren. The gentleman yields back.
The gentlelady from Washington, Ms. Jayapal, is recognized.
Ms. Jayapal. Thank you, Madam Chair.
And thank you, Ms. Shaw, for being here. Is it true that
there could be many reasons for why there is overcrowding in
CBP related to policy choices that the administration is
making?
Ms. Shaw. We have not done the work yet to determine what
the root causes are, but we expect that they're going to be a
range of issues that come together and create a set of
circumstances.
Ms. Jayapal. Right. That is why in fact you're doing the
root causes examination, to see why--and why folks are backing
up at the border.
Ms. Shaw. Precisely.
Ms. Jayapal. Earlier, you said that--you were discussing
the ports of entry question, and you said that apprehensions
are up, and that is for between the legal ports of entry,
correct?
Ms. Shaw. That's right.
Ms. Jayapal. And so what happens when you have a policy
that blocks the legal ports of entry for people to enter into?
Is it reasonable to say that people then, if they can't come
through the legal ports of entry, would then be crossing
between the legal ports of entry because we've actually closed
those legal ports of entry?
Ms. Shaw. So we have not done extensive work on that, but
in our family separations report that we put out last fall, we
did identify an instance of at least one, possibly two,
individuals who had suggested that there could be an uptick in
illegal border crossings when there's a backup at the port of
entry, but that's something that we would need to look into.
Ms. Jayapal. Thank you. I just wanted to make sure I'm
responding to my colleagues across the aisle who are implying
that somehow border crossings are up, but the reason they're up
is because, in part--and you're going to look at this, so you
don't need to answer this question--because the Trump
administration has instituted metering, which has essentially
closed the legal ports of entry. And as Ms. Lofgren said, we
have been to the border many times actually now, and we have
actually watched this happening where people are turned back
from legal ports of entry because of metering.
You didn't look at, in your report, whether or not ICE beds
were actually filled to capacity or whether or not HHS had
space; you just asked CBP. Is that correct?
Ms. Shaw. That's correct. And we did speak with ICE and
HHS--or maybe just ICE--and got some preliminary information on
that, but we haven't independently corroborated that
information.
Ms. Jayapal. So if ICE beds are filled, it could be because
we're overusing detention itself. I just want to quote, this
was in an article in ProPublica--no, actually, I think it was
Wall Street Journal that said: By talking about this as a
resource issue, DHS is trying to convince people that the
problem is a lack of adequate facilities in which to detain
people rather than the overuse of detention itself.
And before I go to my next questions, I want to call your
attention to a BuzzFeed article on July 10 of 2019, where Carla
Provost, the CBP border chief, said that HHS didn't have bed
space, as you had mentioned. But HHS is quoted in that article,
Mr. Weber, as saying that it has taken every unaccompanied
child that was referred.
So, in other words, there was nobody that Border Patrol
referred that HHS didn't take. So I hope when you look at the
root causes, you will really carefully examine what space was
actually available.
I want to follow that up for your other--as you go into the
root causes discussion--ProPublica on July 12 of 2019, said
that--this is another piece that I think needs to go to the
question that the chairman raised about the actions and the
attitude of Border Patrol. But Border Patrol agents were
passing around a commemorative coin mocking care for migrant
children and just indicated that we should keep the caravans
coming so that the money could continue to flow.
Let me go to healthcare. Given the severe overcrowding and
condition that people arrived in, did the team believe that
there were enough healthcare staff, including doctors and
nurses, onsite to treat illnesses on arrival or as a result of
the overcrowding?
Ms. Shaw. So access to medical care is something that we
look at. We haven't reported on it yet. We're preparing a
capping report to cover all of our unannounced inspections for
this year, which will be a more comprehensive look at our
findings. It will include access to medical care.
I will tell you that beyond sort of a fairly
straightforward look at what sort of medical care they're
providing in terms of accessed individuals, emergency services,
we at DHS OIG don't really have the subject matter expertise at
this point to evaluate the quality of that care or to reach a
final conclusion about whether it's sufficient. Something that
we are considering, funding permitting, is to try to contract
to bring in some of that expertise, so that's something that we
could consider looking at in future work.
Ms. Jayapal. And the last thing I want to raise is,
according to notes contained in the FOIA that record
discussions between DHS OIG and CBP and ERO leadership, there
was situations in which a mother gave birth and then was
returned to CBP custody until the mother could be transferred
to ICE custody.
Is it your understanding that the newborn accompanied the
mother when she was returned to CBP detention? And what
justification, if any, did the CBP provide for continuing to
detain a newborn baby and a post-partum mother?
Ms. Shaw. I'm sorry, I don't have any information about
that particular case.
Ms. Jayapal. Thank you. I yield back.
Ms. Lofgren. The gentlelady yields back.
The gentleman from California is recognized.
Mr. McClintock. Thank you, Madam Chairman.
First, just to continue that point, whether they're coming
through legal ports of entry or crossing the border between
ports of entry, have we seen an increase in illegal immigration
over this past year?
Ms. Shaw. I can tell you, based on the apprehension data
that we got, that there's a significant increase, particularly
in El Paso sector and the Rio Grande Valley.
Mr. McClintock. Not just an increase, but a significant
increase where they're coming through the legal ports of entry
or coming illegally across the border itself?
Ms. Shaw. That's correct.
Mr. McClintock. Can you tell us, as these illegal
immigrants are entering our country, what is being done to
screen for disease, criminal records, verify their actual
identity, as well as an actual family relationship with the
children they're bringing?
Ms. Shaw. So I can't--I don't have the details on it. CBP
does initial processing. At that point, if the adult has
arrived with a minor child, they do what they can, sort of
operationally feasible, to evaluate the parental relationship
between the child and the parent. They do a screening for
medical, which can vary from asking someone how they're feeling
or if they have any illnesses to actually looking for
indications of illness.
Mr. McClintock. Okay. Suppose someone were coming through a
legal port of entry through, say, San Francisco or New York.
Ms. Shaw. Did you say a legal port of entry?
Mr. McClintock. A legal port of entry. A legal immigrant
entering this country. How is the screening for these issues,
disease, criminal record and the like, how is that conducted,
and how does that differ with those that are coming illegally
across our southern border?
Ms. Shaw. Oh, I see. So when someone presents at a port of
entry without travel documents?
Mr. McClintock. Correct.
Ms. Shaw. Right. I would have to get back to you to
determine whether there are any material differences in the way
that they are processed. I'll get back with my staff----
Mr. McClintock. I'd appreciate that.
Ms. Shaw [continuing]. And get you some details on that.
Mr. McClintock. One of the great concerns is that there is
very little screening going in as far as disease. If you're
simply asking somebody how they're feeling, you're obviously
not screening very thoroughly for disease. If you're not
actually able to verify their identity, run criminal records,
it doesn't sound like you are doing very much to screen for
criminals entering the country. And with the actual family
relationships, I'm told, perhaps you can help me on this, that
there is a fairly large percentage of children being brought
into this country by illegal immigrants who are not actually
related to them.
Ms. Shaw. I've heard those reports. We have not done any
work on that issue.
Mr. McClintock. Well, let me ask you. You're the inspector
general, why aren't you doing work on that issue?
Ms. Shaw. It's a resource issue, but it's something that we
are constantly considering. We're looking at issues, doing a
risk-based analysis to determine where best----
Mr. McClintock. I would think that those issues are
absolutely critical to the security of our southern border and
absolutely central to what's going on down there right now.
Ms. Shaw. Very important issues, absolutely.
Mr. McClintock. Let me just expand on the point that Mr.
Steube raised. A child was apprehended by Customs and Border
Patrol, they've got to be released within 72 hours under the
Flores Agreement. Is that correct?
Ms. Shaw. Yes.
Mr. McClintock. And if the CBP apprehends children, they're
only allowed to release them to HHS?
Ms. Shaw. If it's an unaccompanied alien child, the child
is supposed to be transferred into HHS custody.
Mr. McClintock. And that's not just a choice; that has to
happen. They're legally required to release these children to
that one Federal agency, correct?
Ms. Shaw. I believe that's correct.
Mr. McClintock. And the TVPRA requires that these
unaccompanied children being released to the HHS, the HHS is
then supposed to process the children, find their relatives and
foster care for them. So the Federal law requires them to be
released solely to HHS. The Department regulations and consent
decree requires this all to be done within 72 hours, but that's
not happening, right?
Ms. Shaw. Correct. We have prolonged detention in many
cases.
Mr. McClintock. So the CBP is between a rock and a hard
place. They're violating their own regulations and the Flores
Agreement by keeping these children, but they'd be violating
the TVPRA by releasing these children to anyone other than HHS,
who doesn't have the capacity to accept these children. Is that
essentially what's going on?
Ms. Shaw. CBP cannot unilaterally effect a transfer to ICE
or HHS. They need ICE and HHS to find a suitable placement.
Mr. McClintock. How important is the $4.6 billion that the
President requested months ago and that House Democrats delayed
for several months before finally releasing it a week or two
ago?
Ms. Shaw. We have not looked at that. We do have ongoing
work that is evaluating what CBP's plan is for deploying those
funds.
Mr. McClintock. How long will it take those funds to be
deployed?
Ms. Shaw. I couldn't tell you, but I know some of them are
meant to be spent this year. So there's a very small window in
which it could be spent.
Mr. McClintock. Thank you.
Ms. Lofgren. The gentleman yields back.
The gentleman from California, Mr. Correa, is recognized
for 5 minutes.
Mr. Correa. Thank you, Madam Chair.
And I want to thank Inspector Shaw for being here today and
testifying.
You decided to spot check El Paso Norte Inspection
Processing Center. You mentioned you had some complaints,
complaint hotline. Who put in those complaints that was one of
the reasons you made that inspection happen quickly?
Ms. Shaw. So just to clarify for the record, that's
generally how we identify where we want to go with our
unannounced inspections. That doesn't suggest that we got a
particular complaint about any particular facility. It's one of
the factors that we look at.
Mr. Correa. That hotline, who calls in that hotline?
Officers working there? Citizens? Who actually calls in?
Ms. Shaw. We get upwards of 30,000 complaints a year that
come from everyone across the country. It might be internal, a
DHS employee, it be might be a concerned citizen, sometimes
it's an advocate for someone who's in detention. So we get the
full range.
Mr. Correa. You have visited dozens of detention centers in
your career. Have you ever seen overcrowding or conditions
comparable to those that we are seeing today?
Ms. Shaw. So our inspections team, some of whom have been
doing this for a decade, had never seen anything like this
before.
Mr. Correa. So looking back at the eighties, nineties,
we've had a refugee challenge in this country for a number of
years from Central America. What is it that's different this
time? I mean, under the Obama administration, I remember, as a
State senator, going to visit some of the facilities, and I
concur with you, I've never seen anything like this.
In your deep dive, will you be able to determine what the
difference is in terms of what has caused this situation to
spring up on us all of a sudden?
Ms. Shaw. We will be trying to understand that and identify
those issues, within the limits of our jurisdiction. So we
oversee the Department of Homeland Security. We will be looking
at factors that impact them; we will not be able to opine on
broader policy questions. But certainly, we'll be looking at
things like volume and the demographic of folks who are
crossing, because obviously, the more family units and UACs we
receive, the more constraints there are in space because there
are rules about who can----
Mr. Correa. Again, you talk about the volume, but I know
that in the past, we've had time periods when the volumes have
been comparable, yet the circumstances that we see here are not
comparable.
Ms. Shaw. I do know that in 2014, we saw an influx of
unaccompanied alien children crossing. At that time period, we
did see high rates. We saw, I think, some overcrowding and
prolonged detention, but again, this is something we have not
seen before.
Mr. Correa. And in 2014, did you check those alien children
for criminal backgrounds?
Ms. Shaw. DHS OIG?
Mr. Correa. Yes.
Ms. Shaw. No, we did not.
Mr. Correa. Or other agencies?
Ms. Shaw. I don't have information on what DHS might have
done in those individual cases.
Mr. Correa. Should we be checking those children for
criminal backgrounds?
Ms. Shaw. I don't have an opinion on that. That's not an
issue that we've looked at DHS OIG.
Mr. Correa. Thank you very much. And, again, as you do your
deep dive, I hope that your agency--and I think you have done
some good work, but I hope you continue to do it. What is it
that is different now? Again, I've seen this--I know during the
Salvadorian civil war, massive number of refugees. 2014, again,
that was a time period I inspected facilities in the State of
California, and never have we ever seen these kinds of
conditions. And, again, folks at the border being overwhelmed.
Border checkpoints. Crossing between border checkpoints.
We've got to figure out what has led to these conditions,
and I hope that you do that deep dive, and not policy, but give
us some facts, compare and contrast past years versus current
years, what have administrations done different that have led
to situations less serious than what we have here today?
Thank you, Madam Chair. And with that, I yield the
remainder of time.
Ms. Lofgren. The gentleman yields back.
I would recognize the ranking member of the subcommittee,
the gentleman from Colorado.
Mr. Buck. Thank you very much, Ms. Shaw, for being here
today.
We just want to follow up on something the gentleman just
asked in terms of comparable volumes. And I understand that
this isn't your job, but it is the work of the agency that
reports these.
In 2014, the agency reported--and I'm going to ask you if
this is correct. I'm not trying to lead you, but just ask you
if this is approximately correct. The agency reported
approximately 2,000 individuals per day crossing the border.
And in 2019, we have between 4- and 5,000 individuals per day
crossing the border.
Do those numbers sound approximately correct?
Ms. Shaw. I'm sorry. I personally don't know that
information, but I could get back to you with some more details
on that.
Mr. Buck. What I'd like to know is if there were comparable
numbers, because I don't believe there were comparable numbers.
I think that the surge that we have seen in individuals in the
last few months is unprecedented and has put an unprecedented
amount of stress and strain on the system. And so, I'd
appreciate knowing that.
Ms. Shaw. Sure.
Mr. Buck. You were at some of these facilities?
Ms. Shaw. Not me personally, my team.
Mr. Buck. And did your team give you feedback--and I'm
going to ask you to take your official hat on off for a second.
But as a person, it pains me to see individuals in this
kind of crowded condition. Did anybody express that to you?
Ms. Shaw. On my team?
Mr. Buck. Yes.
Ms. Shaw. What I can tell you--and I like to stay close to
our public reporting. But I can tell you that the day that they
completed their second day of inspections, the team was
concerned, and immediately emailed me with photographs and a
summary of what they had seen. And based on that information, I
made an immediate decision that we needed to put out a
management alert, and that it needed to be done within 3 to 4
weeks so that we could shine a light on the issue, because it
was something that we had never seen before, and because of the
risks associated with the overcrowding.
Mr. Buck. So as a person, there were individuals on the
team that were concerned about the conditions that these
immigrants were being held in?
Ms. Shaw. Absolutely. They immediately identified the risks
associated with that.
Mr. Buck. Were there also concerns about the staff that--
that was there, and the stress that was placed on the staff?
Ms. Shaw. We try to talk to staff when we do these
inspections and hear their points of view as well. We did ask
them and got information about the higher rates of illness. We
did report on some staff experiencing low morale, looking to
make early retirement. So we do try to collect that information
as well. And we reported on it because we found that also to be
a risk factor and concerning.
Mr. Buck. Well, I guess what I'm trying to figure out is,
were there any staff that were happy that they were working in
these kinds of conditions and happy that they were trying to--
that they were holding people as they were being held? It
sounds like a very stressful situation for everybody.
Ms. Shaw. Our observation was that everybody was challenged
by the circumstances.
Mr. Buck. And we heard the word ``torture'' used earlier by
the chairman of the full committee. Did your staff or team see
any torture? You know what torture is. You're an attorney.
Ms. Shaw. Yes.
Mr. Buck. There is an international norm for torture. Did
you see or your team see----
Ms. Shaw. We did not evaluate whether torture by any sort
of legal definition was taking place. What we do look at are
the minimum standards which were not being complied with in
terms of overcrowding and the conditions there. And so we did
find that concerning.
Mr. Buck. When you do this deep dive, will you be looking
at the interior of the country and noting the impact that
immigration has, particularly on small, rural communities,
where an influx of individuals can literally bankrupt a school
district, and putting stress on the school district having
monolingual Spanish-speaking or foreign-speaking students in
that school district and trying still to educate English-
speaking students where class sizes are increasing?
Will you have any deep dive on the effect of that vast
numbers of illegal immigrants create on a healthcare system in
small or rural communities? Will you have any deep dive on the
impact that vast numbers of illegal immigrants have on the
justice system in smaller, rural communities?
Ms. Shaw. So that's probably beyond the scope of the work
that we will be doing, although we always do look to try to
understand effects of the findings that we make. And so, we
would be looking at that, but probably not doing the deep dive
that I hear you describing.
Mr. Buck. And will you, in this deep dive, look at the
causes of why people are coming to this country in the numbers
that they're coming to, and especially taking advantage of the
asylum laws, if they're being coached to give certain answers
when they arrive in this country? So they don't identify
economic reasons for being here, but rather, they identify
personal risks and safety reasons.
Ms. Shaw. So we'll follow the facts where they lead us.
Doing in-depth research in a foreign country about the
circumstances there is probably beyond our scope. But
certainly, at the time that folks are presenting or being
apprehended, we'll be looking at the reasons that they're
giving, we'll be looking at the explanations provided by
management, and trying to independently corroborate whatever we
can.
Mr. Buck. And my time is up, and I yield back.
Thank you very much.
Ms. Lofgren. The gentleman yields back. I'd like to
recognize the gentlelady from Texas, Ms. Garcia.
Ms. Garcia. Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you so much
for putting this hearing together, and Ms. Shaw, thank you for
being here today.
And as I understand it, you did not personally visit these
centers, but you had a team, right?
Ms. Shaw. That's correct.
Ms. Garcia. How much time did they spend there?
Ms. Shaw. Two days in one instance. And I'm trying to
remember for the June trips if it was 2 or 3 days.
Ms. Garcia. So they were able to get a good flavor for 2
days or 3 days of all of the operations of these facilities?
Ms. Shaw. Yes.
Ms. Garcia. Well, were you able to identify--I know you
said in your testimony, you mentioned at-risk populations, what
you described to be the unaccompanied minor children and their
families.
Could you characterize for me just what you mean by at-
risk, and what precautions that we're taking for these at-risk
populations?
Ms. Shaw. So at-risk is defined in the TEDS standards. And
it includes minors, pregnant individuals, people whose safety
may be compromised for some other reason. So that's defined,
and that's the population that we look at.
And in particular, our unannounced inspections this year
were focused primarily on children, so either children who were
physically separated from their children while in custody, or
who had arrived unaccompanied.
Ms. Garcia. Would that also include young women that were
pregnant or came through, or anyone that came through with any
young children?
Ms. Shaw. Yes.
Ms. Garcia. Like newborns or toddlers?
Ms. Shaw. Yes, pregnant women or women traveling with
children.
Ms. Garcia. Are pregnant women shackled?
Ms. Shaw. Pardon?
Ms. Garcia. Are pregnant women shackled?
Ms. Shaw. Shackled--I would have to get back to you on
that. I don't believe so, but I would have to----
Ms. Garcia. I know there were some reports of that.
So did you see any children or anyone under 18 years old
shackled in any way?
Ms. Shaw. No, I don't believe our team observed anybody in
the facilities in shackles.
Ms. Garcia. Okay. Now, I understand that you said that--you
made reference to someone suggesting that it was a ticking time
bomb, that the--you know, anybody in the Texas heat that has to
be standing up, I would dare say for even less than a day would
be--I know I wouldn't be able to handle it.
So what--what, if anything, do you think that they should
be doing to avoid the potential of a riot, or some serious, you
know, issues happening at any one of these facilities,
particularly in the adult area?
Ms. Shaw. Well, I mean, the short answer is any relief that
they can give to the system would help certainly with the
overcrowding and the prolonged detention.
We don't yet have work that would allow us to propose
solutions. That is part of what we're hoping to do with our
deeper dive. But before we can make recommendations, we need to
better understand the root causes, the full range of root
causes, and from there, we can inform our recommendations for
the Department.
Ms. Garcia. Most of those, again, are impacted by policy
decisions made by members all the way from the White House down
on how people should be treated, and how they should be
handled. Don't you agree?
Ms. Shaw. I haven't done the work yet. We will report
faithfully our findings.
Ms. Garcia. Tell me again when you plan to do this deep
dive?
Ms. Shaw. We've started the work. It's a deep dive, so it's
going to be a lengthier evaluation. It's not something we would
want to rush. At the same time, we understand it's very time
sensitive, so we're going to be working as expeditiously as we
can to get the reporting out.
Ms. Garcia. So what did people at these facilities tell you
that the folks were eating?
Ms. Shaw. I'm sorry. Could you repeat that?
Ms. Garcia. What were they eating?
Ms. Shaw. What were they eating? So there was a range. I
know baloney sandwiches, sometimes if it was possible, frozen
food that had been heated.
Ms. Garcia. Was it the famous frozen burrito?
Ms. Shaw. It may have been in some instances.
Ms. Garcia. Whoever has that contract is doing well.
Ms. Shaw. Okay. So as we reported in one of the management
alerts, the children who were supposed to have at least two hot
meals a day had not received them until the week of our
arrival. And so, what we saw was really a range. There was not
a lack of food, but, you know, hot meals and----
Ms. Garcia. It was not hot?
Ms. Shaw [continuing]. And a variety.
Ms. Garcia. I know in emergency situations, we always talk
about three hots and a cot. They're not, for sure, getting a
cot. They're for sure not getting even two hots, not even one
hot----
Ms. Shaw. Until the week of our inspection, correct.
Ms. Garcia. We understood through an FOA request that there
was no food contract and two employees were using their work
credit cards to order $10,000 worth of food for each day.
Ms. Shaw. That's correct.
Ms. Garcia. Did you find that?
Ms. Shaw. Yes. I believe that's what we've reported.
Ms. Garcia. And do you know why they're not able to correct
that?
Ms. Shaw. I think it was a timing issue. My understanding
is that they have addressed the food contracting issue. If it's
the instance that I'm thinking of, it just took them longer.
Ms. Garcia. Just quickly, for the record. I sat on the
Education Committee of the Texas State Senate, and there was
never a school district that came to us to tell us that they
were bankrupt because of any migrant children overflow or any
Spanish speakers. I mean, I think that is one of the big myths
that goes along, among many others, about topic of immigration.
Ms. Lofgren. The gentlelady's time has expired.
Ms. Garcia. Thank you.
Ms. Lofgren. And we would turn now to the gentlelady from
Florida, Ms. Mucarsel-Powell.
Ms. Mucarsel-Powell. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Ms. Shaw. Thank you for coming in and
testifying, and for that report.
The report that was issued by your office showed that the
administration is detaining people in horrible, inhumane
conditions at the border. There's severe overcrowding. At some
facilities, a cell that is meant for 35 people has over 155
people that are kept in standing room cells for days, sometimes
weeks, as you mentioned, no place to lie down or really have
any breathing room. I think we're losing all human decency in
this country.
The reports also show that there are not showers available,
toilets and sinks are not available for the people that have
been apprehended.
And what was so shocking to me is that I heard Vice
President Pence, when he visited the facilities last week and
he saw these inhumane conditions, and he saw for himself the
overcrowded cells that we are showing this afternoon in the
hearing, and his comments were, what we saw today was a
facility that is providing care that every American would be
proud of.
And so I ask you, Ms. Shaw, from what your office saw at
these facilities, are these conditions something Americans
should be proud of?
Ms. Shaw. So I obviously can't comment on the conditions
that Vice President Pence observed. But from the conditions
that our team observed during our two unannounced inspections,
we found serious issues with the overcrowding and prolonged
detention, which are not in compliance with CBP's own standards
for minimum care.
Ms. Mucarsel-Powell. You believe we could to better than
that?
Ms. Shaw. I think what our reporting shows is that there is
room for improvement.
Ms. Mucarsel-Powell. So--and also to reply to some of my
colleagues across the aisle that say that we haven't provided
the resources, I want to remind everyone here today that in
2017, the House of Representative sent $12.2 billion to CBP,
and the Democratic majority House of Representatives has sent
to date, in 2019, $14.7 billion.
So the resources are there. The apprehensions are high,
because we are not processing asylum requests, and because this
administration has chosen to detain people seeking refuge and
asylum.
A question that I want to turn to now is the OIG's
management alert about the Rio Grande Valley facilities.
The report states that 31 percent of the children held at
these facilities had been there longer than 72 hours. 165 of
the children have been living in these horrible conditions for
weeks.
Ms. Shaw, isn't this prolonged detention of the children in
violation of the Flores agreement?
Ms. Shaw. The Flores agreement does seek to have children
moved out within 72 hours.
Ms. Mucarsel-Powell. And what were the reasons that the CBP
gave you for holding these children for so long?
Ms. Shaw. So CBP's assessment, the individuals that we
spoke with, indicated that it was a lack of space available to
take both minors and single adults.
We have not finished our deep dive to independently
corroborate whether that's true or whether there are other
issues impacting that, but that is something that we will be
looking at very carefully.
Ms. Mucarsel-Powell. And did your team find that the
children were being kept in cells like we described,
overcrowded cells, where there's not even enough room for them
to lay down, or with basic health/sanitation resources?
Ms. Shaw. So the cells that we observed holding family
units, so people with children, and then also unaccompanied
alien children, were overcrowded. It, in some instances, didn't
allow for laying down a mat, even though it was possible to lay
down.
So the situation was very crowded, maybe not as significant
as what we saw at the El Paso Del Norte facility, but
certainly, concerning and made compliance with the TEDS
standards very difficult.
Ms. Mucarsel-Powell. Did the team that visited the
facilities talk about the demeanor of the children?
Ms. Shaw. They did. You know, as you might expect, there's
a range, but that is something that we observe when we go on
site. And, you know, we saw overcrowding, people who had been
there a long time, children who were confused about their
circumstances and what was happening.
Ms. Mucarsel-Powell. So it was clear also that we continue
to separate children from their families at the border?
Ms. Shaw. Well, I can tell you in CBP facilities, at a
minimum, there is physical separation happening all the time,
simply because the rules dictate what populations are allowed
to be detained in the same space with others. So there may be
instances where parents are separated from their children while
they're in physical custody. We didn't evaluate whether legal
separations or separations with a legal impact were happening.
That was outside the scope of my----
Ms. Mucarsel-Powell. And my last question----
Chairman Nadler. The lady's time has expired. And----
Ms. Mucarsel-Powell. Quickly, age range for the kids that
are being detained that your team saw?
Ms. Shaw. We saw a vast range. But I think at one of the
facilities, or at least in the Rio Grande Valley, we saw at
least 50 UACs under the age of 7.
Ms. Mucarsel-Powell. Thank you.
Ms. Lofgren. The gentlelady from Texas, Ms. Escobar, is
recognized.
Ms. Escobar. Madam Chair, thank you so much for holding
this hearing today. I'm very grateful for it.
Ms. Shaw, thank you for being here.
I think it is very important that we focus on solutions.
And while some of my colleagues on the other side of the aisle
want to focus on resources, I would like to remind them that
there was an emergency supplemental passed in February, there
was another emergency supplemental passed a couple--a few
months later, and things haven't changed. And so for many of
us, it's not simply a question of resources; it's a question of
policy.
I represent El Paso, Texas, which is at the very heart of
your investigation. And I have seen these conditions over and
over again. And so, I'm asking you questions coming from a
place of deep knowledge of what's happening in my own
community.
So we've been hearing for a long time that the conditions
in CBP are this way because ICE beds for single adults are not
available. Isn't it true that CBP has the ability to release
migrants from custody the same way that ICE does?
Ms. Shaw. I'm sorry. I couldn't answer that question for
you.
Ms. Escobar. It does. And I'd like for you to include that
in your deep dive, please.
What justification, if any--if any of your investigators
asked, did CBP provide to explain why it is refusing to release
people, even though migrants are suffering in appalling
conditions for weeks on end?
Ms. Shaw. That's not something that we reviewed as part of
these inspections.
Ms. Escobar. I would like for you all to follow up on that,
please.
Is it your understanding that ICE beds are available, but
that the agency is refusing to accept single adults in order to
ensure bed availability for increased interior enforcement,
such as the recent raids the administration has ordered?
Ms. Shaw. I don't have any information on that. I'm sorry.
Ms. Escobar. I would love for the OIG to look into that,
because, obviously, one has to wonder how can the
administration conduct such significant interior ICE raids if
there are no beds available? So I would very much like for you
to look into that.
Also, Ms. Shaw, are you aware that the El Paso--at Border
Patrol Station 1, there is a pretty significant soft-sided
facility?
Ms. Shaw. I believe that's correct, yes.
Ms. Escobar. Okay. And my staff visited Border Patrol
Station 1 the week before there was a congressional delegation
visit to Clint, and there were 200 women who had been held for
over a month outdoors in 90-plus degree heat. And just yards
away there was a nearly empty soft-sided facility.
Do you know why that is?
Ms. Shaw. That's not something that our teams observed, so
I'm afraid I don't have any information about that.
Ms. Escobar. Okay. Would you all look into that, please?
Would you mind, as a follow-up?
I would also ask if you believe there are other policy
decisions by the administration, such as family separation,
that has exacerbated the increasing number of individuals
arriving at our border, that by separating families, we could
very well--or the Trump administration could very well have
made a challenging situation far, far worse?
Ms. Shaw. So as part of our root cause analysis, we will be
looking at various factors. One could be policy. But we don't
make policy on behalf of the Department. We evaluate compliance
with policy. But in looking at cause and effect, it's something
that might come up.
Ms. Escobar. There is something else I would like for you
all to look into.
At the El Paso ICE detention facility, we have heard from
lawyers that there are a number of single adults in long-term
detention, some up to a year, some longer than a year,
essentially being held by the administration even though they
don't have a criminal record, even though they have a sponsor
in the country. And have you all looked at anything like that?
Ms. Shaw. So we haven't looked at that specific issue, but
we also conduct unannounced inspections of ICE facilities to
evaluate their compliance with their own standards. And so in
the course of doing that, we do interview individuals, hear
about how long they've been detained and collect evidence about
that.
Ms. Escobar. I would urge you to do that, only because we
keep hearing over and over again that we need more ICE beds.
Again, the interesting detail, there is going to be--there has
been, starting Sunday, ICE raids all over the country. Where
will people go if there are full ICE beds. And also, would like
for you to look at that long-term detention.
And I just want to say in closing that I find it deeply
troubling that at a hearing where we're looking at really
horrific conditions for people in our custody, that we get a
request from the ranking member that you look at the impact
that Spanish speakers are having on schools in rural America.
Thank you for your time today.
Ms. Lofgren. The lady's time has expired.
The gentlewoman from Texas, Ms. Jackson Lee, is recognized
for 5 minutes.
Ms. Jackson Lee. I thank the chairwoman. I add my
appreciation for the hearing at this time.
I thank the Assistant Attorney Inspector General, Ms. Shaw,
thank you for your presence here.
I noticed the date on the initial report coming from your
visit to the various sites. It says May 30th.
Was that the date that the Secretary received your report?
Ms. Shaw. No, that was the date the report was published
for the public. We send over draft reports for management
comment.
Ms. Jackson Lee. What date did the Secretary get the
report?
Ms. Shaw. For May 30th, I believe we sent it to them on May
20th.
Ms. Jackson Lee. On May 20th. Thank you.
Ms. Shaw. Yes.
Ms. Jackson Lee. And so as you well know, you have seen a
series of congressional groups, and as well, the Vice
President. And I assume you watched television, social media,
and you've seen some similar sites that you have seen, that you
saw when you inspected? Is that accurate?
Ms. Shaw. I think so, yeah.
Ms. Jackson Lee. And so, can you explain to me why the
Secretary of Homeland Security and his staff, from May 20th to
July 2nd and July 1st, when I was in the area, and then just
last week, last Thursday for the Vice President, why conditions
were exactly the same?
Ms. Shaw. I can't comment on what the conditions were at
the time of their visits, so I wouldn't be able to compare them
to what we saw.
Ms. Jackson Lee. Well, do you look at television?
Ms. Shaw. I actually don't----
Ms. Jackson Lee. Okay. If it----
Ms. Shaw [continuing]. Don't watch too much television.
Ms. Jackson Lee. If it was overcrowding, is that not a
challenge that what you reported on May 20th was still going
on, on last Thursday?
Ms. Shaw. Again, I can't comment on----
Ms. Jackson Lee. But if it was, would that be a problem?
Ms. Shaw. Overcrowding of facilities is noncompliance with
TEDS standards and that can be a problem.
Ms. Jackson Lee. And it is what you reported to the
Secretary; is that not correct?
Ms. Shaw. Correct.
Ms. Jackson Lee. All right. And in your report--let me read
into the record--you said: This is for your action is our final
management alert--management alert, DHS needs to address
dangerous overcrowding among single adults at El Paso Del Norte
Processing Center, the purpose of which is to notify you of
urgent issues that require immediate attention and action.
If those same conditions were at another site, say
McAllen--you may not have visited there--would that also
require urgent attention?
Ms. Shaw. Depending on the seriousness of the issue,
potentially, yes.
Ms. Jackson Lee. But if it was the same as what you saw--if
it was--this is obviously a hypothetical.
Ms. Shaw. This level of overcrowding was significant enough
that we put out a management alert before continuing our deeper
dive.
Ms. Jackson Lee. Do you believe it's important that you
have the opportunity to visit without notice?
Ms. Shaw. Yes. I think that that helps us get the best----
Ms. Jackson Lee. And is that important, as far as you can
relate, to have the opportunity to visit without notice as
relates to oversight?
Ms. Shaw. For our oversight, we consider it important to be
able to come unannounced and see issues as they are that day.
Ms. Jackson Lee. And it might likely be as important for
Members of Congress on the Oversight Committees?
Ms. Shaw. I don't have an opinion on that. I'm sorry.
Ms. Jackson Lee. At least you mentioned that oversight
warrants having the opportunity to visit.
Let me ask about morale, without notice. Morale. Did you
take note of the fact that morale among the staff might be
challenged, the Border Patrol, and also that they're
experiencing a lot of illnesses? What impact would that have?
Ms. Shaw. All we reported were our observations and the
information we collected. Certainly, it seems to be
contributing to a very stressful environment. I think folks
generally seemed tired and overworked. Beyond that, I don't
have any additional information.
Ms. Jackson Lee. You watched a lot of men standing in a
crowded circumstance?
Ms. Shaw. Yes, in one of the detention holding cells.
Ms. Jackson Lee. With that kind of crowded atmosphere,
without making any judgments about those individuals, is that
something that could possibly create a violent situation,
violent response, a natural, normal response, a frustration
among those who were detained, not that they are violent, but
because of the conditions?
Ms. Shaw. I can't make a general statement, but I can say
that when we observed, particularly in the Rio Grande Valley,
that tensions were very high and that as soon as our presence
was known among the detainees, they did sort of express
frustration and try to get our attention. And it became serious
enough that we actually ceased our work and didn't press
further, which we would typically do, just in order to make
sure that we were maintaining the safety for both personnel,
DHS personnel, and the detainees.
Ms. Jackson Lee. And you saw children who were likewise----
Ms. Lofgren. And the lady's time has expired.
Ms. Jackson Lee [continuing]. Situated? Thank you for your
presence here.
Ms. Lofgren. The gentlelady from Pennsylvania is recognized
for 5 minutes.
Ms. Scanlon. Thank you, Chair Lofgren, for calling this
really important hearing.
And thank you, Ms. Shaw, for your work.
I just wanted to turn to the July 15 report that you have
given to us today.
Just to summarize a couple of the top-line findings. So my
understanding is that this report, and the one from May and the
one from earlier in July, all come from the Inspector General's
office conducting unannounced inspections at CBP.
Ms. Shaw. I'm sorry. The July 15th report, is that----
Ms. Scanlon. That's your statement for today----
Ms. Shaw. Oh, okay.
Ms. Scanlon. That was submitted.
Ms. Shaw. Got it. Thank you. Just wanted to make sure I was
on the same page.
Ms. Scanlon. Sure.
And so on the first page of that, it indicates that your
inspectors observed dangerous overcrowding and prolonged
detention. Is that right?
Ms. Shaw. Correct.
Ms. Scanlon. Okay. And that included noncompliance with
standards applicable to children, including lack of access to
hot meals, showers, and change of clothes, right?
Ms. Shaw. Correct.
Ms. Scanlon. And those findings led you to publish two
alerts raising the issues to the attention of DHS leadership
and requesting immediate action, right?
Ms. Shaw. Correct.
Ms. Scanlon. And you recommended that the Department of
Homeland Security take immediate steps to alleviate dangerous
overcrowding and prolonged detention?
Ms. Shaw. That's right.
Ms. Scanlon. Okay. And then in your conclusions, you say
that the Department has not developed a long-term plan to
address these issues; is that right?
Ms. Shaw. That's our understanding, yes.
Ms. Scanlon. Okay. And that the Department's response to
your management alerts is not sufficient?
Ms. Shaw. Correct.
Ms. Scanlon. Okay. Now, before December 2018, no child had
died in Customs and Border Patrol custody in a decade. But at
least seven children have died in custody of Customs and Border
Patrol since last year.
So I think all of us have a lot of concerns about what goes
beyond being a troubling statistic but a horrifying fact, is
that children are dying in American custody at the border,
correct?
Ms. Shaw. Yes. I think we have confirmed that we have
ongoing investigations into several of those deaths.
Ms. Scanlon. Okay. I wanted to follow up on an exhibit or a
figure that Chairman Nadler was looking at and asked a couple
of questions. It was figure 5 from the May 30th, 2019, report.
Okay. And the explanation for that photo just kind of stopped
me in my tracks.
It indicates that your team saw hundreds of detainees in
lines surrendering their valuables to Customs and Border
Patrol. So money and phones. But your team also observed staff
discarding all other detainee property such as backpacks,
suitcases, and handbags in a nearby dumpster.
And then figure 5, which we have up now, showing backpacks,
handbags, and a doll. These are the detainees' personal
possessions, correct?
Ms. Shaw. Correct.
Ms. Scanlon. Okay. And it is not standard policy to throw
away the personal possessions of people seeking asylum in this
country, is it?
Ms. Shaw. No. The TEDS standards that govern this say that
you should be bagging and tagging property, and it typically
would be stored and then given back to the alien when they're
released.
Ms. Lofgren. The gentlelady's time has actually expired,
because we got a late start on the clock.
Ms. Scanlon. Oh.
Ms. Lofgren. And I'm wondering if you could yield back so I
can just make a few comments, and then we will go to vote,
because we are over our time.
Ms. Scanlon. Of course. I yield back.
Ms. Lofgren. Yield back.
I would just like to make a couple of points.
First, Dilley was empty and Berks was empty when these
pictures were taken. So there was capacity in ICE that was
unused.
It took the Obama administration 10 days to build a surge
capacity in 2014 when there was a surge of individuals coming
over, primarily unaccompanied minor children. And it is not
correct that this is illegal--208(a)(i) of the Immigration and
Nationality Act provides that individuals seeking asylum may do
so, either at ports of entry, or between ports of entry. So it
would be a misnomer to say this is illegal entry. In fact, it
is provided for in the Immigration and Nationality Act.
I'd just like to say, confirm, that you, in your further
looking, will take a look at the Border Patrol Facebook group
and 9,500 current and former Border Patrol members whose
postings were racist and dehumanizing.
Is that part of what you're going to be looking at?
Ms. Shaw. So one of projects that we recently put a
proposal together for and that we will be doing is looking
specifically at who within the DHS senior leadership was aware
of it, how they utilized that site, if at all, and what action
has been taken.
Ms. Lofgren. Thank you. We have reports out of Yuma that
are horrifying about conditions, and also, sadly a report,
unconfirmed, about an allegation of sexual assault by a border
patrol agent against a 15-year-old Honduran girl.
Can you confirm that you're looking into these incidents as
well?
Ms. Shaw. I can confirm that we are investigating the
circumstances surrounding the allegations of the individual.
Ms. Lofgren. I would ask, if possible, within your scope,
that you take a look to see whether there are other allegations
of sexual abuse that have come in or can be confirmed. We want
to make sure that none of that is happening.
I understand that you did an inspection of Clint before
conditions deteriorated. Do you plan to take another look at
that situation, and are you going to continue to take a look at
these border patrol stations?
Ms. Shaw. We do intend to continue our unannounced
inspections next year. We don't advertise where we're going.
Ms. Lofgren. Of course not.
Ms. Shaw. So they'll be truly unannounced. But, yes, we'll
continue to monitor the situation carefully.
Ms. Lofgren. I'd just like to close with this.
We have a large number of people seeking freedom at our
border pursuant to the Immigration and Nationality Act. Some of
them will qualify; some of them will not. But we are seeing a
management failure here, the unwillingness or inability to use
facilities that are available, instead piling people up in
these border patrol stations. The Family Case Management
Program that was fully funded at the beginning of this year,
that had a nearly 100 percent track record for people showing
up to their asylum hearings, has not been implemented, with no
explanation at all.
So I appreciate your appearance here today, your good work.
I think we will see you again.
And I will now conclude today's hearing, understanding that
without objection, all members have 5 legislative days to
submit additional written questions for the witness or
additional materials for the record.
Without objection, the hearing's adjourned.
[Whereupon, at 6:54 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.]
APPENDIX
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