[House Hearing, 116 Congress] [From the U.S. Government Publishing Office] EPA'S ENFORCEMENT PROGRAM: TAKING THE ENVIRONMENTAL COP OFF THE BEAT ======================================================================= HEARING BEFORE THE SUBCOMMITTEE ON OVERSIGHT AND INVESTIGATIONS OF THE COMMITTEE ON ENERGY AND COMMERCE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES ONE HUNDRED SIXTEENTH CONGRESS FIRST SESSION __________ FEBRUARY 26, 2019 __________ Serial No. 116-8 [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Printed for the use of the Committee on Energy and Commerce govinfo.gov/committee/house-energy energycommerce.house.gov ______ U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE 36-523 PDF WASHINGTON : 2020 COMMITTEE ON ENERGY AND COMMERCE FRANK PALLONE, Jr., New Jersey Chairman BOBBY L. RUSH, Illinois GREG WALDEN, Oregon ANNA G. ESHOO, California Ranking Member ELIOT L. ENGEL, New York FRED UPTON, Michigan DIANA DeGETTE, Colorado JOHN SHIMKUS, Illinois MIKE DOYLE, Pennsylvania MICHAEL C. BURGESS, Texas JAN SCHAKOWSKY, Illinois STEVE SCALISE, Louisiana G. K. BUTTERFIELD, North Carolina ROBERT E. LATTA, Ohio DORIS O. MATSUI, California CATHY McMORRIS RODGERS, Washington KATHY CASTOR, Florida BRETT GUTHRIE, Kentucky JOHN P. SARBANES, Maryland PETE OLSON, Texas JERRY McNERNEY, California DAVID B. McKINLEY, West Virginia PETER WELCH, Vermont ADAM KINZINGER, Illinois BEN RAY LUJAN, New Mexico H. MORGAN GRIFFITH, Virginia PAUL TONKO, New York GUS M. BILIRAKIS, Florida YVETTE D. CLARKE, New York, Vice BILL JOHNSON, Ohio Chair BILLY LONG, Missouri DAVID LOEBSACK, Iowa LARRY BUCSHON, Indiana KURT SCHRADER, Oregon BILL FLORES, Texas JOSEPH P. KENNEDY III, SUSAN W. BROOKS, Indiana Massachusetts MARKWAYNE MULLIN, Oklahoma TONY CARDENAS, California RICHARD HUDSON, North Carolina RAUL RUIZ, California TIM WALBERG, Michigan SCOTT H. PETERS, California EARL L. ``BUDDY'' CARTER, Georgia DEBBIE DINGELL, Michigan JEFF DUNCAN, South Carolina MARC A. VEASEY, Texas GREG GIANFORTE, Montana ANN M. KUSTER, New Hampshire ROBIN L. KELLY, Illinois NANETTE DIAZ BARRAGAN, California A. DONALD McEACHIN, Virginia LISA BLUNT ROCHESTER, Delaware DARREN SOTO, Florida TOM O'HALLERAN, Arizona ------ Professional Staff JEFFREY C. CARROLL, Staff Director TIFFANY GUARASCIO, Deputy Staff Director MIKE BLOOMQUIST, Minority Staff Director Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations DIANA DeGETTE, Colorado Chair JAN SCHAKOWSKY, Illinois BRETT GUTHRIE, Kentucky JOSEPH P. KENNEDY III, Ranking Member Massachusetts, Vice Chair MICHAEL C. BURGESS, Texas RAUL RUIZ, California DAVID B. McKINLEY, West Virginia ANN M. KUSTER, New Hampshire H. MORGAN GRIFFITH, Virginia KATHY CASTOR, Florida SUSAN W. BROOKS, Indiana JOHN P. SARBANES, Maryland MARKWAYNE MULLIN, Oklahoma PAUL TONKO, New York JEFF DUNCAN, South Carolina YVETTE D. CLARKE, New York GREG WALDEN, Oregon (ex officio) SCOTT H. PETERS, California FRANK PALLONE, Jr., New Jersey (ex officio) C O N T E N T S ---------- Page Hon. Diana DeGette, a Representative in Congress from the State of Colorado, opening statement................................. 1 Prepared statement........................................... 3 Hon. Brett Guthrie, a Representative in Congress from the Commonwealth of Kentucky, opening statement.................... 5 Prepared statement........................................... 6 Hon. Frank Pallone, Jr., a Representative in Congress from the State of New Jersey, opening statement......................... 7 Prepared statement........................................... 9 Hon. Greg Walden, a Representative in Congress from the State of Oregon, opening statement...................................... 10 Prepared statement........................................... 11 Witnesses Susan Parker Bodine, Assistant Administrator, Office of Enforcement and Compliance Assurance, Environmental Protection Agency......................................................... 13 Prepared statement........................................... 16 Answers to submitted questions............................... 176 Eric Schaeffer, Executive Director, Environmental Integrity Project........................................................ 52 Prepared statement........................................... 55 Chris Sellers, Ph.D., Professor of History and Director, Center for the Study of Inequalities, Social Justice, and Policy, Stony Brook University, on behalf of the Environmental Data and Governance Initiative.......................................... 67 Prepared statement........................................... 69 Bruce C. Buckheit, Analyst and Consultant, Former Director, Air Enforcement Division, Office of Enforcement and Compliance, Environmental Protection Agency................................ 105 Prepared statement........................................... 107 Jay P. Shimshack, Ph.D., Associate Professor of Public Policy and Economics, Frank Batten School of Leadership and Public Policy, University of Virginia......................................... 119 Prepared statement........................................... 121 Bakeyah S. Nelson, Ph.D., Executive Director, Air Alliance Houston........................................................ 124 Prepared statement........................................... 126 Ronald J. Tenpas, Partner, Vinson and Elkins, LLP, Former Assistant Attorney General, Environment and Natural Resources Division, Department of Justice................................ 133 Prepared statement........................................... 135 Answers to submitted questions............................... 209 Submitted Material Letter of February 25, 2019, from State Senator Jessica Unruh of North Dakota to Mr. Mullin, submitted by Mr. Mullin............ 157 Report of February 8, 2019, ``Fiscal Year 2018 EPA Enforcement and Compliance Annual Results,'' Office of Enforcement and Compliance Assurance, Environmental Protection Agency, submitted by Ms. DeGette....................................... 161 EPA'S ENFORCEMENT PROGRAM: TAKING THE ENVIRONMENTAL COP OFF THE BEAT ---------- TUESDAY, FEBRUARY 26, 2019 House of Representatives, Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations, Committee on Energy and Commerce, Washington, DC. The subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 10:31 a.m., in room 2322, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Diana DeGette (chair of the subcommittee) presiding. Members present: Representatives DeGette, Kennedy, Ruiz, Kuster, Castor, Sarbanes, Tonko, Clarke, Peters, Pallone (ex officio), Guthrie (subcommittee ranking member), Burgess, McKinley, Griffith, Mullin, Duncan, and Walden (ex officio). Also present: Representatives Barragan and Soto. Staff present: Mohammad Aslami, Counsel; Kevin Barstow, Chief Oversight Counsel; Jeffrey C. Carroll, Staff Director; Chris Knauer, Oversight Staff Director; Brendan Larkin, Policy Coordinator; Jourdan Lewis, Policy Analyst; Perry Lusk, GAO Detailee; Jon Monger, Counsel; Elysa Montfort, Press Secretary; Kaitlyn Peel, Digital Director; Mel Peffers, Environment Fellow; Tim Robinson, Chief Counsel; Nikki Roy, Policy Coordinator; Andrew Souvall, Director of Communications, Outreach, and Member Services; C. J. Young, Press Secretary; Jen Barblan, Minority Chief Counsel, Oversight and Investigations; Mike Bloomquist, Minority Staff Director; Adam Buckalew, Minority Director of Coalitions and Deputy Chief Counsel, Health; Margaret Tucker Fogarty, Minority Staff Assistant; Brittany Havens, Minority Professional Staff Member, Oversight and Investigations; Peter Kielty, Minority General Counsel; Ryan Long, Minority Deputy Staff Director; Peter Spencer, Minority Senior Professional Staff Member, Environment and Climate Change; and Natalie Sohn, Minority Counsel, Oversight and Investigations. OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. DIANA DeGETTE, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF COLORADO Ms. DeGette. The Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations will now come to order. Today, the subcommittee is holding a hearing entitled ``EPA Enforcement: Taking the Environmental Cop Off the Beat.'' The purpose of today's hearing is to explore transit enforcement measures during the Trump administration and whether the EPA is ensuring consistent enforcement and an implementation of Federal environmental regulations and laws, as well as resulting impacts on human health and the environment. The Chair recognizes herself for the purpose of an opening statement. For decades, this Oversight and Investigations Panel has worked to ensure that the Environmental Protection Agency is doing its job, including enforcement of our Nation's environmental laws. This work continues today. It is important to remember that when we talk about enforcement what we are really talking about is protecting our environment and our health from polluters. We are talking about keeping our rivers and waterways clean and harmful pollutants out of the air that each and every one of us breathes. If the EPA isn't enforcing the laws that we already have on the books, then we all pay the price. Unfortunately, the price that some of us pay is greater than others, as some of our Nation's bigger polluters are often located in or near minority and low-income communities. We have a responsibility to care for them, as we do every single person who calls America home. And ensuring the EPA is doing its job and holding polluters accountable is critical toward protecting their health and well-being. Now, I understand that enforcing our environmental laws can often be a long and intensive process. I also understand that there is not one single measurement that can be used to accurately evaluate the Agency's overall efforts to enforce our laws in any given year. That said, there are some indicators that are more telling than others and, when combined with others, can help to paint a pretty clear picture of what is really going on. The numbers you will hear today are from the EPA's own Office of Enforcement and Compliance Assurance and were included in a report released earlier this month detailing the Agency's 2018 enforcement and compliance activities. I am sure that the EPA will try to use these numbers today to paint a rather rosy interpretation of the enforcement efforts last year and probably they will talk about how proud they are of everything they did last year. But what I see when I look at this report is an Agency that simply is just sitting on its hands. I see an Agency that is giving polluters a free pass, and it is putting our health and our environment at risk. When EPA enforcement activities go down, pollution goes up. That is just a fact. And the latest numbers from the EPA show its overall enforcement activities for 2018 were at historically low levels. For example, and again, this is according to the Agency's own numbers, in fiscal year 2018, the EPA assessed polluters a total of $69 million in civil penalties -- $69 million. That is the lowest level of penalties assessed to polluters since the EPA created the Office of Enforcement over 20 years ago in 1994. Now again, I understand that enforcement efforts can often take months or even years to complete and that some of that work done in one year may not be accurately reflected in the overall total for any given year but the numbers seem to indicate a disturbing trend. And while no one factor can tell the whole story, there are some indicators that, when taken together, can help us paint a pretty clear picture of EPA's overall efforts to enforce our laws. For example, the total number of facilities that the EPA inspected last year is the lowest since 1994. The total number of civil cases it initiated is the lowest since 1982. And the number of cases it referred to the Department of Justice, the lowest since 1976, my freshman year in college. So, while I would like to sit here and believe that the EPA is serious about enforcing our Federal environmental laws, it is hard to ignore the facts and it is hard to ignore headline after headline which suggests the opposite. For example, Washington Post: ``Under Trump, EPA Inspections Fall to a 10- Year Low.'' New York Times: ``EPA Enforcement Drops Sharply in Trump's 2nd Year in Office.'' NBC News: ``EPA Criminal Action Against Polluters Hits 30-Year Low under Trump.'' Christian Science Monitor: ``Has the EPA Lost Its Teeth?'' So if the EPA isn't enforcing our environmental laws, who is? If the EPA isn't acting as the Nation's environmental watchdog that it was created to be, then it is just simply not acting in the best interest of the American taxpayers. The question is why. Why is the EPA sitting on the sidelines? Based on data provided by the Agency, the EPA has cut at least 17 percent of the personnel and that doesn't even include the personnel of the ten regional offices. We are also going to hear that the people who have remained at the EPA are facing even greater challenges when trying to perform their laws. Congress can do something about this. We need to require compliance. That is why we are having this hearing and that is why we expect the EPA to do its job. So, I am looking forward to the testimony today. I am looking forward to hearing from everybody. [The prepared statement of Ms. DeGette follows:] Prepared statement of Hon. Diana DeGette For decades, this oversight and investigations panel has worked to ensure that the Environmental Protection Agency is doing its job--including enforcing our Nation's environmental laws. That work continues today. It's important to remember, that when we talk about enforcement, what we are really talking about is protecting our environment--and our health--from polluters. We're talking about keeping our rivers and waterways clean; and harmful pollutants out of the air that each and every one of us breathes. If the EPA isn't enforcing the laws that we already have on the books, then we all pay the price. Unfortunately, the price some of us pay is greater than others--as some of our Nation's biggest polluters are often located in, or near, mostly minority and low-income communities. We have a responsibility to care for them, as we do every single person who calls America home. And ensuring the EPA is doing its job, and holding polluters accountable, is critical toward protecting their health and well-being. Now, I understand that enforcing our environmental laws can often be a long and intensive process. I also understand that there is not one single measurement that can be used to accurately evaluate the Agency's overall efforts to enforce our laws in a given year. That said, there are some indicators that are more telling than others, and when combined with others can help to paint a pretty clear picture of what's really going. The numbers you'll hear today are from the EPA's own Office of Enforcement and Compliance Assurance, and were included in a report it released earlier this month detailing the Agency's 2018 enforcement and compliance activities. I'm sure the EPA will try to use these numbers today to paint a rather rosy interpretation of its enforcement efforts last year. And they'll probably going on and on about how proud they are of all that they did last year. But what I see when I look at this report is an Agency that's sitting on its hands. I see an Agency that's giving polluters a free pass. And it's putting our health and environment at risk. When EPA enforcement activities go down, pollution goes up--that's a fact. And the latest numbers from the EPA show its overall enforcement activities for 2018 were at a historically low levels. For example--and, again, this is according to the Agency's own numbers--in fiscal year 2018 the EPA assessed polluters a total of $69 million in civil penalties. $69 million! That's the lowest total amount of penalties assessed to polluters since the EPA created the office of enforcement in 1994. Again, I understand that enforcement efforts can often take months and even years to complete, and that some of the work done in one year may not be accurately reflected in the overall total for that given year. But these numbers seem to suggest a disturbing trend taking place at EPA. And while no one figure can tell the whole story, there are some indicators that--when taken together--can help us paint a pretty clear picture of the EPA's overall efforts to enforce our laws. For example, the total number of facilities that the EPA inspected last year is the lowest since 1994. The total number of civil cases it initiated is the lowest since 1982. And the number of cases it referred to the Department of Justice--the lowest since 1976. So, while I'd like to sit here and believe that the EPA is serious about enforcing our Federal environmental laws, it's hard to ignore the facts. And it's hard to ignore headline after headline which suggest the opposite. For example: * Washington Post [quote]: ``Under Trump, EPA inspections fall to a 10-year low.'' * New York Times [quote]: ``EPA Enforcement Drops Sharply in Trump's 2nd Year in Office.'' * NBC News: [quote] ``EPA criminal action against polluters hits 30-year low under Trump.'' * Christian Science Monitor [quote]: ``Has the EPA Lost Its Teeth?'' If the EPA isn't enforcing our environmental laws, who is? If the EPA isn't acting as the environmental watchdog that it was created to be, then it's not acting in the best interest of the American taxpayers who fund it. The question is: why? Why is the EPA suddenly sitting on the sidelines? Based on data provided by the Agency, since President Trump took office, EPA has cut at least 17 percent of the personnel assigned to its main enforcement office. That doesn't include any of the personnel they have lost at any one of the EPA's 10 regional office, where much of the enforcement work really gets done. We'll also hear today how those who remained at EPA are facing even greater challenges when trying to perform their jobs under this administration. When President Trump announced his plans to cut the EPA by nearly 25 percent, he sent a pretty clear message to polluters and to the career staff at EPA where his priorities lied. Had those proposed cuts been successful, EPA's budget would have been cut by nearly $2.6 billion and its workforces would have reduced by more than 3,100 employees. Thankfully, Congress was able to prevent those massive cuts from going into effect. But, by simply proposing them in the first place, this administration accomplished its goal of sending a pretty clear message. Our committee has heard from Agency staff who have reported feeling pressure from EPA political appointees to go easy on industry. The EPA, under the Trump administration, has even instituted a new political review process before Agency staff can move forward with any enforcement actions against a polluter. If that weren't enough, the EPA--under the Trump administration--has continued to delegate more and more of its enforcement authority to the States--which all have varying laws and different approaches to enforcing them. Delegating enforcement of our Nation's environment laws to the States makes them moot. And to me, that's unacceptable. The EPA's argument that its enforcement efforts should not be evaluated simply on the amount of fines it issues or actions it takes, but instead on how many polluters it's able to bring into compliance, is a farce. Compliance without enforcement does not work. And while encouraging polluters to comply with our environmental laws is certainly a valiant effort to undertake, turning a blind eye to some of the worst polluters in the process will not be tolerated. If evidence and experience have shown us one thing it's that the worst polluters are also the most unlikely to voluntarily raise their hands and ask for help. And while we are always glad to hear about the EPA's successes in allowing an industry to self-police itself, I am always skeptical when I hear of a government Agency allowing the foxes to guard the henhouse. It has been widely reported that the Trump administration has appointed dozens of former industry lobbyists to high- ranking jobs within the administration. One of the things that troubles me most is how many of those appointees are at the EPA. Just yesterday, in fact, The Washington Post reported that EPA political leaders may have interfered in several enforcement matters undertaken by the Agency--including some that involved former industry clients, which is a clear violation of ethics rules. In the past 2 years, we have seen an Agency that's constantly trying to move the goal posts of what is allowable under the law. We have seen leadership at the EPA attempt to roll back some of our most critical environmental safeguards--including weakening our protections against mercury, loosening our oversight of the oil and gas industry, and undoing the highly successful vehicle fuel-efficiency standards that have worked so well to help reduce our overall greenhouse gas emissions. Congress has worked too hard, on behalf of the American people, to enact some of the rules and regulations that work to protect our environment and health. And this panel will not sit back and allow this administration to simply ignore those laws. We expect the EPA to do its job. We expect it to enforce every single rule and regulation we have the books. And we expect it to vigorously protect the American people and our environment. Thank you. Ms. DeGette. And at this point, I am now happy to recognize the ranking member for his opening statement. OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. BRETT GUTHRIE, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE COMMONWEALTH OF KENTUCKY Mr. Guthrie. Thank you, Chair DeGette, for holding this important hearing today. Congress has enacted several important laws to protect the environment and human health and the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency, EPA, is responsible for working within its State, Tribal, and Federal partners to help to put these laws into effect. The EPA must develop and enforce environmental regulations for laws such as the Clean Air Act, the Clean Water Act, the Safe Drinking Water Act, to name just a few. I am encouraged by EPA's commitment to ensuring compliance with these important environmental laws and I want to thank the thousands of Federal and State workers who spent countless hours helping to achieve these goals. Every few years there seems to be a major enforcement action resulting in a substantial amount of penalties and fines. For example, the 2013 enforcement numbers included a settlement with BP following the devastating 2010 Gulf of Mexico spill. Similarly, the 2017 enforcement numbers included the record Volkswagen Clean Air Act civil settlement. In this year, fiscal year 2019, the numbers will include the Fiat Chrysler settlement finalized just last month. In fact, the dollar amount for civil judicial administrative penalties in the fiscal year 2019 is on track to be one of the largest ever. These enforcement actions are extremely important to help protect the environment, ensure compliance with Federal laws and regulations and are the type of enforcement action the Federal Government is best suited to pursue, rather than the States. But the large fine amounts in certain years does not mean the Agency and its partners are any less diligent about protecting the environment in any other years where these large settlements do not occur. Therefore, while monitoring enforcement actions is an important tool to promote compliance with environmental laws and regulations, it is important that we don't lose sight of the most important goals, which are protecting the environment and protecting human health. This administration has emphasized the need to focus on compliance and ensure that a broad range of compliance assurance tools are available for use by the Agency. We have a lot of questions today about what EPA is doing to promote compliance and how programs such as the self-disclosure violations policies can help achieve compliance. I am looking forward to hearing more about how the EPA is working with States to promote State primacy and authorized programs. As we all know, the EPA works in collaboration with States and tribal organizations to conduct inspections and enforcement. In 2017, the EPA formed a workgroup with the Environmental Council of the States to develop principles and best practices for State and EPA collaboration on a number of issues such as inspections and enforcement. The working group issued their final report in August 2018. I have heard that these initiatives are working and that States are beginning to feel like they have a seat at the table. The EPA also has worked--also works with other Federal agencies when enforcing some of the environmental laws. That is one reason I am glad we have the Honorable Ron Tenpas on the second panel. Mr. Tenpas previously served as an Assistant Attorney General for the Environment and Natural Resources Division of the U.S. Department of Justice and it will be helpful to hear how the Environment and Natural Resources Division at DOJ works with the EPA to ensure robust enforcement of our Nation's environmental laws. I think we can all agree that the desired outcome of any compliance program is to prevent pollution and protect our environment for ourselves, our children, and our grandchildren. I am looking forward to hearing about EPA--about how the EPA is working to accomplish these goals. Considering the ebb and flows of enforcement fines and penalties within an administration, let alone between administrations, I hope we don't get ahead of ourselves today and imply that 1 year of slightly lower enforcement accomplishments signals that EPA is not doing its job or ensuring compliance with our Nation's environmental laws. And I yield back. [The prepared statement of Mr. Guthrie follows:] Prepared statement of Hon. Brett Guthrie Thank you, Chair DeGette, for holding this important hearing today. Congress has enacted several important laws to protect the environment and human health and the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) is responsible for working with its State, Tribal, and Federal partners to help to put these laws into effect. The EPA must develop and enforce environmental regulations for laws such as the Clean Air Act, the Clean Water Act, and the Safe Drinking Water Act, to name just a few. I am encouraged by the EPA's commitment to assuring compliance with these important environmental laws and I want to thank the thousands of Federal and State workers that have spent countless hours helping to achieve these goals. Every few years, there seems to be a major enforcement action resulting in a substantial amount of penalties and fines. For example, the 2013 enforcement numbers included a settlement with BP following the devastating 2010 Gulf of Mexico oil spill. Similarly, the 2017 enforcement numbers included the record Volkswagen Clean Air Act Civil Settlement. And this year--fiscal year 2019--the numbers will include the Fiat Chrysler settlement finalized just last month. In fact, the dollar amount for civil, judicial, and administrative penalties in fiscal year 2019 is on track to be one of the largest ever. These enforcement actions are extremely important to help protect the environment and ensure compliance with Federal laws and regulations--and are the type of enforcement actions that the Federal Government is best suited to pursue rather than the States--but the large fine amounts in certain years does not mean the Agency and its partners are any less diligent about protecting the environment in other years where these large settlements do not occur. Therefore, while monitoring enforcement actions is an important tool to promote compliance with environmental laws and regulations, it is important that we don't lose sight of the most important goals--which are protecting the environment and protecting human health. This administration has emphasized the need to focus on compliance and ensure that a broad range of compliance assurance tools are available for use by the Agency. We have a lot of questions today about what EPA is doing to promote compliance and how programs such as the self- disclosure violations policies can help achieve compliance. I also am looking forward to hearing more about how the EPA is working with the States to promote State primacy in authorized programs. As we all know, the EPA works in collaboration with States and Tribal organizations to conduct inspections and enforcement. In September 2017, the EPA formed a work group with the Environmental Council of the States to develop principles and best practices for State and EPA collaboration on a number of issues, such as inspections and enforcement. The working group issued their final report in August 2018. I've heard that these initiatives are working, and that States are beginning to feel like they have a seat at the table. The EPA also works with other Federal agencies when enforcing some of the environmental laws, and that's one of the reasons I'm glad we have the Honorable Ron Tenpas on the second panel. Mr. Tenpas previously served as an Assistant Attorney General for the Environment and Natural Resources Division of the U.S. Department of Justice, and it will be helpful to hear how the Environment and Natural Resources Division at DOJ works with EPA to ensure robust enforcement of our Nation's environmental laws. I think we can all agree that the desired outcome of any compliance program is to prevent pollution and protect our environment for ourselves, our children, and our grandchildren. I'm looking forward to hearing more about how the EPA is working to accomplish these goals. Considering the ebbs and flows of enforcement fines and penalties within an administration, let alone between administrations, I hope we don't get ahead of ourselves today and imply that 1 year of slightly lower enforcement accomplishments signals that the EPA is not doing its job of ensuring compliance with our Nation's environmental laws. Ms. DeGette. Thank you. The Chair will now recognize the chairman of the full committee, Mr. Pallone, for 5 minutes for the purposes of an opening statement. OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. FRANK PALLONE, Jr., A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF NEW JERSEY Mr. Pallone. Thank you, Madam Chair. Today the committee begins critical oversight of the Trump EPA's enforcement program, something that the previous Republican majority ignored. Congress can pass all the legislation it wants to protect against air pollution, contaminated drinking water, and hazardous chemical risks but, ultimately, the EPA must implement and enforce those laws. It is, therefore, impossible to assess EPA's effectiveness without looking at whether the Agency is enforcing the Federal environmental statutes that are already on the books and there is no doubt that the Trump EPA's enforcement records is abysmal, the worst in decades. Over the past few weeks, news reports suggest that EPA is simply not maintaining the type of vigorous enforcement that is needed to protect our environment and communities from the worst polluters. For example, a report in the Christian Science Monitor found that the number of inspections conducted by the Agency in 2018 were the lowest since records began in 1994. It also reported that the number of civil cases initiated by the EPA was the lowest since 1982 and the number of judicial referral cases for 2018 was 110. That is less than half the average annual number of 239. There is no way to sugar-coat these numbers. It appears that the Trump EPA is relying on industry to voluntarily come forward and disclose when they are not in compliance. Nobody here can really believe that the worst offenders of environmental laws would voluntarily come forward to disclose their violations. EPA must have a robust enforcement presence. The Agency needs to actively conduct investigations to determine whether violations are occurring. It needs to inspect facilities, start cases, and where appropriate, refer cases to the Department of Justice. And the EPA needs to issue penalties that not only make polluters pay when they break the law, but also force polluters to come into compliance so that they are no longer in violation. And it takes a lot of people to do all of this difficult and resource-intensive work but, unfortunately, the number of staff in the Enforcement Office has continued to drop over the years. This is not surprising, considering President Trump promised to reduce the Agency on the campaign trail to, I quote, ``little tidbits'' and then attempted to fulfill that threat by proposing a nearly 23 percent budget cut last year. Now Congress did not let President Trump's draconian proposal take effect, but industry heard loud and clear that this President was not prioritizing EPA's work. The Trump EPA was taking the cop off the beat. This extreme budget proposal was essentially a message from the Trump administration to EPA employees that they should scale back their work, but without these employees, the EPA simply cannot do its job to make sure our communities are protected from illegal pollution. So I just want to send a message to the dedicated career staff at EPA who are watching today and say a very public thank you. Thank you for continuing to protect human health and the environment through the hard work you do each and every day. It is not an easy task with an administration that simply does not share your mission. So let there be no doubt that this committee will continue to hold the Trump administration accountable. And let me say, Madam Chair, in closing, you know we talk a lot in this place about the Constitution and the separation of powers. Congress enacts the laws and provides the funding. The Executive is supposed to enforce the law. That is the separation of powers. It is--you know, you learned this in civics. And I just wish that the Trump administration would follow the Constitution. Don't try to enact the laws and decide where the money goes. Do your job. Enforce the law. That is what the Executive Branch is supposed to do. Somehow the Trump administration is simply turning that and the Constitution on its head. And it is very unfortunate, but I appreciate the fact, Madam Chair, that we are going to get to the bottom of this enforcement issue and point out the lack of enforcement of this administration. I yield back. [The prepared statement of Mr. Pallone follows:] Prepared statement of Hon. Frank Pallone, Jr. Today, the committee begins critical oversight of the Trump EPA's enforcement program, something that the previous Republican Majority ignored. Congress can pass all of the legislation it wants to protect against air pollution, contaminated drinking water, and hazardous chemical risks, but ultimately, the EPA must implement and enforce those laws. It is, therefore, impossible to assess EPA's effectiveness without looking at whether the Agency is enforcing the Federal environmental statutes that are already on the books. And there is no doubt that the Trump EPA's enforcement record is abysmal--the worst in decades. Over the past few weeks, news reports suggest that EPA is simply not maintaining the type of vigorous enforcement that is needed to protect our environment and communities from the worst polluters. For example, a report in the Christian Science Monitor found that the number of inspections conducted by the Agency in 2018 were the lowest since records began in 1994. It also reported that the number of civil cases initiated by the EPA was the lowest since 1982. And the number of judicial referral cases for 2018 was 110--that's less than half the average annual number of 239. There is no way to sugar coat these numbers. It appears that the Trump EPA is relying on industry to voluntary come forward and disclose when they are not in compliance. Nobody here can really believe that the worst offenders of environmental laws would voluntarily come forward to disclose their violations. EPA must have a robust enforcement presence. The Agency needs to actively conduct investigations to determine whether violations are occurring. It needs to inspect facilities, start cases and, where appropriate, refer cases to the Department of Justice. And the EPA needs to issue penalties that not only make polluters pay when they break the law, but also force polluters to come into compliance so that they are no longer in violation. It takes a lot of people to do all of this difficult and resource-intensive work, but unfortunately the number of staff in the enforcement office has continued to drop over the years. This is not surprising considering President Trump promised to reduce the Agency on the campaign trail to, ``little tidbits,'' and then attempted to fulfill that threat by proposing a nearly 25 percent budget cut last year. Although Congress did not let President Trump's draconian proposal take effect, industry heard loud and clear that this President was not prioritizing EPA's work. The Trump EPA was taking the cop off the beat. This extreme budget proposal was essentially a message from the Trump administration to EPA employees that they should scale back their work. But without these employees, the EPA simply cannot do its job to make sure our communities are protected from illegal pollution. In closing, I'd like to send a message to the dedicated career staff at EPA who are watching today and say a very public thank you. Thank you for continuing to protect human health and the environment through the hard work you do each and every day. It is not an easy task with an administration that simply does not share your mission. Let there be no doubt that, this committee will continue to hold the Trump administration accountable. Thank you, I yield back. Ms. DeGette. The Chair now recognizes the ranking member of the full committee, Mr. Walden, for 5 minutes for purposes of an opening statement. OPENING STATEMENT OF HON. GREG WALDEN, A REPRESENTATIVE IN CONGRESS FROM THE STATE OF OREGON Mr. Walden. Well good morning, Chair DeGette, and thanks for holding this important hearing today. One of the core missions of the EPA is one that I think we all agree with, for Americans to have clean air, clean land, and clean water. The EPA works toward this worthy goal through a variety of means, including partnerships with State and local governments, grants, the States, nonprofits, educational groups, and others developing and enforcing regulations, studying environmental issues, teaching people, particularly students, about the environment, and through enforcement and compliance. The EPA's Office of Enforcement and Compliance Assurance recently released its fiscal year 2018 EPA enforcement and compliance annual results and concerns have been raised regarding a decline in the 2018 numbers. Well no one is disputing that some of the numbers from 2018 are lower than in past years. Compliance is hard to measure. And you can't simply measure compliance by the number of enforcement actions and the total amounts of fines generated by the EPA each year. You have to have a longer term look. Therefore, I would like to put some of these concerns into context. First, there has been a steady decline in the number of Federal inspections and evaluations conducted by the EPA since 2012 and there has been a steady decline in the number of civil enforcement initiations and conclusions for the past decade. A decline in these figures is not unique to this administration. In addition, the EPA's fiscal year 2018 results show the EPA's voluntary disclosure program continues to see an increase in the number of facilities that voluntarily disclose violations. Fiscal year 2018 saw a 47 percent increase in facilities self-disclosing violations over 2017, with 532 entities at over 1500 facilities voluntarily disclose violations pursuant to EPA's self-disclosure policies. The dramatic increase in self-reports is a good thing, demonstrating that business owners are trying to comply with the complex laws and regulations enforced by the EPA. While there is a downward trend with some of these figures over the course of multiple administrations, some figures fluctuate drastically year to year. For example, the combined civil, judicial, and administrative penalties figure has fluctuated between $69 million and $252 million over the past 3 decades, not accounting for big spikes in years that contained big cases such as Volkswagen and BP. While we are only midway through the fiscal year 2019, we already know the number for this year will be high. The EPA has already hit $262 million in combined civil, judicial, and administrative penalties in this fiscal year, Madam Chair. This is due in part to the resolution of the Fiat Chrysler case, which was settled just last month for more than $200 million, including the civil penalties, recall, and mitigation programs. In addition, the average length of time it takes between when a case is initially brought to the EPA and when it is settled can be 2 to 3 years, sometimes more. Solely focusing on a 2-year window to assess overall enforcement and compliance trends simply doesn't make sense. And finally, I think it is critical to today's conversation to note the importance of EPA's partnership and cooperation with the States and regions when it comes to enforcement. Now while EPA plays a critical role in the process, the majority of inspections and investigations, as well as the day to day work, are conducted at the State level. Under the theory of cooperative federalism, the States are the ones monitoring most of the enforcement, with the EPA stepping in if there is a failure at the State level or if there is a big and complex case that requires additional resources or expertise. There appears to be a lot of pressure for the EPA to step in and handle cases that aren't necessarily Federal cases but, as a society, we don't typically do that with other issues. For example, the local or State authorities would handle most drug- related offenses and a Federal entity, such as the FBI, would only step in if the case was a larger complex case or one that crossed State lines. So why should environmental enforcement compliance be in any different? So in that vein, I am encouraged by the work that has been done by the Environmental Council of States and their cooperative federalism initiative to improve the working relationship between State environmental agencies and the EPA, including the Compliance Assurance Workgroup that has established--been established to find ways to improve the Federal-State relationship in the context of compliance assurance. So I think these are important partnerships that should be embraced and improved to ensure that we are working on environmental enforcement and compliance at all levels of government, Madam Chair, to work towards a common goal, a cleaner environment. I want to thank our witnesses for being here today and I look forward to the conversation and hope we can have a holistic way to ensure and measure compliance. With that, Madam Chair, I yield back. [The prepared statement of Mr. Walden follows:] Prepared statement of Hon. Greg Walden Thank you, Chair DeGette, for holding this important hearing today. One of the core missions of the EPA is one that I think we all agree with--for Americans to have clean air, clean land, and clean water. The EPA works toward this worthy goal through a variety of means, including partnerships with State and local governments, grants to States, nonprofits, educational groups, and others, developing and enforcing regulations, studying environmental issues, teaching people-particularly students- about the environment, and through enforcement and compliance. The EPA's Office of Enforcement and Compliance Assurance (OECA) recently released its Fiscal Year 2018 EPA Enforcement and Compliance Annual Results and concerns have been raised regarding a decline in the 2018 numbers. While no one is disputing that some of the numbers from FY 2018 are lower than in years past, compliance is hard to measure, and you can't simply measure compliance by the number of enforcement actions and the total amount of fines generated by the EPA each year. Therefore, I'd like to put some of these concerns into context. First, there has been a steady decline in the number of Federal inspections and evaluations conducted by the EPA since 2012 and there has been a steady decline in the number of civil enforcement initiations and conclusions for the past decade-- the decline in these figures is not unique to this administration. In addition, the EPA's FY 2018 results show that EPA's Voluntary Disclosure Program continues to see an increase in the number of facilities that voluntarily disclosed violations. FY 2018 saw a 47 percent increase in facilities self-disclosing violations over 2017, with 532 entities at over 1,500 facilities voluntarily disclosed violations pursuant to EPA's self-disclosure policies. The dramatic increase in these self- reports is a good thing, demonstrating that business owners are trying to comply with the complex laws and regulations enforced by the EPA. While there is a downward trend with some of these figures over the course of multiple administrations, some figures fluctuate drastically year to year. For example, the combined civil judicial and administrative penalties figure has fluctuated between$69 million and $252 million over the past three decades, not accounting for big spikes in years that contained big cases such as Volkswagen, and BP. While we are only midway through fiscal year 2019, we already know that the numbers for this year will be high-EPA has already hit $262 million in combined civil judicial and administrative penalties this fiscal year. This is due in part to the resolution of the Fiat Chrysler case, which was settled just last month for more than $200 million, including the civil penalties, recall, and mitigation programs. In addition, the average length of time it takes between when a case is initially brought to EPA and when it is settled can be 2 to 3 years, sometimes more. Solely focusing on a 2- year window to assess overall enforcement and compliance trends simply doesn't make sense. Finally, I think it's critical to today's conversation to note the importance of EPA's partnership and cooperation with the States and regions when it comes to enforcement. While EPA plays a critical role in the process, the majority of inspections and investigations, as well as the day-to-day work, are conducted at the State level. Under the theory of cooperative federalism, the States are the ones monitoring most of the enforcement, with the EPA stepping in if there is a failure at the State level or if there is a big and complex case that requires additional resources or expertise. There appears to be a lot of pressure for the EPA to step in and handle cases that aren't necessarily Federal cases, but as a society we don't typically do that with other issues. For example, the local or State authorities would handle most drug related offenses, and a Federal entity, such as the FBI, would only step in if the case was a larger complex case or one that crossed State lines--so why should environmental enforcement and compliance be any different? In that vein, I'm encouraged by work that has been done by the Environmental Council of the States (ECOS) and their Cooperative Federalism initiative to improve the working relationship between State environmental agencies and the EPA, including a Compliance Assurance Workgroup that was established to find ways to improve the State-Federal relationship in the context of compliance assurance. I think these are important partnerships that should be embraced and improved to ensure that we are working on environmental enforcement and compliance at all levels of government to work towards a common goal--a cleaner environment. I want to thank the witnesses for being here today. I look forward to today's conversation and hope that we can look at holistic ways to ensure and measure compliance, and I yield back. Ms. DeGette. Thank you so much, Mr. Walden. I ask unanimous consent that the Members' written opening statements be made part of the record. Without objection, they will be entered into the record. I ask unanimous consent that Energy and Commerce members not on the Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations be permitted to participate in today's hearing. Without objection, so ordered. I would now like to introduce our first panel witness for today's hearing. Our witness is Ms. Susan Bodine, who is the Assistant Administrator of the Office of Enforcement and Compliance Assurance of the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency. Welcome, Ms. Bodine, and thank you for appearing in front of our committee. You are aware, I know, that the committee is holding an investigative hearing and when doing so has had the practice of taking testimony under oath. Do you have any objections to testifying under oath? Ms. Bodine. I have no objection to that, and I am also aware that whether or not you are under oath, it is a crime to lie to Congress under Title 18. Ms. DeGette. Thank you. Thank you very much. And let the record reflect the witness has responded no. The Chair also advises you that, under the rules of the House and the rules of the committee, you are entitled to be accompanied by counsel. Do you desire to be accompanied by counsel during your testimony today? Ms. Bodine. No. Ms. DeGette. OK, let the record reflect that the witness has responded no. If you would, then, please rise and raise your right hand so you may be sworn in. [Witness sworn.] Ms. DeGette. And as you stated, Ms. Bodine, you are subject to the penalty set forth in Title 18, Section 1001 of the U.S. Code. And with that now, the Chair will recognize Ms. Bodine for a 5-minute summary of their written statement. And in front of you--you can see it--there is a microphone and a series of lights. The light turns yellow when you have a minute left, and it turns red to indicate your time has come to an end. And with that, you are recognized. Thank you. STATEMENT OF SUSAN PARKER BODINE, ASSISTANT ADMINISTRATOR, OFFICE OF ENFORCEMENT AND COMPLIANCE ASSURANCE, ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY Ms. Bodine. Thank you, Madam Chair, Ranking Member Guthrie, and members of the subcommittee. I am Susan Bodine. I am the Assistant Administrator for EPA's Office of Enforcement and Compliance Assurance. Now, you have my written testimony that gives an overview of our enforcement approach, our ongoing work to increase the efficiency and effectiveness of our enforcement and compliance assurance work, and the examples of the good work that EPA's enforcement staff that I am very proud to share with you. So I want to use my time as an opportunity to begin a dialogue about EPA's enforcement program. Now, some are judging our work based on a narrow set of parameters and then drawing the conclusion that EPA is somehow soft on environmental violators, that EPA doesn't care about compliance with the law and I am here to tell you that that is absolutely not true. This narrative, which appeared in the press, since the beginning of this administration, discredits the tremendous work of EPA's Enforcement and Compliance Assurance staff. It makes their job more difficult. If a company doubts our resolve, it will take longer to reach a settlement and it could mean that we have to spend the time and the resources to litigate our claims. I was confirmed as the Assistant Administrator in December of 2017. Beginning in March and throughout the spring of 2018, my headquarters staff and I held video teleconferences with the enforcement staff of each of the regions, and I followed those up with regional visits to each of the ten regions over the summer, and then we did another round of VTCs in the fall. Now these interactions are critical because about 1800 of the OECA FTE, the staff, are in the regions and that is where most of the enforcement and compliance assurance work takes place. My message to the staff has been consistent on the VTCs, at all-hands meetings in the regions, and in email messages. And I want to read to you an excerpt from a message that I sent to all of the EPA enforcement staff in June of 2018. We are committed to the protection of human health in the environment by vigorously enforcing the law. There should be no slowdown in our efforts to correct noncompliance. You have my support and my thanks for those efforts. Our goal is to ensure compliance using all of our enforcement and compliance tools, including formal administrative and judicial enforcement, as well as more informal tools, where appropriate. We will not hesitate to deter serious noncompliance using tools up to and include criminal enforcement. We are working to more timely get a return to compliance and cooperative federalism means that we cooperate with States and we discuss how our combined resources can best address noncompliance. It does not mean that EPA stays out of authorized States. Again, I sent that message to all the staff in June. You can see that I'm pushing back on this myth--these myths about our enforcement program. A strong enforcement program does not mean that we have to collect a particular dollar amount of penalties or take a particular number of formal actions. When I had my confirmation hearing, Senator Inhofe asked me if I was going to impose a quota on enforcement actions and I assured him that I believe that enforcement is a critical tool but it's not an end to itself. I don't support enforcement quotas. I do support making sure that the OECA, the enforcement staff, are getting credit for their work whether or not they take a formal enforcement action, as long we're achieving compliance with the law. Also at my confirmation hearing, Senator Whitehouse asked me if I would continue to report the categories of annual enforcement results that had been reported by the prior administration and I assured him that I would. However, I want everyone to understand that these measures do not adequately represent the progress and the results that we are achieving in EPA's Enforcement and Compliance Assurance Program. For example, one of the cases that is cited in my written testimony, Harcros, in that case we addressed compliance with chemical safety regulations at 28 facilities in 18 States. That case counts in our end-of-year results as one case. The staff are spending a lot of time building State capacity as well, for example, with joint inspections. And if we take a joint inspection in an offer as partnering with the State, it may be that we find violations and the State takes the formal enforcement action and not EPA. We call those State assists but we're getting compliance. We're also developing new measure to capture those efforts because I want the staff to get credit for all the work they are doing. And I'm sorry, Madam Chair, but the staff--I have to say this. The staff is not sitting on its hands. They are working very hard. And so I'm sorry, I'm going to go a tiny bit over. My approach isn't identical to my predecessor's. I believe we should focus our enforcement efforts on solving environmental problems but not targeting specific industries, but I want to assure you that our enforcement and compliance assurance program continues to play a critical role in protecting human health and the environment. And I'm happy to answer your questions. [The prepared statement of Ms. Bodine follows:] [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Ms. DeGette. Thank you. It is now time for Members to ask questions. And the Chair recognizes herself for 5 minutes. Ms. Bodine, thank you for your testimony. And I appreciate that you sent a memo to your staff saying that we are going to robustly enforce the laws, but I want to ask you about some of these statistics, and most of them are about statistics. And I know the EPA staff are working hard. Ms. Bodine. Thank you. Ms. DeGette. But I also know that their numbers have been depleted, and I think we have got some questions about that today. But and I also know that you are upset about some of this press but the press that I am looking at is talking about some of the numbers of the EPA and that is what I want to talk to you about this morning. Now injunctive relief represents the estimated cost of actions taken by a defendant to come into compliance with the law so they are no longer in violation. Is that generally correct? Ms. Bodine. Yes, that is correct. Ms. DeGette. Now the EPA recently announced that in fiscal year 2018, adjusted for inflation, the estimated dollar value of the injunctive relief was $3.95 billion. Is that correct? Ms. Bodine. Yes, I believe that is correct. Ms. DeGette. OK. Now, I looked at a report that was done by the Christian Science Monitor, I mentioned this in my opening statement, which says that the average annual cost of injunctive relief is $7.74 billion and the EPA's fiscal year 2018 figure was the lowest it had been in 15 years. Are you aware of this report, Ms. Bodine? Ms. Bodine. I read the Christian Science Monitor---- Ms. DeGette. OK, so you are aware of it. Ms. Bodine. I read the article. Ms. DeGette. OK. Ms. Bodine. But the--may I? Ms. DeGette. Well, OK, so you know the report. Ms. Bodine. Yes. Ms. DeGette. Now, I also understand the inspections, which are key to EPA's enforcement efforts, are the lowest they have been in a decade. Is that correct? Ms. Bodine. I believe so, yes. Ms. DeGette. Yes, OK, the inspections are the lowest. So moving on, another measurement of enforcement activity is civil penalties, which are monetary assessments paid by a regulated entity because of a violation. Is that generally a good description of the monetary penalties? Ms. Bodine. I wouldn't say that it was a good measure of enforcement results and I believe they go up and down. Ms. DeGette. OK but here is what I asked you: Monetary assessments are paid by a regulated entity because of a violation. Ms. Bodine. Yes, that is correct. Ms. DeGette. OK. Now, EPA's Enforcement and Compliance annual results for fiscal year 2018 indicate that the EPA obtained $69.47 million in administrative and civil judicial penalties. Is that correct? Ms. Bodine. I believe that is right. Ms. DeGette. And according to a February 8th Washington Post report, the $69 million in civil penalties represents the lowest in nearly a quarter-century. Is that factually accurate? Ms. Bodine. I believe that it is. Ms. DeGette. OK. Now in your testimony, you say the State of California and the EPA secured a civil--and I think Mr. Walden mentioned this, too, secured a civil penalty of $305 million for Clean Air Act violations against Fiat Chrysler. Is that right? Ms. Bodine. Yes. Ms. DeGette. Now that case was initiated during the Obama administration. Is that correct? Ms. Bodine. There was a notice of violation, I believe it was, in January of 2017. Ms. DeGette. But it was initiated under the Obama administration. Ms. Bodine. So a notice of violation is not formal enforcement action. Ms. DeGette. OK. Now, so I didn't ask you about a formal enforcement action. Ms. Bodine. Well---- Ms. DeGette. The investigation was initiated during the Obama administration. Ms. Bodine. The investigation was, yes. Ms. DeGette. Thank you. Now, while I appreciate the EPA has brought the important case to a resolution, I continue to be worried that the 2019 numbers will reflect--I wonder if they will reflect civil penalties against a large variety of polluters, in other words, that we won't just have one penalty in this year. So let me ask you the Christian Science Monitor reports that for fiscal year 2018 the number of civil cases initiated by the Agency was the lowest since 1982. Is that correct? Ms. Bodine. I have no reason to believe it isn't. So I am not going---- Ms. DeGette. OK. And also, the number of cases referred to the Department of Justice were the lowest since 1976. Is that correct? Ms. Bodine. I don't have that number. Ms. DeGette. OK. Now do you have any reason to doubt that number or do you just not know it? Ms. Bodine. I would have to--I could respond for the record. I would---- Ms. DeGette. That would be great. Ms. Bodine. Yes. Ms. DeGette. So it is just that you don't know the number. Ms. Bodine. Right. Ms. DeGette. OK. Now last year, the Trump administration proposed cutting the EPA's budget by almost 25 percent. Congress didn't go along with that but I wondered about-- wondering about what message this sends to the employees. Is it true that your office has lost nearly 17 percent of its workforce? Ms. Bodine. No, that is not true. Ms. DeGette. It is not? What is the status of the workforce at this point? Ms. Bodine. So I am talking about the headquarters staff, the OECA staff, our ceiling is in 2018 and hopefully in 2019 as well is 649. We currently have 607 people onboard. I think about nine or more are coming onboard in March. Ms. DeGette. OK. Ms. Bodine. I have authorized hiring to bring it up to the ceiling. Ms. DeGette. OK. I am sure some others will follow-up. And my time has expired but I really want to thank you for answering my questions. Ms. Bodine. Sure. Ms. DeGette. The Chair now recognizes the ranking member. Mr. Guthrie. Thank you, Madam Chair, for the recognition. Thank you for being here, Ms. Bodine. Each year, OECA reports 12 different metrics to provide a high level of overview of the Agency's enforcement and compliance results for that year, including estimated environmental benefits, criminal and civil enforcement accomplishments, and Superfund accomplishments. In your opinion, can we look at just one of these metrics to determine the strength of EPA's enforcement and compliance program for any given year? Ms. Bodine. No. These results, which I certainly assured Senator Whitehouse I would continue to report, do not accurately reflect the great work that the staff is doing. Mr. Guthrie. So what are some of the limitations of the metrics that EPA reports on each year to demonstrate EPA's enforcement and compliance annual results? What are the shortcomings of the---- Ms. Bodine. So what we report in our formal database are only formal actions and so it doesn't reflect the work that we have done cooperating with States. For example, when we go out and we do joint inspections, and we do that often because we are trying to help build State capacity, it doesn't reflect some of the work that we have done even in sophisticated States and cities. For example, in Pittsburgh, we did the assessment of the drinking water program. We are collaborating right now with the State of New Jersey looking at I think it is Newark and their pipes, their lead pipes. We do a lot of work that is not captured in these formal annual results. Mr. Guthrie. OK. So turning to combined civil, judicial, and administrative penalties figure, last year's number came in at $69 million, according to the fiscal year 2018 results. What is the current number for fiscal year 2019, understanding that we are only midway through the year? Ms. Bodine. I know you quoted it, or maybe Ranking Member Walden quoted it. I don't have the exact number. I do know that our Fiat Chrysler case, which we lodged, it has not even entered. We had, you know, with California over $305 million. We have been collecting other penalties but, yes, that number is going to be much higher in 2019. And may I also say that if you look at it, again, as trends, out of the past 11 years, 8 of the past 11 years the annual penalties were less than $250 million in 8 of the 11 years. So you can't look at averages when you are looking at-- and suggest that that represents a trend. We did have 3 years of penalties over a billion and so, again, that makes the averages completely invalid from a statistical standpoint. Mr. Guthrie. OK. So if you look at the over $300 million that you quoted, that is including California's enforcement is what you were saying there? Ms. Bodine. Yes. Mr. Guthrie. So we already know that this year will be at least the fourth highest year for combined civil, judicial, and administrative penalties dating back to 1989. So in addition to formal enforcement actions, EPA engages in, you mentioned, other activities to promote compliance, such as State assists. Ms. Bodine. Right. Mr. Guthrie. Can you describe some of the activities that EPA does to promote compliance with the environmental laws regulations that are not accounted for in these annual metrics? Ms. Bodine. Sure. So one of the things that we are trying to do is encourage companies to get back into compliance quickly. So we revised our inspector guidance so that the inspectors would actually point out to the facilities what the problems were so they could fix them right away. We are also trying to--we have also told the staff that they need to get the inspection reports back to the facilities so they can fix their noncompliance and try and do that within 70 days. We are continuing to have our compliance assurance centers up and running. And we also have electronic tools that can help. For example, we have in the Clean Water Act area for the permit holders, they have to report electronically. And we can set up our electronic system, and we have, to automatically give them a notice if they have failed to submit a report and we are also developing a new tool where they can automatically get a notice if their discharge is above the permitted level. So we are building all these tools in to try and get compliance back more effectively, more efficiently, and more quickly. Mr. Guthrie. OK, thank you. The fiscal year 2018 enforcement and compliance results recently released by EPA show that the number of environmental crime cases opened and the number of civil enforcement cases initiations have been gradually declining over the past 10 years. Can you explain why there has been a gradual decline in the number of civil and criminal cases opened each year? Ms. Bodine. So I don't have a good explanation for that. I do know that we opened--that there had been a decline in the new cases that we opened on the criminal side over 11 years and that we are now increasing. They are now increasing that again, which is wonderful. Mr. Guthrie. Is it just better compliance by people in the industries? Ms. Bodine. It is very hard to measure compliance. And so we don't have a good measure of compliance. But it is true that we are doing a much better job in targeting noncompliance so that goes to the inspection issue. So we don't need to take a lot of inspections to find--we can figure out where to expect noncompliance and target accordingly. Mr. Guthrie. OK, thank you. My time has expired. I appreciate your answers. I yield back. Ms. DeGette. The Chair now recognizes the full committee chairman, Mr. Pallone, for 5 minutes. Mr. Pallone. Thank you, Madam Chair, and I wanted to follow-up on kind of where you left off. Ms. Bodine, on the campaign trail, President Trump said he wanted to dramatically cut the EPA and leave only, I quote, ``little tidbits'' left. Last year, the Trump administration's budget proposal seemed to try to make good on that threat by proposing a nearly 25 percent cut to the Agency. Now of course, Congress didn't go along with that, but that is what he threatened or that is what he suggested. And then in September, we had a Washington Post story that noted that, during the first 18 months of the Trump administration, nearly 1,600 workers left the EPA, while only 400 were hired. And of course just a few weeks ago, your staff informed our committee that your office has lost in excess of 130 enforcement staff since January of 2017. Now, I know you have said that you authorized to bring it back but how are you going to go about that? I mean do you intend to replace the roughly 130 staff? And you know what is your timetable? How are you going to do that? I guess I am kind of wondering if it is really going to happen. So tell us how it is going to happen and when. Ms. Bodine. So I can only hire up to the FTE ceiling that Congress has provided. And that, again, I believe we have the 2018 bill where we had a ceiling of the 649 I believe---- Mr. Pallone. Well, let me just interrupt you because of lack of time. I know you have said you intend to do this. What I would like to know is what the timetable is to actually accomplish the goal of reaching this authorized amount. Ms. Bodine. So our personnel processes are working as quickly as possible. When I say I authorized, that means the human resources process is underway. That is what that means. Mr. Pallone. And how long is it going to take? What is your timetable? Ms. Bodine. Can I get back to you on that? Because we are trying. As an Agency, we are trying to speed up that timetable, and so let me--may I get back to you on that for the record about what our---- Mr. Pallone. Yes, but give me like a timetable when this is going to happen. Ms. Bodine. Well, the one I am most familiar with is actually bringing on the criminal investigators, which takes a very long time because of background checks. Mr. Pallone. With the Chair's permission, you can provide this in writing. Ms. Bodine. OK. Mr. Pallone. We would like some details. Ms. Bodine. OK. Mr. Pallone. Now I also wanted to talk about the EPA's regional enforcement workforce because, of course, you have ten regional offices across the country and you know a substantial amount of the enforcement work occurs at that regional level. How many regional enforcement staff have left the Agency since January of 2017 and how many have been hired? Ms. Bodine. I don't have that number. I would have to provide it for the record. Mr. Pallone. All right. Ms. Bodine. I do know the regions are hiring in the enforcement space as well. Mr. Pallone. Well this is just as important, right? Ms. Bodine. Right. Mr. Pallone. If you could get back to us---- Ms. Bodine. Yes. Mr. Pallone [continuing]. I guess with the permission of the Chair and tell us how many you have lost, how many you have hired, and if you intend to make up that difference by replacing them, you know, what the timetable is for that as well. Ms. Bodine. Within the congressionally authorized FTE ceiling. Mr. Pallone. OK. Now, the other thing I wanted to ask you is I made a statement during my opening. I said that it appears that the Trump EPA is relying on industry to voluntarily come forward and disclose when they are not in compliance. What is your response to that? Would you agree that you do have an effort to have them voluntarily come forward and how do you go about that? Ms. Bodine. So EPA's had a self-audit policy in place since 2000. In 2008, we expanded that with a new owner audit policy and we are now develop--we have developed another oil and gas new owner policy that is more tailored to that industry. It was based on a 2016 matter that was done in the previous administration with a new owner of oil and gas business. Mr. Pallone. Why should I believe that the worst offenders would voluntarily come forward? How is that? I mean you know human nature is such that bad actors don't voluntarily say they are bad. So how is that going to work? How does that work? Ms. Bodine. So I would not suggest that the audit policy is appropriate for the worst offenders. And I would also completely agree that you can't rely on self-disclosure alone, that you need an enforcement program to create the incentive. Mr. Pallone. But how is this of any value? I mean you are sort of saying it has been in place for years. Does it work? Do people voluntarily come forward? Ms. Bodine. Yes, the entities voluntarily come forward, self-disclose, and then certify that they have returned to compliance. Mr. Pallone. What is their incentive to do that? Ms. Bodine. Well, may I give you an example? Mr. Pallone. Sure. Ms. Bodine. So we absolutely do need to still keep inspecting and keep enforcement to create the very incentive. And if you voluntarily disclose and you don't come in to compliance or you don't have full compliance, then there is no shield to enforcement. We had a situation where a company they self-disclosed under a State audit program. They didn't catch all their violations. And we came in after and did an administrative enforcement action for the violations they did not self- disclose. There was no shield from that State self-disclosure. I mean they didn't know they were out of compliance but it didn't matter. We came back for the ones they did not self- disclose. But we came in, followed on, and did take an enforcement action for the actions that they didn't disclose. Mr. Pallone. I don't see how that is helpful but whatever. Thank you, Madam Chair. Ms. DeGette. The Chair recognizes the ranking member of the full committee, Mr. Walden. Mr. Walden. Thank you very much, Madam Chair. And to our witness, thank you for being here today and the work you and your team do around the country day in and day out to protect American consumers. Just for the record, I know in my testimony I said in fiscal year 2018 we saw a 47 percent increase in facility self- disclosing violations over 2017---- Ms. Bodine. Yes. Mr. Walden [continuing]. 532 entities at 1,500 facilities. So to follow-up on what Mr. Pallone said, from your perspective, why do companies come forward? Ms. Bodine. They come forward because if they self-disclose before we find it, so we haven't done the inspection, we haven't taken an action---- Mr. Walden. Right. Ms. Bodine [continuing]. Then they will get relief on penalties. Mr. Walden. OK. Ms. Bodine. So we won't---- Mr. Walden. So it is a carrot-and-stick approach. Ms. Bodine. Absolutely. Mr. Walden. And then if you do come in and find things they haven't disclosed, you have still got the stick---- Ms. Bodine. Absolutely. Mr. Walden [continuing]. And you are using it. Ms. Bodine. Yes. Mr. Walden. Is that accurate? Ms. Bodine. That is accurate. Mr. Walden. OK, well that makes sense. And I know it seems to me, I may be off, but I think in the workforce or workplace safety, too, like OSHA rules, in Oregon we had something similar to that, where you could kind of disclose. Bring them in, they would do a review, and then you could comply and kind of not be in penalty because most employers want to do the right thing. Ms. Bodine. Yes, I will have to take your word for that. Mr. Walden. Yes. No, I understand. And there are some that don't and those are the ones we want you to go after. I think we can all agree the ultimate goal is to safeguard human health and protect the environment and compliance of EPA's environmental laws is necessary to achieve that. So what is OECA doing under your leadership to meet these goals and what changes, if any, have you made to EPA's enforcement or compliance priorities in order to do this? Ms. Bodine. Thank you for that question. So we are looking at our priorities because, as everyone I think here recognizes, the vast majority of the enforcement and inspections happen in the States. And we have very highly skilled staff and we have very good technical resources. So we want to be able to target our resources where we will have the most impact. So we have looked at what we call the National Compliance Initiatives and looked at where should we be focusing our resources. And right now, that is out for public comment. We had a Federal Register notice asking for the public to comment on where our priorities should be. And what that notice says is that we want to make sure that we are focusing on problems, the environmental problems. So whether it is trying to decrease the number of water segments that don't meet water quality standards, whether it is trying to decrease the number of nonattainment areas in Clean Air Act, as well as trying to focus on vulnerable populations around the country. And so we have initiatives already. For example, for air toxics, we have initiatives like glaring that gets at issues like the EFCs. We are talking. We are asking the public and States whether we should expand our initiatives to include a lead--children's exposure to lead initiative and we are asking about starting a drinking water initiative so we can work with States. And again, what we want to do is focus on these environmental problems. Mr. Walden. All right. And then I have certainly seen a change in the last couple of years when it came to the Superfund site cleanup, especially in the Portland Harbor Superfund case. Ms. Bodine. Yes. Mr. Walden. It has been dragging on for years, and years, and years. And this administration stepped in and said, ``Why don't we get about moving forward and actually cleaning it up''? And this is in Portland, not a known Trump red territory. And they were ecstatic that this administration, this EPA was ready to help clear out the regulatory hurdles, or whatever was there that was unnecessary, and move forward. Can you talk a little bit about how you help encourage contaminated site redevelopment and some of these issues? Ms. Bodine. Yes. On Portland, yes, I think everybody is in agreement that that needs to move forward. We need to get that cleanup moving. Mr. Walden. Right. Ms. Bodine. And on redevelopment, yes, we recognize that contaminated properties blight a community and that there are opportunities to bring back the community with redevelopment. And so we are using our enforcement tools to help that and that includes entering into agreements with what we call bona fide prospective purchasers, people who aren't liable. So we can give them comfort, we can give them protection, if they are going to come in and do a redevelopment. And we have had some great examples of that around the country. There was one out in Region 5 where McLouth Steel, they are coming in, it has been a blight on the community for years. And they are going to come in and tear down buildings that have been decrepit, again, to get rid of an eyesore and allow for redevelopment. So the shift is that we are willing to enter into these agreements. Mr. Walden. All right. I know this committee did great work in the last Congress approving a modernization of the Brownfields Law, bipartisan, I think it was unanimous out of Energy and Commerce and signed by President Trump. And so we want to be your partner in helping clean up these sites at all levels. Ms. Bodine. Yes, the BUILD Act. Thank you very much for that. Mr. Walden. Thank you and I yield back. Ms. DeGette. Thank you. The Chair now recognizes the gentleman from California, Mr. Ruiz, for 5 minutes. Mr. Ruiz. Thank you. Welcome, Ms. Bodine. I would like to better understand what EPA is doing to make sure changes in the enforcement program do not disproportionately harm low-income communities and communities of color. History shows us time and time again that Federal action and leadership are necessary to prevent environmental injustice. Ms. Bodine, would you agree that EPA needs to ensure equitable treatment and impact for communities of color and low-income communities when the Agency enforces Federal environmental laws and policies? Ms. Bodine. Yes, absolutely. Mr. Ruiz. Last year, EPA's own scientists released a report in the American Journal of Public Health, April 2018, confirming what many underserved, rural, and minority communities already knew, that low-income and people of color are disproportionately affected by air pollution. These findings joined an extensive body of research, which have found that both polluters and pollution are disproportionately located in low-income and minority communities. Would you agree that these findings make it all the more important to the health and safety of these communities that EPA effectively enforce against those polluters who break the law and illegally pollute? Ms. Bodine. So I absolutely agree with the statement. I haven't read the article but I agree with the statement you just made. Mr. Ruiz. Thank you. Ms. Bodine, on our second panel, we will hear from both Dr. Nelson and Mr. Schaeffer, who both raise important issues about the critical need for robust EPA enforcement in protecting minority and poor-resource communities who are often disproportionately close to polluting facilities. For those communities that live in close proximity to industrial sites that pose health risks, can you assure them that you will use all of EPA's enforcement tools to protect them? Ms. Bodine. We have made it a priority to address air toxics, which--and in talking about our National Compliance Initiatives, focusing on vulnerable populations. We also have as one of our priorities compliance with chemical safety regulations. And again, often you can have chemicals being used in--near---- Mr. Ruiz. What do you define as vulnerable populations? Ms. Bodine. So there are both low-income and minority communities I believe with research---- Mr. Ruiz. Because of the environmental injustices. Ms. Bodine [continuing]. And cumulative effects and location. Mr. Ruiz. OK. And due to resource, legal, or political constraints, some States may lack the will or ability to provide strong environmental protection. So can you please explain to me what extra enforcement measures EPA takes to ensure such communities are adequately protected if a State is not up to the task? Ms. Bodine. So in the guidance that we have set out to the regions interacting with States, we have been very clear that if it is an authorized program, we are going to look to the States to take action but if the State doesn't have the capability or the will to take action and we know there is a violation, then we absolutely should be stepping in to make sure we are getting compliance. Mr. Ruiz. Oftentimes, communities that are resource-poor that lack social capital do not have the capacity, the knowhow, or wherewithal to file complaints and to seek the EPA's assistance in mitigating or preventing some potential environmental injustice. What does the EPA do to provide those technical assistance to those low-income, rural, or minority communities? Ms. Bodine. So my program doesn't have technical assistance grants. The Superfund program does but we don't have those kind of community grants but---- Mr. Ruiz. So currently, there is no--so Superfunds do. Ms. Bodine. Right. Mr. Ruiz. If they want to apply for a Superfund---- Ms. Bodine. And there are environmental justice grants that are run by the Environmental Justice Program. But so we don't have enforcement grants to communities of the type that you are describing. Mr. Ruiz. So---- Ms. Bodine. But we do have our initiatives---- Mr. Ruiz. So oftentimes it is the communities that inform you of those violations. Ms. Bodine. Yes and we definitely pay very close attention. We have a tips and complaint line and we follow-up. Mr. Ruiz. So there should be probably some outreach to them and capacity training. It is a tragedy and true injustice that in America today the quality of your air and water and the potential exposure to hazardous and toxic substances is determined to a significant extent by your income, your ZIP code, and your race. So EPA can and should be doing more to protect disenfranchised communities. Would you agree? Ms. Bodine. I would agree. And I would agree that that is why we should be focusing on environmental problems when we say what should be our priorities, where should we direct the Federal resources. Mr. Ruiz. Thank you. Ms. DeGette. The Chair now recognizes the gentleman from West Virginia, Mr. McKinley. Mr. McKinley. Thank you, Madam Chairman. Interesting tone to this discussion so far and it just--I hope for the audience and those listening in that this is obviously this is some of the first steps of the election campaign of 2020. I was interested in the metrics that were being used as a measure of success of what your Agency has done, and it seems to be if someone wants to say that you are successful if you have more inspections and more fines. That seems to be the only measure that in this room is being used to find out whether you are successful, regardless of the outcome of what is happening. And I was looking for some analogies, thinking some analogies as I sat here listening to this line of rationale. And I think, even though it is not yours under the EPA but under maybe OSHA, is the number of coal mines that have been shut down all across America. As a result of the fact that there aren't coal mines, there aren't inspections. If we were to use that metric, it would mean that maybe OSHA is not doing its job because they are not doing as many inspections as they have done in previous years, or there aren't fines. Well, there aren't coal mines. And the same thing is appropriate for our coal-fired generating plants. We have had some 300 coal-fired generating plants shut down over the last 10 years. Therefore, you are going to have fewer inspections. You are going to have fewer fines as a result of that. But that is what people seem to be, on the other side of the aisle are saying that is the way we should be measuring this is is how many fines and inspections. But at the same time, we talk about voluntary compliance. And look what has happened. We didn't sign the Kyoto treaty. We didn't do the Paris Accord. We have withdrawn from that. But yet, their emissions have dropped. We looked at the SOx and NOx gases that you all were very much active in pursuing through the EPA. The SOx gases have dropped, since 1990, 92 percent; NOx gases, 84 percent down. Just in the last 10 years, the CO2 emissions have dropped by 20-some percent. That is not--maybe it doesn't have as many fines and inspections but the result is we are accomplishing a cleaner environment doing it this way. So having said all that and looking at compliance, voluntary compliance and self-auditing, you mention in your report, your written report, that you had talked about MarkWest providing--they are using some innovative technology---- Ms. Bodine. Right. Mr. McKinley [continuing]. To reduce their methane emissions and other volatile organic compounds. And they are sharing that information with other people, other institutions because we know methane is far worse than CO2 in what it does to the atmosphere. So can you elaborate a little bit about how we might improve on that or the role that technology might play in this? Ms. Bodine. Yes, some of what you are getting to, Congressman, is kind of the force amplifier of some of our settlements. And MarkWest is a great example because they have gas pipelines. You have a pigging operation. They didn't know that they had releases but they did and they developed new technology. And as part of their settlement, they have made it available to everyone in the industry with no license, cost whatsoever. So not only do we get the reductions from that company but also from other companies. Another example, Amazon, they were selling unregistered pesticides on their Web site in violation of FIFRA. And as part of that settlement, they agreed to do training. They agreed to do a lot of monitoring certification. And so not only is Amazon in compliance but it is a supply chain issue. Everyone in their supply chain would be in compliance. So again, you can't capture that but it is a force multiplier of some of the work we do. Mr. McKinley. So let me just close in the 30-some seconds I have left. Do you think it is more effective to look at the outcome, the results that we have had CO2 drop, SOx and NOx gases drop, or do you think the measure should be what they are talking about is the number of fines and the number of inspections? Which is the more effective metric? Ms. Bodine. Certainly the outcome. Mr. McKinley. Thank you. I yield back. Ms. DeGette. The Chair now recognizes the gentlelady from New Hampshire, Ms. Castor--Ms. Kuster for 5 minutes. We have Castor and Kuster. Ms. Kuster, 5 minutes. Ms. Kuster. Thank you very much and thank you for being with us. I just want to take exception to my colleague, Mr. McKinley, suggesting that this is politically motivated. The health and wellbeing of my constituents is not politically motivated and I think we can find common ground. But in New Hampshire, we have been dealing with the Saint- Gobain site in Litchfield that is in my district, which was pollution by a PFAS, the per-and polyfluorinated compounds. And fortunately, we have had a settlement but we had to spend millions of dollars to connect $2.4 million, as well $900,000 in loans, and $600,000 in grants to connect these households to safe drinking water because their wells were contaminated. It is not political. The wells didn't distinguish between the Rs and Ds. These are my constituents and I am trying to keep them safe. And my question for you, I have been disappointed by the EPA's PFAS Action Plan that was published last week because it doesn't seem to actually include much action. For instance, while EPA officials said that they intend to move forward to maximum containment levels for two PFAS chemicals, there was no commitment in the plan to initiating this regulatory process. And that means other communities are going to be left to rely on health advisories that may or may not keep my colleagues' constituents safe. What can your office do to help communities that are being poisoned by PFAS in the air, water, and soil? And I know you are putting a great deal of reliance on voluntary disclosure but what makes you think that companies are going to voluntarily take on this responsibility, when in fact that was not the case for us? They had to be caught in the act through testing and through local community efforts before the company came to the table to negotiate a settlement. Ms. Bodine. Thank you. First on the PFAS action plan that the Administrator announced, maybe it was a little over a week ago, he very clearly makes a commitment to initiate the regulatory process and establish---- Ms. Kuster. And what is the time line for that? Ms. Bodine. That I don't know but I would have to take that back because that is not my program. Ms. Kuster. Because there is urgency to this. This PFAS is showing up in water, groundwater all across this country. Ms. Bodine. And can you tell me the name again of the site that you are talking about? Because I am familiar with the Air Force base but I am not---- Ms. Kuster. It is Litchfield, New Hampshire, Saint- Gobain's. Ms. Bodine. Oh, OK. Ms. Kuster. They used to make Teflon and pans, and it has gone into the water. Ms. Bodine. OK. Ms. Kuster. And we have hundreds of families. They were on bottled water for a long period of time. Ms. Bodine. Right. Ms. Kuster. And now, to the expense of millions of dollars, we have had to connect them to safe drinking water. Ms. Bodine. So one of the things that actually my office is involved in is developing a map, GIS map, where we would identify on the map all of the locations where we might expect PFAS contamination to be. Because remember when they did the unregulated contaminant monitoring for PFAS, it ended in--that was part of the 2015 round of monitoring, they found it above the health advisory in 1.3 percent of the public water systems and found it at any detection level in about 4 percent. But that doesn't capture communities with under 10,000 hookups. So we want the map so you can go and look has there been a firefighting center there, is there an industry where they have been using the PFAS. So again, for the very purpose that you have talked about, which is targeting so people can go then and do the testing. Ms. Kuster. Well let me ask you, is there any enforceable requirement to report a PFAS release? They know, the companies that use this technology, use these chemicals know. I mean they are well aware of the plume right under their facilities and their sites. In the end, Saint-Gobain's did come to the table and we were able to negotiate. But why don't you rely on them? Why do you do this whole-- -- Ms. Bodine. So---- Ms. Kuster [continuing]. Mapping and not just have a requirement, an enforceable requirement that the company has to come forward? Ms. Bodine. That is another action that is in the PFAS action plan, which is to add PFO and PFAS--and again, this is another office that would do this. It is a regulatory action-- but add it to the toxics release inventory, which then would mandate the reporting of release. Ms. Kuster. And what is the time line for that? Ms. Bodine. Again, I would have to answer for the record because it is not my office. Ms. Kuster. Well I just want to put on the record the urgency of families that are being exposed. And I want to thank the Moms Clean Air Action for being with us today and for families all across this country who care about their children and the quality. These are families that are drinking the water and it is not just Flint, Michigan. It is my district. It is every district across this country. And I urge you to bring some urgency to this. And with that, I yield back. Ms. DeGette. The Chair now recognizes the gentleman from Virginia, Mr. Griffith, for 5 minutes. Mr. Griffith. Thank you very much, Madam Chair. After reading through some of the testimony, I believe that we may hear some claims this morning in our next panel about the New Source Review Program. And I have been through this with the committee before but there are lots of stories like the ones out of my district where people are not pursuing improvements because they are afraid of tripping over the New Source Review Program and then having to spend a whole lot more money, so they don't do anything. And that has caused a lot of, I think, a lot of upgrades not to be done and some of which would have improved the environment. Now I know the Americans are paying more than necessary because of this and others things to improve air quality due to the overlapping air programs. About 13 programs overlap with the NSR, New Source Review, and I have legislation to fix all that but it is not likely to come up in the next couple of years, even though I think it is great, common sense reforms that will benefit the environment. Ms. Bodine, would you like to speak to the NSR Program, because you all are doing some things administratively similar to what my bill would do, and tell us what you are doing on that and how that relates to other programs that you all are working on? Ms. Bodine. So thank you, Congressman. The NSR Program is run out of the Air Office. And so they would establish the policies and the regulations. We obviously enforce. But I do want to mention that for a number of years there has been a National Compliance Initiative that deals with New Source Review. Under that as a result and today, and I think that has already been mentioned perhaps by Congressman McKinley that sulfur dioxide is down 90 percent in the power sector. Nitrogen oxide is down by 85 percent in the power sector since 1997. And so when we look at where we should be focusing and where we have the opportunity to help communities and to help noncompliance, we are looking at other areas. And I would like to mention the fact that we are doing a lot of work on mobile sources now, and obviously that was the VW case, it was the Fiat Chrysler case but we also are dealing with it in terms of defeat devices and the aftermarket and the catalytic converters. I know that we got a letter from Congressman Guthrie, Congressman McKinley, and two of your colleagues about the catalytic converters and we are changing our tampering policy. We expect to roll that out pretty shortly. And the estimate that I have been given is that the State of California expects that by changing our policy and encouraging better performing catalytic converters, we can get rid of 85,000 tons per year of NOx nationwide, again, which is going to help with ozone nonattainment. It is NOx. It could help with the deposition of nitrogen. Mr. Griffith. That wouldn't necessarily show up in these stats that have been thrown around this morning because---- Ms. Bodine. It would not. Mr. Griffith [continuing]. You are dealing with sometimes individuals who are doing things they are not supposed to be doing as opposed to companies. Ms. Bodine. Yes, you are right. Changing our tampering policy will not show and to get these kinds of reductions will not show up in our results. Mr. Griffith. And you have been working with the States a lot to make sure that they do because the States do a lot of the enforcement. Isn't that correct? Ms. Bodine. Yes, that is true. Mr. Griffith. And isn't your goal to move this to the States? Can you give us some idea of how you have been doing things with the States and what inefficient duplications you have seen with the State programs? Ms. Bodine. So a couple of the Members here mentioned the ECOS Working Group. So we did hear at the very beginning when-- -- Mr. Griffith. For the folks back home, that would be the Environmental Council of States. Ms. Bodine. Thank you. Thank you. I apologize for that. Mr. Griffith. That is all right. Ms. Bodine [continuing]. Who represent the State commissioners and they were complaining that EPA would show up in their State without even telling them, taking either inspection or enforcement action without even telling them, even at a facility that the State perhaps had just inspected. And so what we have said to the regions is look, you need to be working in partnership with States. You need to do work planning together. Everyone has finite resources. You need to divide up the universe. We absolutely need a compliance assurance presence. We need inspections. But we should be working collaboratively so that if the State is doing it, we don't need to be doing it because that would be wasteful. Mr. Griffith. Right. Ms. Bodine. If the State needs to get training and capacity building, then we should be going out with them and providing that training. Mr. Griffith. And you all are obviously monitoring what the States are doing so that you can make sure that somebody is covering it. Isn't that correct, yes or no? I am running out of time. Yes or no? Ms. Bodine. Yes. Mr. Griffith. All right. And since you have been there, have you all intervened in any States where they aren't doing what they are supposed to do and haven't done the inspections properly or something? Ms. Bodine. So we have two examples where we--well, we have leaned heavily on States to take action and they have. So yes, we do have examples of that. Mr. Griffith. All right. Ms. Bodine. But then at the end of the day, the State finally did take the action and we didn't have to. And all that work doesn't show up in our results either. Mr. Griffith. In your data, OK. I yield back. Ms. DeGette. The gentleman yields back. The Chair now recognizes the gentlelady from Florida, Ms. Castor, for 5 minutes. Ms. Castor. Thank you very much. Ms. Bodine, I would like to spend the next few minutes talking to you about EPA civil case initiation. Civil enforcement at the EPA is a tool that you use to hold polluters accountable for violating Federal environmental laws and to deter future bad actors. Where EPA identifies a significant violation and determines that Federal enforcement is appropriate, the Agency may start an enforcement case. Is that generally correct? Ms. Bodine. Yes. Ms. Castor. OK. Ms. Bodine, EPA's fiscal year 2018 enforcement and compliance numbers, according to your own numbers, indicate that the civil case initiations last year were at their lowest point in a decade, just over 1800. To add to that, a watchdog group recently reported that civil enforcement case initiations last year were lower than any year going back to 1982. That would mean civil case initiations may be at the lowest level in 36 years. What is your explanation for that that we are at the--EPA is at its lowest level of civil case initiations in 36 years? Ms. Bodine. So Congresswoman Castor, as I had pointed out earlier, that is a narrow slice of the work that we do. It is Federal formal enforcement case initiations. And so it doesn't capture the work that we are doing with States, where we may develop a case and they may take it over. It doesn't capture the facilities that are getting back into compliance after self-disclosing. So it is important and I would absolutely agree that we need to maintain enforcement presence but I would not say that the number of cases is reflective of that. And---- Ms. Castor. Now your predecessor did not agree. Cynthia Giles, who preceded you as head of EPA's Enforcement Office, was very recently quoted in a press report saying EPA is trying to convince media and the public that EPA is still doing its job on enforcement, despite all the reports showing that isn't the case. So I think it is fairly clear EPA is not doing the job that it should. And so, taking your predecessor's point, as it relates to case initiations, how can you claim that the EPA is in fact going after polluters, given the decline? You said it is a narrow piece but, wow, 36 years, a 10-year decline that took a hit as the Trump administration came into the Executive Branch. I am having a hard time seeing how you claim otherwise. Ms. Bodine. So I am sorry that you feel that way. I know that the staff are working very hard in developing cases, and bringing cases, and that we are trying to target our resources where we have---- Ms. Castor. Here is why it is important because lax enforcement sends the wrong message to industry and polluters. And I have a very hard time understanding how the public and the regulated community are supposed to have confidence in EPA when you are not enforcing America's bedrock environmental laws, when they see that an Agency has initiated the lowest amount of cases in what appears to be three decades. And did I understand your answer? Did you testify in a previous answer that we have a low--EPA is initiating a fewer number of enforcement cases because there are fewer bad actors? Ms. Bodine. I didn't say that. Ms. Castor. OK. Chairwoman DeGette, I am very concerned about this. They are not going to be able to deter bad actors. These are extraordinarily low numbers. It really appears to me that the Trump administration and the EPA, which is supposed to be the guardian of the public health, is elevating polluter profits over the public health. This is at a time when they are also rolling back critically important environmental and public health protections. What you do here by not enforcing the law is you further compound the problem and it is an abdication of your responsibilities. Ms. DeGette. Will the gentlelady yield? Ms. Castor. I yield. Ms. DeGette. Ms. Bodine, so you had said to Ms. Castor that the number of enforcement actions filed at the Federal level is just a narrow slice. Do you know how many additional cases were filed at the State level, then, with EPA assistance? Did that number go up dramatically in the last 2 years? Ms. Bodine. So we haven't started formally tracking State assists. We have asked the regions to track their State assists. So I have some data on that, which I can give to you for the record but it wasn't tracked before---- Ms. DeGette. So you don't---- Ms. Bodine [continuing]. What we are calling State assists. Ms. DeGette. Right. So you don't really know if the number of State cases went up. You are just suspecting they might have. Ms. Bodine. The States report some of their cases to us in our reporting system and we can provide you with that data. I don't have all of their data. The---- Ms. DeGette. OK, thank you very much. Ms. Bodine. OK. Ms. DeGette. And Ms. Castor, thank you for letting me use the rest of your time, which has expired. I am now going to recognize Mr. Duncan from South Carolina for 5 minutes. Mr. Duncan. Thank you, Madam Chair. In my State, one of my communities has a four-lane highway running through it. It is not an interstate highway but they were requesting an intersection, an interchange, off-ramps to create a new industrial area and the county was under a nonattainment order from the EPA. Very little industry in that county in Upstate South Carolina that has emissions issues. Very little. And very little traffic. It is not an interstate highway on this four-lane but yet they were denied the ability to put in that interchange. And when we started looking at it, the EPA under the Obama administration had monitors in the county for air quality. And it was very apparent that the emissions or what was affecting this county was coming from not another county but another State, Tennessee primarily, westerly winds coming over the mountains, settling in Pickens County, South Carolina. So there is an issue of where we put these monitors for a lot of different things, whether it is heat sensors or whether it is air quality sensors. Those are issues that may affect other Members' communities and I just wanted to raise awareness of that. I want to jump to a particular type of case, those being the Clean Air Act nonattainment cases. The oil and gas new owner audit program has one interesting approach that the EPA is taking to reduce nonattainment. Can you tell us more about this program and other actions EPA has taken to reduce the Clean Air Act nonattainment? Ms. Bodine. Yes, thank you. In the oil and gas sector, you can have leaks from tanks. There can be leaks from wells. The new owner self-disclosure program encourages a new owner of these facilities to do their own inspection, and discover their own violations, and then disclose them, come into compliance, and then they would have no penalties because they are the new owner. They weren't responsible for it. And we have seen a lot of companies come in under our new owner program because of that incentive. They are starting fresh. And it has been very valuable. Again, for the oil and gas sector, it started from a settlement that was begun in 2016 but then recognized that that could be a model that could be used more broadly. And so it is a great opportunity to again get compliance and let the new owner start fresh. Mr. Duncan. I would say that is a cost savings for the EPA and ultimately, the taxpayer. Ms. Bodine. Yes. Mr. Duncan. To follow up, there has been criticism on the reduction of the size of the OECA office. I have been supportive of this administration's effort to peel back some of the layers of bureaucracy that have embedded themselves in the Agency. When the EPA is inefficient, they are holding up capital. How does this new owner audit program capitalize on the resources of the EPA while still reducing nonattainment. Ms. Bodine. Well if the new owner is coming in, then you are right, we don't have to expend our resources then going out and finding them. We don't have to expend our resources bringing a case against them. Again, it is far more efficient and gets compliance more quickly. Mr. Duncan. And you can focus those resources on other areas that---- Ms. Bodine. On vulnerable populations, on chemical risk safety issues, our other National Compliance Initiatives. Mr. Duncan. Yes, thanks for being here. Madam Chair, I yield back. Ms. DeGette. The gentleman yields back. The Chair now recognizes the gentleman from Maryland, Mr. Sarbanes. Mr. Sarbanes. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you, Ms. Bodine, for being here. I just want to go back on an exchange you had a moment ago because you suggested--you seemed to suggest that the reduction in civil penalties and other things from an enforcement standpoint at the Federal level has maybe been replaced by States being more aggressive on that front. Did you say something to that effect? Ms. Bodine. I said that we work--that most of the activities are taking place at the State level, and that has always been true---- Mr. Sarbanes. Yes. Ms. Bodine [continuing]. And that we are trying--we are working with States and States are more sophisticated, and we are building State capacity if they have lost folks and---- Mr. Sarbanes. Are you aware that the State fines have also diminished over the last couple of years? When you look at the record, it shows that between '06 and 2016 the penalties at the State level were averaging about $91 million a year, but in 2017 they were $38 million, and in 2018 they were $59 million. A lot of these State agencies are not resourced in a way that can make up for lack of enforcement at the Federal level. So it seems to be diminishing on both fronts. Ms. Bodine. I think I will say what I have said in response to other questions but I don't believe penalties are a good measure of enforcement. Penalties are important for deterrence but that is not a measure of compliance. And you will see in the data that we have presented, because we go back 10 years, that penalties go up and down dramatically and, in fact, at the Federal level they were below $250 million for 8 out of the last 10 years. Mr. Sarbanes. Well, it seems many, if not all, of the indicators which we have at our disposal to judge whether enforcement is happening at the levels it should or not seem to be going in the wrong direction, whether you look at the State efforts or you look at the Federal efforts. To me that would suggest that the Federal Government needs to step up even more and occupy this space in an aggressive and responsible way. But let me talk to you about injunctive relief because that is an important tool that you have as part of your enforcement kit of measures that you can undertake. And this is a way that the EPA can insist on industry players and others coming into compliance. So we understand from your staff briefing recently that EPA enforcement actions resulted in almost $4 billion, $3.95 billion in compliance costs in fiscal year 2018. Does that sound about right to you? Ms. Bodine. Yes, I am reading it off the chart right here. Mr. Sarbanes. OK, you have got it right there. All right. And according to a January 24th Washington Post article, the compliance costs for the 2 decades before the Trump administration roughly averaged $7.8 billion per year, which is nearly double the amount that the EPA obtained in fiscal year 2018. Are those numbers correct, as far as you know? Ms. Bodine. I don't believe that you can average these numbers. I mean, you have the chart also. You can see that you have very, very high---- Mr. Sarbanes. But in any event, they were significantly higher. And then in a recent article, I just wanted to note in The Christian Science Monitor, your predecessor, Cynthia Giles, was quoted as saying, ``Injunctive relief tells you whether the EPA is taking on the tough, very hard, big pollution cases'' and ``This data shows the Trump EPA is not doing that.'' Now, I get that the compliance injunctive relief numbers can vary from year to year, but these are pretty low numbers, some of the lowest we have seen in a long time. Is Ms. Giles wrong when she says injunctive relief is a good indicator to evaluate whether an administration is going after the worst polluters, in your view? Ms. Bodine. I think that former Assistant Administrator Giles knows very well that, when you are talking about these really big cases, it takes a lot of years to develop and complete those cases. So if I---- Mr. Sarbanes. Well let me grab onto that because I am going to run out of time, that idea of taking a long time. Ms. Bodine. Right. Mr. Sarbanes. Because that $3.95 billion figure for 2018 apparently, according to the Christian Science Monitor article, 40 percent of that total almost is from cases that were settled by the EPA under President Obama. So even that low number, that $3.95 billion low number, if you look at it in terms of what has actually been undertaken in this administration, it is much lower still because 40 percent of that is coming from the prior administration. Are you aware of those numbers? Can you tell me what the number is that comes from the previous administration? Ms. Bodine. So in our results, we count the injunctive relief in the year that the court enters it. And as well, you are not going to see numbers from cases that we initiated that would be big. Small cases, yes, but large cases, because it takes a long time, so you are going to see that later. So we are---- Mr. Sarbanes. I get it. There is a timing issue. There is a snapshot issue. Ms. Bodine. Yes. Mr. Sarbanes. There is a range issue---- Ms. Bodine. Yes, absolutely. Mr. Sarbanes [continuing]. And so forth. But in any event, I think there is plenty of evidence here that the mission you have of fair and effective enforcement of environmental laws, particularly using, as I was discussing here in the injunctive relief, is not being fulfilled based on the numbers that we are seeing. With that, I would yield back my time because I am over. Thank you. Ms. DeGette. The Chair now recognizes the gentlelady from New York, Ms. Clarke, for 5 minutes. Ms. Clarke. I thank our chairwoman and ranking member for hosting this hearing today. Ms. Bodine, I want to talk about budget because the fiscal year 2019 budget request called for nearly a 25 percent cut to the EPA. And to put that in perspective, if those cuts were enacted, they would push the EPA's budget to its lowest level since 1991. I would point out that compliance and enforcement activities are not spared from these proposed cuts. How would these proposals, if they were enacted, have impacted enforcement activities? Ms. Bodine. I don't know. We would be using the resources that Congress gives us as effectively and as efficiently as we can. And we would be focusing on the largest cases. We do still take a lot of very small cases. A large percentage of these cases, conclusions that have been discussed today, are still very small cases. And so we would focus on the most important cases and we would focus on making sure that we were providing assistance and training to States. Ms. Clarke. So we have been talking about sort of the decline in what we can recognize as enforcement activity. Are you saying that there would be no correlation in bringing action between a reduction in your budget and the fact that you are at a 30-year low in that enforcement? Ms. Bodine. So what I said was that we would be further focused on the most important actions. I didn't say it would have no impact. But in terms of if we were not going to be taking an action, it would definitely be only in situations where there wasn't an immediate public health or environmental threat, situations where we knew the State was already dealing with the issue. So again, we would be very strategic. Ms. Clarke. So Ms. Bodine, even though Congress prevented those cuts from being enacted, I am deeply concerned that certain damage was done. I am concerned that those proposed cuts sent a signal to regulated communities and EPA employees that the administration doesn't take its responsibility to enforce environmental laws seriously. Are you concerned that the previously proposed budget cuts to EPA sends a message to polluters and EPA staff that the Agency doesn't take environmental enforcement seriously? Ms. Bodine. As I mentioned in my opening statement, I have gone around to the regions, I have talked to my staff to make sure that they know that we do very much value the work that we do and that enforcement is incredibly important. Ms. Clarke. So I want to shift gears just a tad bit. Two- thirds--I am from New York--of New Yorkers regularly breathe in unhealthy air due to smog. That is why New York State and City has actually sued the EPA last month regarding its failure to enforce the Clean Air Act. The quote, ``good neighbor,'' end quote, provision of the Act requires the EPA to police air pollution in States not living up to Federal standards so it doesn't blow downwind to States like mine. This lawsuits results from the EPA's decision to reverse its prior finding that ozone pollution should be subject to this provision. Why did the EPA take this action, which harms the health of New Yorkers? Ms. Bodine. So, congresswoman, I don't actually have any background information on that. That would be a regulation that would come out of the Air Office. Ms. Clarke. OK and so you wouldn't be looking into a lawsuit that has implications around enforcement and regulation. Ms. Bodine. Our General Counsel's Office would be managing that lawsuit. My office would not have anything to do with it. Ms. Clarke. Very well. Well then let me share just this one last question, since I have a short amount of time. Will next year's budget propose similar draconian reductions for EPA like last year's proposal? Ms. Bodine. I don't know. Ms. Clarke. You don't know. Will you be advocating for a more robust budget? Ms. Bodine. So I believe the President's budget is going to come out in March, next month. Ms. Clarke. Absolutely. Ms. Bodine. So the---- Ms. Clarke. Well, if the past precedent is prologue, what are your feelings about that, given what has all been revealed here today? Ms. Bodine. I support the President's budget. Ms. Clarke. Oh, very well. I yield back, Madam Chair. Ms. DeGette. The Chair now recognizes the gentleman from New York, Mr. Tonko, for 5 minutes. Mr. Tonko. Thank you, Chairwoman DeGette, for hosting this hearing and welcome, Administrator Bodine. Ms. Bodine. Thank you. Mr. Tonko. Civil penalties are an important enforcement tool at EPA. Civil penalties are monetary assessments paid by a regulated entity because of a violation or noncompliance. They are designed to recover the financial benefit a company has obtained by breaking the law and impose added cost to deter firms from breaking the law again in the future. So Administrator Bodine, would you agree that civil penalties are an important enforcement tool for EPA? Ms. Bodine. Yes. Yes, I do. Mr. Tonko. And according to EPA's annual enforcement report for fiscal year 2018, EPA obtained just $69.4 million in Federal administrative and civil judicial penalties. A recently released report cited by The Washington Post states that this is the lowest amount of civil penalties recovered since the Office of Enforcement and Compliance Assurance was established back in 1994. Even excluding the huge BP penalty, The Washington Post reports, and I quote, the Trump administration's civil monetary penalties ``last year represented a roughly 55 percent drop from the annual average.'' In fact, according to a February 8th Washington Post report, the $69 million in civil penalties leveled by EPA ``represents the lowest in nearly a quarter-century.'' So Administrator Bodine, is that accurate? Ms. Bodine. I can look at the--I know what our results say. I don't have the data that you have. But I also would note that penalties go up and down and that---- Mr. Tonko. OK but could you get back to us if it is accurate? Ms. Bodine. Certainly. Mr. Tonko. Thank you. In the roughly 25-year history of the Office of Enforcement and Compliance Assurance, has the amount of civil penalties leveled by EPA ever been this low? Ms. Bodine. In the 11 years of data I have in front of me, no, but I don't have it back further. Mr. Tonko. OK, thank you. And Ms. Bodine, some have suggested that annual total penalties can be strongly influenced by the presence of one or two large cases. To illustrate this point, your staff provided to the committee analysis which shows annual results for civil penalties after removing two large cases, that being BP and VW. In your testimony, you had mentioned that for 2019, the State of California and EPA secured a civil penalty of some $305 million. So my question, Administrator Bodine: What is the amount of civil penalties for fiscal year 2019 to date, if you exclude the large Fiat Chrysler penalty? I have this chart that was provided by your Agency that shows this huge spike with the Fiat Chrysler penalty. This has been adjusted for BP and VW. So I have heard all the talk about spikes, and peaks, and valleys. I have heard about the averaging throughout the years. But in a 30-year span, if you take this out, what is the amount of civil penalties for fiscal year 2019 to date? Ms. Bodine. I am going to have to provide that for the record. Mr. Tonko. Yes, that is very important information, because that spike looks like the whole picture for 2019. Again, Ms. Bodine, on the second panel, Eric Schaeffer, who spent 12 years at the EPA as the Director of the Agency's Office of Civil Enforcement, will testify that EPA's enforcement results for 2018 fiscal year were historically low. His testimony indicates, and I quote, ``the number of inspections and investigations, civil cases either referred to the Justice Department for prosecution or concluded with a consent decree, criminal cases opened, and defendants charged with environmental crimes fell to their lowest levels since at least 2001. ``Looked at another way, inspections and investigations in the last year were 40 percent below their average level during the last two administrations. EPA referred 123 cases to the Justice Department in 2018, compared to an average of 211 per year under President Obama, and 304 under President Bush.'' Ms. Bodine, that certainly seems like a decrease in enforcement activities. How do you respond to that? Ms. Bodine. You can't look at average when you are talking about enforcement. We don't set quotas. We don't say we are going to ask the staff to reach an average number of penalties, and you know you have get $500 million in penalties a year, and that you have to go out and increase penalties to reach that number. We don't say you have to reach an average number of cases. And again, we want them to be very judicious and strategic and put the resources where it matters. We do, however, try and set targets for inspections because we absolutely agree that we need to be out there. We need to be inspecting for compliance. We need to have the enforcement presence out there. Mr. Tonko. I am just concerned that EPA has taken the environmental cop off the beat and will go on polluting without fear of repercussions. So with that, I thank you for your time. Ms. Bodine. Thank you. Mr. Tonko. I yield back. Ms. DeGette. The Chair now recognizes the gentleman from Oklahoma, Mr. Mullin, for 5 minutes. Mr. Mullin. Thank you, Madam Chairwoman. I ask unanimous consent to include a letter from Senator Unruh regarding the EPA enforcement into the record. Ms. DeGette. Without objection, so ordered. [The information appears at the conclusion of the hearing.] Mr. Mullin. Thank you. Ma'am, thank you so much for being here. And I have got to tell you, coming from a business owner that owns an environmental company, it is refreshing to have an EPA now that is willing to work with us. We have DEQ, Department of Environmental Quality inside Oklahoma that obviously partners with the EPA. And underneath the last administration, it felt like every time the EPA showed up at a job site or a place of business, they were there just to look at ways to write fines. They were not there trying to work with the industry, trying to improve it. And in fact, if you even questioned it, you typically got a supervisor that came back with more penalties. And so it was to the point where you couldn't work with the Agency anymore. So the idea that you are bringing it back to working with industry, I, personally, appreciate it and I can tell you industries appreciate it, too. It has always been in my mindset that the government is supposed to create an environment for the economy to thrive, to allow the industry to work with best practices. And I feel like that that is coming back around to the EPA. So thank you so much. I have got a couple of questions here. My understanding is that OECA is trying to use the right tools to focus on major, even criminal compliance issues. Is that correct? Ms. Bodine. Yes, that is correct. Mr. Mullin. So if that is accurate, then would you attribute the new efficiencies to the uptick in criminal enforcement cases open in fiscal year 2018? Ms. Bodine. I am not sure if it is an efficiency issue but we have certainly been very, very supportive of the criminal program. I am happy to see the number of cases that they have opened for investigation as well now. Mr. Mullin. What type of compliance issues do you think you are dealing with right now? Ms. Bodine. Across the country? Mr. Mullin. Just for the most. Just give me maybe the top three. Ms. Bodine. So we are concerned about, for example, the number of Clean Water Act permit holders that are in significant noncompliance with their permits. And so we are trying to work with States to get that number down. We are also concerned about drinking water and we are talking about developing a New National Compliance Initiative on drinking water because I think everyone around the country is concerned that we have noncompliance. You know we have cases underway but we also know that there are small systems out there that need help. Mr. Mullin. Are you having issues with discharge permits for like maybe municipalities? Ms. Bodine. So they are a big part of the universe that is in noncompliance with their permits that we track. And again, a lot municipalities that had both combined sewer overflows and sanitary sewer overflows, a lot of those are already under either an administrative order, a consent decree, or a permit to get them back into compliance. Mr. Mullin. Does that have to do with their treatment centers that are maybe outdated and they can't afford to put in new ones? Ms. Bodine. That can very much be the case. And when we deal with those issues, then we look at the time frame over which they would need to come back. Mr. Mullin. Let's say when they built it, they were compliant and then new standards have increased, which made them out of compliance, or is it because they have equipment that is down? Ms. Bodine. It is both. Mr. Mullin. It is both. Do you have enough Federal agents to enforce your criminal investigations? Ms. Bodine. So I have authorized the hiring to take us up to 164 agents. We don't have that number onboard right now. Again, it takes about 6 months to bring on an agent. Mr. Mullin. How many are you behind? Ms. Bodine. I think right now we have about 147---- Mr. Mullin. One hundred and forty-seven. Mr. Burgess [continuing]. But we have a number of hires in the works. They have to go through a lot. They carry guns. They have to go through a lot of background checks. Mr. Mullin. So what is the time frame to be able to get them up to speed and have them---- Ms. Bodine. Can I answer for the record? It takes a long time. It is not getting them up to speed. It is getting them onboarded. It is getting them hired. Mr. Mullin. Now, what is---- Ms. Bodine. But, again, I authorized that back in June or July, and so we are working hard to get those folks on. Mr. Mullin. So what is the total number of vacancies you have? Ms. Bodine. Well, I believe--again, I have some people coming on in March. Mr. Mullin. OK. Ms. Bodine. They were supposed to come on in January, but they didn't because we were shut down. But they are coming on in March, and so I think today it is about 147. We are trying to get it up to 164, but I don't know how many are coming in within the next few weeks. Mr. Mullin. Real quick, one last question: Why do the EPA agents need to be carrying guns? Ms. Bodine. So they go out and they serve search warrants, and sometimes people resent the fact that they are in fact searching their facility. And we have had---- Mr. Mullin. So it is for protection purposes. Ms. Bodine. Absolutely. We have had---- Mr. Mullin. It is not enforcement, it is protection. Ms. Bodine. It is protection. We have had situations. Mr. Mullin. Right, well that was what I was hearing. Ms. Bodine. That is exactly what it is. Mr. Mullin. It is not for enforcement purposes. Ms. Bodine. No. Mr. Mullin. It is for self-protection. Ms. Bodine. It is absolutely for personal protection, yes. Mr. Mullin. OK, thank you so much. I appreciate it. Ms. Bodine. Yes. Mr. Mullin. I yield back. Ms. DeGette. The Chair now recognizes the gentleman from California, Mr. Peters, for 5 minutes. Mr. Peters. Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you, Ms. Bodine, for being here with us. My first job after graduating college was working as an economist for the ToSCA section of the Office of Toxic Substances under ToSCA. And that drove me from being an economist to going to law school. And then as a lawyer, one of the first things I did was work on Superfund as an environmental lawyer after it was reauthorized in the mid-1980s. And I want to talk about that program for a few moments. The Superfund program is a critical public health program that has made an enormous difference in cleaning up dangerous contaminated sites across the country and there are a lot of effective tools and private enforcement but public enforcement, EPA enforcement staff still has a lot of responsibility for identifying responsible parties and ensuring that the appropriate people pay to get the cleanups done. In 2018, Superfund enforcement generated the lowest level of private party cleanup commitments in 10 years. Is that your understanding? Ms. Bodine. I will take your word for it. I don't have my Superfund slide in front of me but I can pull it out. Mr. Peters. OK. And also, I understand that the volume of contaminated soil and water to be cleaned up also dropped significantly in that time period. Is that also your understanding? Ms. Bodine. So I do know that the volume of hazardous waste--well, the volume of contaminated soil and water in 2018, I need my chart. I know that it was higher than it was in 2015, higher than it was in 2016. I believe it was less than 2017, however. Mr. Peters. OK. I am thinking over the last 10 years. That is my understanding. In any event, I don't think the need for cleanup has dissipated. The number of National Priorities List sites, NPL sites has remained consistent for years and the pace of cleanups has slowed markedly. Is it fair to attribute that to lesser enforcement? What do you attribute that to? Ms. Bodine. So I am not sure. I know that this administration we have been very focused on increasing the pace of cleanups in the Superfund program and that is by focusing management attention, making sure that we don't have logjams and that if private parties aren't stepping up, that we bring them to the table through the threat of enforcement. Mr. Peters. I guess the bottom line is that the number of NPL sites has not been reduced. Isn't that our goal to get these things cleaned up and off the list? Ms. Bodine. It is and, in fact, under this administration, we have had more deletions. I believe it was I think 22 sites were deleted from the NPL this past year, which is more than probably any--I would have to get the exact number but it is certainly a huge increase over prior years. Mr. Peters. What would be great is if I can ask you to follow-up, if you don't have these things in front of you. Ms. Bodine. Absolutely. Sure. Mr. Peters. Sometimes it is a little bit of a surprise. I would love to get those numbers from you on the cleanups. Ms. Bodine. Sure. Mr. Peters. The threat of enforcement carries particular weight in Superfund because the Agency has the authority to seek treble damages for cleanup costs from responsible parties. How often have you used the treble damage authority during your tenure, Ms. Bodine? Ms. Bodine. So these are 106 actions. I know that we have threatened them and then the private parties have come to the parties to the table in some cases that I have been briefed on. But I wouldn't know every instance and so I will have to get back because that would happen out in the region. So I will have to get back to you for the record on the number of 106 orders we have issued. Mr. Peters. Would you be able to share which cases those were with us? Ms. Bodine. I believe those would be public. Mr. Peters. I would like to compare your threats to the results, if that is OK with you. Ms. Bodine. Let me take that back. I believe those are public. If we actually issued the order, then that would--I believe those are public. Mr. Peters. All right, thank you. I yield back. Ms. DeGette. The gentleman yields back. Ms. Bodine, this concludes your testimony but I did want to raise a couple things with you. Number one, several of the Members today asked you to supplement your answers. Ms. Bodine. Yes. Ms. DeGette. And we expect that in a timely fashion. I am sure you can do that. When do you think you can get that information to us? Ms. Bodine. That I don't know, but I understand completely the need to be responsive. Ms. DeGette. Thirty days, do you think? Well, we are going to hope for 30 days. Ms. Bodine. OK. Ms. DeGette. One of the reasons I ask is the majority has sent your office five letters requesting information and documents since the beginning of this Congress. And as a rule, we ask for 2 weeks. We know you can't always get that in the 2 weeks, but we haven't gotten any of the information. So I would ask you to go back to your office and see if you can get responses to those five letters as well. Is that OK? Ms. Bodine. Yes. Ms. DeGette. Thanks. Just one last question, and then I will ask Mr. Guthrie if he has any last questions. In your response to Mr. Mullin, you said that you have a goal of increasing your number of criminal investigators to 164. Ms. Bodine. Yes. Ms. DeGette. How many investigators is the EPA required to have under the law? Ms. Bodine. There isn't a---- Ms. DeGette. There is no requirement. Ms. Bodine. There is no requirement. Ms. DeGette. OK, my staff says it is 200. So that is not accurate? Ms. Bodine. The, I believe, Pollution Prosecution Act of, what, 1990 said that by 1995 the number should be 200, and it was in 1995. But we don't have an ongoing obligation to maintain 200. Ms. DeGette. Under that Act. Ms. Bodine. Correct. Ms. DeGette. That is your interpretation of that Act. Ms. Bodine. Yes, that is correct. Ms. DeGette. OK, thank you. Mr. Guthrie, do you have any additional questions? Mr. Guthrie. No, thank you. I just want to thank you for coming to testify before us today. And I think there were several questions asked for timely responses to the questions, and I think that is appropriate. And I appreciate you coming before us today. Thank you. I yield back. Ms. DeGette. Thank you very much. With that you are dismissed, Ms. Bodine. And I would now ask the second panel witnesses to please come to the table. Thank you so much all for coming. I would now like to introduce our second panel of witnesses. OK, you guys are not sitting in the order on this, but I am going to introduce you in the order of this. Bruce Buckheit, who is an analyst and consultant and the former director of the Air Enforcement Division of the Office of Enforcement and Compliance Assurance; Dr. Bakeyah Nelson--is that right, Dr. Nelson, ``Bi-kay-uh''?--Executive Director of the Air Alliance Houston; Eric Schaeffer, the Executive Director of the Environmental Integrity Project; Dr. Chris Sellers, Professor of History and Director of Center for the Study of Inequality and Social Justice at Stony Brook University; Dr. Jay Shimshack, who is the Associate Professor of Public Policy and Economics, Frank Batten School of Leadership and Public Policy at the University of Virginia; and the Honorable Ronald J. Tenpas, a partner at Vinson and Elkins, former Assistant Attorney General, Environment and Natural Resources Division, U.S. Department of Justice. I want to thank all of you for appearing today and I am sure you are aware the committee is holding an investigative hearing and when we do so, we have a practice of taking testimony under oath. Does anyone have an objection to taking your testimony under oath? Let the record reflect the witnesses responded no. The Chair then advises you that under the rules of the House and the rules of the committee, you are entitled to be accompanied by counsel. Does anyone here desire to be accompanied by counsel today? No. Let the record reflect the witnesses have responded no. So if you would please rise and raise your right hand so you may be sworn in. [Witnesses sworn.] Ms. DeGette. You are now under oath and subject to the penalties set forth in Title 18 Section 1001 of the U.S. Code. So now the Chair will recognize the witnesses for 5 minutes for a summary of their written statements. In front of you is a microphone and a series of lights. The light will turn yellow when you have a minute left and red to indicate your time has expired. And I am going to have you testify in the order in which you are sitting. So, Mr. Schaeffer, we will start with you, and thank you so much. You have got 5 minutes. STATEMENTS OF ERIC SCHAEFFER, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, ENVIRONMENTAL INTEGRITY PROJECT; CHRIS SELLERS, PH.D., PROFESSOR OF HISTORY AND DIRECTOR, CENTER FOR THE STUDY OF INEQUALITIES, SOCIAL JUSTICE, AND POLICY, STONY BROOK UNIVERSITY, ON BEHALF OF THE ENVIRONMENTAL DATA AND GOVERNANCE INITIATIVE; BRUCE C. BUCKHEIT, ANALYST AND CONSULTANT, FORMER DIRECTOR, AIR ENFORCEMENT DIVISION, OFFICE OF ENFORCEMENT AND COMPLIANCE ASSURANCE, ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY; JAY P. SHIMSHACK, PH.D., ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR OF PUBLIC POLICY AND ECONOMICS, FRANK BATTEN SCHOOL OF LEADERSHIP AND PUBLIC POLICY, UNIVERSITY OF VIRGINIA; BAKEYAH S. NELSON, PH.D., EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, AIR ALLIANCE HOUSTON; AND RONALD J. TENPAS, PARTNER, VINSON AND ELKINS, LLP, FORMER ASSISTANT ATTORNEY GENERAL, ENVIRONMENT AND NATURAL RESOURCES DIVISION, DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE STATEMENT OF ERIC SCHAEFFER Mr. Schaeffer. Thank you, Madam Chairman and Ranking Member Guthrie, for the opportunity to testify. I am Eric Schaeffer, Director of the Environmental Integrity Project, and I did spend time at the EPA as Director of the Civil Enforcement Program. And if I may, I would like to address some of the issues that came up in prior testimony and have my written statement be in the record. Ms. DeGette. Without objection. Mr. Schaeffer. Thank you. So to take some of the points that were discussed, I just want to make clear that EPA's enforcement program does not just measure penalties and fines. It has always, at least for 25 years, measured enforcement outcomes. Those include the amount of pollution reduced through enforcement action and the amount of money spent on cleanup. And those measures are reported faithfully every year. They are also at historic lows in 2018. I believe the Chair made those points, but I just wanted to reinforce those outcome measures are also down. Also, I think it is important just to get back to basics and understand that enforcement protects people where they live and work, protects their health and environment where they live and work. So when a community is exposed to a blast of lead or a cloud of carcinogens from let's say a petrochemical plant, you really can't answer the problem by saying you know don't worry, sulfur dioxide emissions are down nationwide. They really want something done about what is going on in their neighborhood. That is enforcement work and I think it is important to just keep that in front of us. Next, EPA has had active programs to encourage voluntary compliance, including the disclosure and correction of violations for many, many years. They are important. They are necessary. They work in tandem with enforcement. It's not an either/or situation. And in fact, I think those voluntary efforts will start to shrink if enforcement starts to fall off. Looking at this issue maybe more philosophically, if you are a large refinery, let's say, or a large power plant, you aren't supposed to wait until the government comes calling to start complying with the law. So that kind of voluntary compliance is not what we should be talking about. It should be giving people incentives to get ahead of the game and stay in compliance before the enforcement program finds you. And when the program does find you, if you're looking at serious violations, and some of these cases involve thousands of violations over many years, you should pay a penalty and there should be no apology for that. And that penalty should sting. It should make you think twice about doing it again. That's fundamental. So I just want to say penalties do matter. They're not unimportant. And if you stop basically making people pay those penalties and fines, you won't get a lot of voluntary compliance. It's good to hear that the Assistant Administrator appreciates the great work of the enforcement program and I believe Ms. Bodine means it. I can't help but say these are the same great people who the administration keeps trying to pink slip. So the attitude seems to be you do great work; we just need less of it. That seems to be the message from the administration. You just can't have it both ways. You'll hear a lot about cooperative federalism being used to sell the idea of a retrieving EPA enforcement presence. That's a handoff of EPA responsibilities to States that do not have the budgets and, in many cases, do not have the same authority EPA has to enforce the law. You violate the Clean Air Act and EPA is coming at you, you can pay up to $100,000 per day for each violation. That's under the statutes you wrote. In many States, $10,000 is the maximum. You're just starting with fewer cards. You can't negotiate an outcome nearly as well as EPA can in that kind of lopsided situation. I just want to close by referring Members to the charts at the back. There, I've tried to show a list of plants where the communities face exposure to toxic pollutants and other noxious chemicals and hazards. And those have been documented by EPA in inspections or through monitoring records. They have been sitting for years with no enforcement action. In some cases, thousands of violations at these plants. So where's the beef? You know we want to focus on outcome. We should be asking what's going to happen with those cases. Last but not least, EPA will never run out of work. I've given you examples of the tips and complaints called into the National Enforcement Response Center that involve blowing lead dust into the environment, burning hexavalent chromium, dumping pollutants into the air, land, water, sewers, and those need attention. Thank you for your time. [The prepared statement of Mr. Schaeffer follows:] [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Ms. DeGette. Thank you. Dr. Sellers, you are recognized for 5 minutes. STATEMENT OF CHRIS SELLERS Dr. Sellers. Thank you for inviting me. My name is Chris Sellers and I'm a professor of environmental history and I'm director of the Center for the Study of Inequalities, Social Justice, and Policy at Stony Brook University. But I'm here today as a member of the Environmental Data and Governance Initiative, a network of more than 170 academics and other professionals and volunteers. We've been monitoring change the U.S. EPA since the beginning of the Trump administration. I head up an EDGI research team interviewing recently retired and current EPA employees. Our early findings have been published in major scholarly outlets like the American Journal of Public Health. Over the last year, I have joined with EDGI colleagues Leif Fredrickson, and Marianne Sullivan, and others, to study this most critical function of the Agency, which we learned to be threatened, enforcement. We have researched the EPA's own public data and records supplemented by internal documents provided by interviewees. All point with startling unanimity to the same conclusion: Over the past 2 years, EPA enforcement has declined significantly. The only question has been just how badly. Well, fortunately, EPA has now released its fiscal year 2018 data and that's provided us and everyone else with clear answers. So with my testimony, I've included a 32-page compendium of charts and other analysis of this data, combining it with earlier publicly available EPA enforcement data. We have the links on our Web site, if you wish to follow them. It shows a decline in enforcement that is dramatic and alarming with a speed and scale that have only a single rival in the Agency's half-century history and that's the early Reagan administration in the early '80s, when they actually broke up EPA's enforcement wing. Most of the available measures of the Agency's performance are registering 10- or 15-year lows at the very least. To find a lower number of civil judicial referrals, we've talked about this a little bit, these are for the most egregious offenses to the Justice Department, you have to go back to 1976 and, as we said, total civil cases to 1982. People have already talked about that. By almost any measures, EPA is doing worse. Other measures by which EPA assesses its own enforcement don't run as far back, yet the Trump years still vie with the lowest ever recorded civil cases concluded to 1994, civil fines levied lowest since 1987, and I can go on. EPA's been curbing its ability not just to punish but to find violators. In 2017 inspections, these you know checking for compliance, those were the lowest in 25 years and then they fell still lower in 2017. Drops in inspections, which are the front end of the enforcement pipeline strongly suggest that the decline in EPA enforcement has not yet hit bottom. By almost any measure of its actions, EPA is backing off from its longstanding role as the Nation's top environmental cop. What EPA employees have told us in the course of our interviewing project strongly confirms the picture suggested by EPA's enforcement numbers, Ms. Bodine's testimony aside. Over the last 2 years, my team has conducted 100 confidential interviews with recently retired and current EPA staff, a quarter of whom work directly in enforcement. Of the last 24 interviews, including those in enforcement and out, all drawing on Trump administration experience, 75 percent of these mentioned problems with enforcement. It's widely known. Their testimony offers a concrete and plausible account also of what has driven the drop. Environment enforcement staff have gotten a message that industry is in the driver's seat, that they are to bow to its request. We've heard stories about the staff exodus, about members of the regulated communities becoming emboldened. We've documented a widespread belief among EPA staff that, in practice, this so-called cooperative federalism is turning out to mean deregulation, plain and simple. With rare uniformity, the evidence we found adds up to a convincing picture of a sad truth: EPA is extracting its own teeth. This is not just some bureaucratic reshuffle. Less enforcement will have real consequences for many Americans, especially those living nearest to these potential environmental threats. In 2008 under George Bush, EPA enforcement actions protected eight million people's drinking water and last year, that was down to 500,000. So, a plummet of several-fold. That level of inaction--that nearly begs for another Flint. Not only is the enforcement drop corroding the Federal commitment to protect health and the environment, it is weakening the ability of States to do so. Already, we believe, it has all but ensured significant deterioration of our Nation's public health and environment in the years ahead. Thank you. [The prepared statement of Dr. Sellers follows:] [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Ms. DeGette. Thank you. Mr. Buckheit. Chair DeGette---- Ms. DeGette. Hang on. Mr. Buckheit---- Mr. Buckheit. Yes. Ms. DeGette [continuing]. For 5 minutes. Thank you. STATEMENT OF BRUCE C. BUCKHEIT Mr. Buckheit. Thank you Chair DeGette, Ranking Member Guthrie, and Members for inviting me here today. I have been involved in Clean Air Act enforcement issues in a variety of roles since 1984. I would like to focus my remarks this morning on the recent policy statements of the Enforcement Office and advise the committee of what I think that portrays. Overall in my--and so I would ask that my written testimony be submitted for the record. Ms. DeGette. Without objection, all the witnesses' testimony will be part of the record. Mr. Buckheit. Thank you. Overall, the broad decline in the air enforcement metrics, in my view, is neither surprising nor accidental. This view is based on my years of experience in this area, including my personal interactions on many of these same air enforcement issues with Acting Administrator Wheeler and Assistant Administrator Wehrum in the 1998 to 2003 time frame. It is also based on recent Agency public statements, rulemaking proposals, and revised enforcement policies. Notably, these new enforcement policies are devoid of any measures to deter future violations of the Act. The administration's push to exit the enforcement arena ignores the history of air pollution control. Prior to the 1970s, States were primarily responsible for air pollution control. Federal authority over air pollution was either entirely missing or merely advisory. Over time, however, it became clear that deferring to the States did not work and so Congress adopted the 1970 Clean Air Act to end the race to the bottom among States. The CAA provides that once EPA has provided 30 days' notice to a State, EPA may enforce as appropriate. Enforcement policies that manage the Federal, State, and local roles have been developed over the years and worked well but this does not mean that EPA and State program managers must always agree. EPA has a job to do and many States do not have the political will to force their companies to retrofit with expensive pollution controls. This fact is documented by years of State enforcement records. There is no reason to believe that EPA's ceding near total enforcement authority to the States will alter the value that the different States place on environmental enforcement. EPA has now declared mission accomplished and deprioritized new air enforcement in what's called large emitting sectors. It has also likely walked away from ongoing investigations commenced under the previous administrations. While EPA says that it will complete the ongoing enforcement cases, that is to say matters that have already been referred to the Justice Department, it does not commit to complete the ongoing enforcement investigations in these sectors that were commenced under the Obama administration. EPA justifies abandoning the utility sector because emissions have declined as a result of enforcement actions taken against some companies years ago and subsequent EPA regulations. However, the EPA investigations during my tenure, and more recent investigations in the last few years, each show substantial noncompliance within the sector and this is the single largest polluting sector, on a unit-by-unit basis, in the country. This is where the money is. This sector also has a fairly substantial percentage of units that are not well controlled. My recollection is is that about a quarter of the plants don't have full on SO2 controls and half or more are not fully controlled for nitrogen oxides. EPA says that it is done with the other sectors because it has, quote, ``required controls or commenced investigations at'' 90 percent or more of the facilities in those sectors. However, commencing an investigation is not the same thing as completing an enforcement action. As it abandons the existing sectors, EPA does not identify any other large emitting industrial sectors to replace them. You heard earlier about targeting. Well there is no targeting in EPA's new plan. To say that you are going to target nonattainment areas provides no guidance at all. Where and how are you going to reduce emissions within the nonattainment areas? Several months before I left EPA, senior management had advised me that on a forward-looking basis we would not be enforcing the rules as they were on the books but as EPA intended them to be and had proposed them to be under change regulations. We now see the administration again seeking to change the New Source Review rules and I strongly suspect that what enforcement decisions are being made are being made on the basis of what they would like the new rules to be. Thank you. [The prepared statement of Mr. Buckheit follows:] [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Mr. Schaeffer. Thank you very much, Mr. Buckheit. Dr. Shimshack, you are now recognized for 5 minutes. STATEMENT OF JAY P. SHIMSHACK Dr. Shimshack. Chair DeGette, Ranking Member Guthrie, distinguished members of the committee, thank you for the opportunity to testify. My name is Jay Shimshack. I'm an associate professor of public policy and economics at the University of Virginia's Frank Batten School of Leadership and Public Policy. I've been conducting research on environmental enforcement and compliance for nearly 20 years now. Recently, I've devoted considerable efforts to synthesizing the relevant state of knowledge in the literature and my testimony today emphasizes two themes. First, the evidence indicates that traditional monitoring and enforcement actions get results. And second, the evidence indicates that further devolution of environmental oversight from Federal and regional offices to State or local agencies may have important consequences for human health and the natural environment. Before proceeding, it's worth noting what I mean by the evidence. A large and growing multi-disciplinary literature assesses environmental compliance by rigorously analyzing data. The methods are diverse. The evidence spans air, water, waste, oil, and other pollution. So some details on effectiveness: My work and that of many others shows that environmental inspections and fines enhance compliance and reduce pollution. Inspections and fines reduce immediate harm, as evaluations and requirements of administrative or judicial actions generate pollution reductions. Second, inspections and fines improve future environmental performance at the evaluated or sanctioned facility. Third, inspections and fines spill over to improve environmental performance at other facilities located under the same jurisdiction as the sanctioned facility via regulator reputation effect. And fourth, inspections and fines can induce facilities to go beyond compliance and reduce pollution below their permitted levels. The literature on the effectiveness of alternative approaches to promoting compliance, like enforcement actions without penalties, voluntary programs, cooperative arrangements, information disclosure and compliance assistance is much smaller and the results are considerably more mixed. My read of this literature is that environmental compliance tools beyond traditional inspections and fines can be effective when used as complements to traditional regulatory approaches but not as substitutes to traditional approaches. Some details on devolution: As has been stated at several points today, the majority of environmental permitting, inspection, and sanction activities are currently delegated to State and local authorities. Scholars have long-noted advantages and disadvantages of this system. One advantage is that State and local agencies may have better information on local conditions and preferences so activities can be more carefully tailored to local circumstances. On the other hand, the literature shows that decentralized oversight has disadvantages as well. The evidence suggests that devolved oversight can cause States to perceive a need to compete with one another to attract new business with lax environmental enforcement. Decentralized enforcement can fail to adequately address pollution impacts crossing State borders or attributable to large firm operating in many States simultaneously. Decentralization can heighten incentives for local regulators to pursue the interest of the regulated community, rather than the interest of the general public. My own recent work also illustrates another peril of devolution. Colleagues and I show that enforcement in a highly devolved system can lead to unintended enforcement spillovers across borders. Increases in enforcement pressure in one State provide incentives for competitors in other States to increase production and pollution. We show that this happens under the U.S. Clean Water Act. Pollution reductions from more enforcement in one State can be offset by increased pollution by competitors in other States. Results suggest that enforcement oversight may require more rigorous regional and national coordination than is currently available. Some implications: The evidence suggests that all else equal, reductions in EPA monitoring and enforcement actions will sacrifice benefits for environmental quality, human health, property values, and other endpoints. In principle, reductions in EPA monitoring and enforcement could be offset by countervailing increases in State and local environmental monitoring and enforcement activity. As a matter of practice, further devolution of oversight comes with risks for environmental quality, human health, and property values. Chair DeGette, distinguished Members, this concludes my remarks. I hope these comments provide a perspective from academic research on the important matters at hand. Thank you. [The prepared statement of Dr. Shimshack follows:] [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Ms. DeGette. Thank you, Doctor. Dr. Nelson, you are recognized for 5 minutes. STATEMENT OF BAKEYAH S. NELSON Dr. Nelson. Thank you, Chair DeGette, Ranking Member Guthrie, and members of the Oversight and Investigations Subcommittee for the opportunity to testify here today about EPA's enforcement record and the implications for the eight- county Houston region. I am the Executive Director of Air Alliance Houston, a local nonprofit organization that works to improve air quality and public health through research, education, and advocacy. Illegal releases of air pollution are all too common in Texas. Industry says these releases are unavoidable, yet they also know the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency and Texas Commission for Environmental Quality will not hold them accountable. This leaves people across Houston and Texas almost defenseless against harmful air pollution. More than 400 petrochemical facilities, including two of the four largest U.S. oil refineries reside in Harris County. Emissions events in Texas have been found to lead to the premature deaths of at least 16 people and $148 million in health-related costs per year. TCEQ, however, fails to penalize violators 97 percent of the time, according to an analysis by Environment Texas. This general unwillingness to enforce the law has essentially given industry a pass to poison. The Valero Houston Refinery, for example, released significant amounts of hydrogen cyanide into the air in 2016, despite not having a permit to do so. The consequence? There has been none to date. Neither EPA nor TCEQ has taken enforcement action. This is extremely concerning because the Valero refinery is located beside Houston's Manchester community, where 97 percent of the residents are people of color, 37 percent live in poverty, and 90 percent live within one mile of an industrial facility that is subject to the EPA's Risk Management Program. Many homes are within yards of the refinery, which has self-reported more than 200 unauthorized releases of toxic air pollutants since January 2003. High exposures to hydrogen cyanide can be extremely harmful to people's health and can result in death within minutes, while exposure at lower concentrations can cause eye irritation, headache, confusion, nausea, among other health effects. Hurricane Harvey serves as a cautionary tale about the vulnerability of millions of Americans who live near chemical plants. It also revealed how ill-equipped the State of Texas and the EPA are to handle disasters. During Harvey, over eight million pounds of pollution escaped into the air because of inadequate preparation for the storm by industry, EPA, and TCEQ. The biggest emissions release occurred in Galena Park, a predominately Latin and low-wealth community along the Houston Ship Channel. Two storage tanks at the Magellan Terminal released more than 11,000 barrels of gasoline. The company did not report the incident until 11 days after the spill occurred, according to the Houston Chronicle. Life-long Galena Park resident, Juan Flores, who works as a community organizer for Air Alliance Houston, said he and his neighbors smelled the strong odor of petroleum for several days after Harvey. People complained about the extreme stench, burning eyes, and more. They closed doors and windows but many still could not escape the odor, yet EPA and TCEQ have taken no enforcement action against Magellan. Galena Park is just one of many examples of how communities suffered public health impacts from the storm and of the inaction by EPA and TCEQ. During and in the immediate weeks after the storm, several organizations collected information and surveyed residents about the public health impacts. Many reported worsening health conditions yet, EPA and TCEQ are not holding the polluters accountable and have not yet required action to prevent similar problems in the future. Texas needs robust oversight from EPA because the State also limits the ability of local agencies to pursue enforcement actions against industrial polluters. Significant challenges exist to local enforcement of the Texas Clean Air Act. Specifically, one of the challenges to local enforcement of the Texas Clean Air Act is that, in some types of cases, the city must notify the TCEQ of a violation and give the State agency the first opportunity to determine whether to pursue an enforcement action. However, as previously noted, TCEQ fails to penalize violators 97 percent of the time. Enforcement action is particularly critical for communities of color and low wealth, as hazardous facilities are disproportionately concentrated in these neighborhoods, compromising the health and safety of people with some of the greatest health challenges and the fewest resources to address these issues. The overwhelming majority of incidents that occurred during Harvey took place in or near environmental justice communities. Years ago, EPA had recognized the need to make preventing chemical disasters a National Enforcement Initiative. The communities in Houston haven't seen EPA make good on that promise. Even worse, after committing to an increase in enforcement resources to the most overburdened communities in EPA's Environmental Justice Strategic Plan, the Agency is, instead, turning its back on communities that need enforcement the most, like Houston. These communities simply cannot rely on compassion or the good will of industry to comply with the law. In conclusion, I want to thank the subcommittee for conducting this hearing and for the opportunity to testify today. [The prepared statement of Dr. Nelson follows:] [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Ms. DeGette. Thank you, Doctor. Mr. Tenpas, you are now recognized for 5 minutes. STATEMENT OF RONALD J. TENPAS Mr. Tenpas. Madam Chair DeGette, Ranking Member Guthrie, members of the subcommittee, thank you for the opportunity to be here today and offer my perspective on environmental enforcement efforts. Just briefly, by way of my background on this, I've spent approximately 20 of my 30-year legal career focused on issues of enforcement of Federal law and regulation, seeing it both from the perspective of the government and the perspective of those who are subject to those laws and regulations. I started by spending 12 years at the Justice Department, beginning as an AUSA indeed in Congressman Castor's home location as an AUSA in Tampa, Florida. I then spent, after 6 years as a line attorney, I spent 6 years as a political appointee, including in two Senate-confirmed posts as a United States Attorney in the Southern District of Illinois, and then later as the Assistant Attorney General for the Environment and Natural Resources Division, the ENRD, as it is often called in shorthand. Just like you have been referencing OECA here at EPA, the ENRD is the group of lawyers that really take on all of the major Federal environmental cases that end up in the courts, including, of course, the most significant Federal environmental enforcement cases. And then following that time at the Justice Department, I've spent the last 10 years in private practice assisting clients, as they say, as they assess their environmental obligations and address potential violations. From that there are sort of five overall observations I would offer to the committee today. First, as there has been a great deal of discussion, both EPA and DOJ do try to measure and report on their enforcement results and EPA is currently using 12 major metrics. This data is, as I often put it, noisy. Single case outcomes from year to year can drive the annual results, making it sometimes difficult to discern fundamental trends. And so I would urge some amount of caution in drawing strong conclusions based on any single subset of those metrics or from even a narrow, relatively narrow period of years, a single year, or 2 years. As I look at the most recent EPA data that has been published and that the committee has been discussing, I see what I regard as a pretty typical mixed bag. Some enforcement metrics are up. From what was observed during periods of the prior administration, some are down, some are roughly in line with prior history. Thus, to me, that data doesn't overall suggest there has been an abandonment of environmental enforcement. Second, that kind of level of stability there is not surprising to me, given that between EPA and DOJ there is a very large and dedicated group of career professionals. And that group ensures that, regardless of administration, there is always likely to be a meaningful and continuous enforcement effort, as there should be. Third, for all of the attention that these annual statistics may get, at the end of the day they are proxies and they are somewhat poor proxies for the real objective here, which is consistent compliance with our environmental regulations. Enforcement is not an end in itself. The purpose of enforcement is to incentivize and, when necessary, to coerce compliance with our environmental regulations. And this leads to my fourth point, which is that we should always be open to the possibilities that there are better ways, there are alternative ways to secure compliance. Use of the enforcement stick need not be and likely should not be the only strategy. In this respect, things like voluntary self-reporting programs and similar incentive systems that aren't always accompanied by formal enforcement actions or a formal enforcement stat, as people in the government sometimes put it, those programs can be very important nevertheless. Finally, I will just say I have yet to meet the client who has taken the view that, because there is some impression or some reporting as has been discussed here, that enforcement efforts are down, it's going to cut back on its own environmental and compliance efforts. And one of the things that I think the Congress and this country should be proud of is that we know had a robust body of environmental statutes for several decades and that has in fact spurred within the corporate community them to develop large environmental health and safety professional staff who do believe in and are committed to complying with the law and who are well aware that there is an active and effective sect of career professionals at the enforcement agencies, Federal, State, and local. They are aware that there is more than one agency on the job, besides the EPA, under our scheme of cooperative federalism. Thus to me it is likely a false narrative to assume that even if enforcement efforts are subject to some adjustment at the Federal level, the reaction within the regulated world is a corresponding increase in noncompliance. I simply don't tend to see that level of cause and effect in my own observations. So I thank you for the opportunity to be here today. I appreciate the committee's invitation, and I look forward to addressing any questions. [The prepared statement of Mr. Tenpas follows:] [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT] Ms. DeGette. Thank you so much, Mr. Tenpas, and thanks to the entire panel. The Chair now recognizes herself for 5 minutes. On the first panel today, we heard about some of the key EPA enforcement mechanisms and how the enforcement figures have really just plummeted by pretty much any index under this administration. For example, we heard that EPA performed fewer inspections last year than it had in over a decade. We heard that the injunctive relief figure was the lowest in 15 years. We heard that the civil penalties were the lowest in nearly 25 years, and the number of civil cases initiated was the lowest since 1982. So I just want to ask some questions about this. Mr. Schaeffer, in your written testimony, you said quote, the ``EPA's enforcement results for the 2018 fiscal year were historically low by almost every measure.'' Is that accurate? Mr. Schaeffer. That is right. Ms. DeGette. OK. Now, you are a former EPA career enforcement official. And so I don't know if you heard Ms. Bodine's testimony, but she seemed to think that these statistics were unimportant and that in fact EPA's enforcement activities were just fine for a variety of reasons. What do you think the low numbers tell you about the EPA's enforcement of environmental laws by this administration? And are you concerned about some of these indicators and, if so, which ones? Mr. Schaeffer. So Madam Chairman, I am concerned. I think first of all, these are measures that the EPA enforcement program itself has selected to reflect their performance and what you get out of enforcement. Ms. DeGette. So it is their own statistics. Mr. Schaeffer. Their own statistics and these are performance measures that are published year after year. And I think it is true that across the board, with very few exceptions, they are all very far down. So they are well below not just prior years, the prior few years, but historical averages and that is of concern. Ms. DeGette. Now, Mr. Buckheit, you are also a former EPA career enforcement official. So do you agree with Mr. Schaeffer that these indices can be used to see whether the Nation's environmental laws are being adequately enforced? Mr. Buckheit. Yes, I do. I mean they are all sort of a mosaic that look at different parts of the program and when you put them together, you get an overall picture of decline. Ms. DeGette. An overall picture of decline? Mr. Buckheit. Yes. Ms. DeGette. OK, thank you. Now last year, the President's budget request called for a nearly 25 percent cut to the Agency. Had Congress not prevented those cuts from taking place, the budget would have been at its lowest level since 1991. So Mr. Schaeffer, I wanted to ask you what message did last year's budget request send to polluters and EPA's own staff about the approach to environmental enforcement? Mr. Schaeffer. That enforcement doesn't matter. Enforcement requires staff. You can't do the work without people. You are trying to cut the budget by a quarter, you are telling the staff their work doesn't matter. Ms. DeGette. Now what did you make of Ms. Bodine's statement just a few minutes ago that, irrespective of what the President's budget for next year, she is going to support it? What do you think that message that sends in terms of enforcement? Mr. Schaeffer. Well, I think I suppose she has to, as the-- -- Ms. DeGette. Well, yes, but what do you think? What message do you think that sends? Mr. Schaeffer. I think it is confused, anyway. It is pretty hard to constantly refer to the great work of the program at the same time that your President is trying to slash it by so much. Ms. DeGette. Thank you. Dr. Shimshack, I wanted to ask you because Ms. Bodine seemed to indicate that well, some of the national figures weren't so important because the EPA was working with the States on enforcement. And I think you would agree that State enforcement is important. Is that correct? Dr. Shimshack. That is correct. Ms. DeGette. But is that in a vacuum or is it important to do that in conjunction with these other efforts? Dr. Shimshack. So I think provided States have the resources and the capacity. Even then, my best guess is that further devolution may result in declines in environmental quality, as I testified. Ms. DeGette. Why is that? Dr. Shimshack. Again, there are issues of spillovers across States when they are not well coordinated. There are issues of regulatory capture, et cetera, so the things that I mentioned in my testimony. I do want to emphasize States do great work. Ms. DeGette. Well right, but they can't do it in a vacuum. Dr. Shimshack. But they are already doing the overwhelming majority of the day-to-day oversight. There is enormous variation in enforcement intensity across States. And States are already being asked repeatedly to do more with less. Ms. DeGette. Speaking about the enormous difference between enforcement in States, Dr. Nelson, I think that is what your testimony was about is the enforcement by your State of Texas. Dr. Nelson. That is correct. Ms. DeGette. So do you think Texas can be relied on to do the environmental enforcement by itself? Dr. Nelson. I don't think so. Ms. DeGette. Thank you. Thank you very much. The Chair now recognizes the gentleman from Kentucky, the ranking member, for 5 minutes. Mr. Guthrie. Thank you very much. So this has been an important hearing and I appreciate everybody being here. Mr. Tenpas, in your testimony, you specifically talked about noisy metrics and that single case outcomes can drive annual numeric enforcement results reported by EPA and DOJ. Can you further get into that? I know you only had 5 minutes to make five points but I would like you to talk about how the metrics are noisy and how that can show trends in reporting that may not be accurate. Mr. Tenpas. So what I meant by noisy is that you can get particularly significant individual cases in any year that cause that year to spike. And we have heard some discussions of those, BP in the year that matter was resolved, Volkswagen in the year that matter was resolved, and that feeds across the variety of metrics that you might have. In addition to some of these penalty ones, as was referenced, there is data on, for example, what is the level of commitment to clean up materials that have been achieved through various agreements and consent decrees. That as well can be very heavily influenced by a single case resolution with one big company in a single year. Mr. Guthrie. OK. You talked about--we have all talked about other measurements other than just enforcement. And I think someone said the trends were down across a lot of those measurements. Given what EPA measures, what else do you think we should ask them to measure that would give us a better indication of what they are doing? Mr. Tenpas. Well I think you have heard a couple of good ideas from Ms. Bodine this morning, when she talked about trying to find ways to capture times when they have worked effectively with a State to potentially do an inspection and help identify a problem that then the State takes the lead in working with the facility in resolving. You have heard ideas, you know I think the tracking of the self-reports that they have begun and I think is something of a more recent development, I mean it precedes this administration but I think it is more recent, is a very helpful metric for folks to be watching and to see how--what that produces. Mr. Guthrie. OK and also, Mr. Tenpas, as you currently note in your testimony, the objective of EPA is to promote and ensure compliance with our environmental laws and regulations. In your opinion, what tool does EPA have that is most helpful in ensuring compliance with environmental laws and regulations? Mr. Tenpas. I don't know that I have a single tool. I mean, part of that is what we are I think here to discuss today. I think, as said, it is the mosaic of tools, the threat of investigations, the use of and bringing cases, the use of inspections, the working very cooperatively with States in the regime that Congress established of cooperative federalism. I mean Congress anticipated the States to have a kind of primacy type role and EPA working with them to support them are probably the three most important things. Mr. Guthrie. So I always look in these hearings if something can result in Congress making corrections and fixes to this. That is one of the reasons we do this. So are there any tools that EPA does not have that would be helpful for it to have to help ensure compliance with environmental laws and regulations? Mr. Tenpas. There is nothing that occurs to me immediately. I think there are always sort of adjustments that you make in the program as you go along and as conditions change. I mean as I noted in my testimony, there are some metrics, you know one of the metrics has been sliding for years, and years, and years. I take that to be a marker of success because it is showing that some of the worst problems in terms of pollution locations and pounds to be corrected have been dealt with. And now we are at a different point in our enforcement and compliance approach. Mr. Guthrie. So I know Kentucky had a program in OSHA not EPA but had a program that industry could invite OSHA inspectors in. And if they came in and found negligence, there were certain exceptions, that they came in and found they immediately got fined. But what they really did was come in at the invitation of the company, do inspections, here are things you need to improve, go back and do follow-up. So the goal with that was compliance, not necessarily just getting a fine to go move forward. And I don't know the data because I like professors to do studies on things because data is data. But I don't know the result. But I would have to feel like that we were getting more compliance, even though we were getting this anecdotal less enforcement dollars. Mr. Tenpas. And that sounds right to me. There is, as I say, a variety of facilities they have staff, they do self- audits, they do inspections, they sometimes bring in third parties. But the government has a certain level of inspection expertise as well. And so a program that allows a company to draw on that expertise without necessarily feeling that its reward for that if something is identified is going to be a massive penalty. I can see how that program could be very successful in improving compliance outcomes. Mr. Guthrie. All right, well thank you. And I yield back. My time has expired. Ms. DeGette. Thank you. The Chair now recognizes the gentlelady from Florida, Ms. Castor, for 5 minutes. Ms. Castor. Thank you. Thank you to all the witnesses for being here today. I would like to touch on EPA's 2018 annual enforcement numbers and the trends, including what the overall picture tells us about the lack of environmental enforcement under this administration. Mr. Schaeffer, your organization recently analyzed EPA's enforcement trends, in light of the Agency's very own 2018 report. Broadly speaking, I think I heard you answer to Chairwoman DeGette that the message that you take away is that they do not prioritize enforcement of our bedrock American environmental laws. Is that correct? Mr. Schaeffer. I think that is true. Ms. Castor. Would you go as far as to say that EPA currently is abdicating its responsibility to the American public? Mr. Schaeffer. I would. Ms. Castor. And Dr. Sellers, do you agree with that as well? Dr. Sellers. I agree with both those answers. Ms. Castor. Because you recently contributed to a report on the erosion of EPA's enforcement, the same organization that developed this report analyzed the annual report. What else do you want the American people to understand is going on at EPA right now? Dr. Sellers. Well, I think there are a lot of things going on kind of below the publicity surface, below the level of the media, that a lot of the employees feel like that industry is absolutely calling the shots. This is a quote from one of our interviewees. Ms. Castor. Yes, can I just stop you there? You, in your testimony, you said that your organization conducted hundreds of interviews with recently retired and current EPA employees. And you say that many told you of pressures applied by Agency leadership explicitly urging EPA employees to go easy on industry. Give us some examples. What did they say? How many of the folks you interviewed said that? Dr. Sellers. I would not say hundreds. We did a hundred interviews. Ms. Castor. OK. Dr. Sellers. I mean, examples include, for instance, Scott Pruitt parading around the Agency with a trade association group and then calling people in from the career staff, the enforcement staff, to berate them and tell them they should listen to this trade association group. And I could multiply those stories. They are happening-- they happened all around the Agency, all these kinds of pressures that staff was under. And it registered. And so I think that is one of the big reasons. Also that they have had to report even routine inspection initiatives now to the political leadership. They have had pushback from the regulated communities. It has been harder to do their jobs just on the ground because of all the industries feeling embolden. For instance, a person doing a housing inspection for lead, a childhood brain-damager, found that landlords are not returning her calls or they were getting angry on the phone with her. So there is kind of micro-level pushback also is a big part of it. Ms. Castor. And Dr. Nelson, reading your testimony, I remember well after Hurricane Harvey and all the reports of it, environmental issues, and spills, and leaks in the Houston area. And part of your testimony is entitled The Path to Poison. I think folks would be appalled to understand that after that--while you had the county grand jury indict executives of a corporate polluter, EPA did not take any enforcement action at all. Is that true? Dr. Nelson. Not to my knowledge. Ms. Castor. What, in your opinion, has happened with EPA's interest in enforcing our environmental laws? Dr. Nelson. I think EPA is behaving in a negligent manner and communities in Houston and across the country are suffering the public health impacts as a result. Ms. Castor. Thank you. Mr. Schaeffer, given the downward trend of several key enforcement indicators, I am worried that in some cases that EPA may not be getting the attention they deserve. I understand your organization, the Environmental Integrity Project, has documented certain cases that you have concerns about. Walk us through a few of those examples. Mr. Schaeffer. Sure. We have, for example, two plants in Louisiana. In one case, the EPA inspectors found massive breakdowns in the compliance system that led to release of chloroprene, which is very toxic. It is a carcinogen, actually. The chloroprene levels downwind in the African American community that has been there forever, are way higher than EPA thinks is safe. We have butadiene coming out of the Firestone Polymers plant because, according again to EPA inspectors, the company really had no idea what was escaping out of its production process. And we are talking here about thousands and thousands of pounds. These are not paperwork violations. These are not little things. This is a company that is in the business of making chemicals, and it should know when they get into the environment. I don't think that is too much to ask. These cases have been sitting for years. We have got many other examples. We have got lead being blown from facilities that aren't managing their lead emissions and causing the air quality to exceed health-based standards in communities downwind. Why are these cases--why have they not resulted yet, several years later, in some cases 3 or 4 years later, in an enforcement action? So you are always going to find these problems out there. Ms. DeGette. The gentlelady's time has expired. Mr. Schaeffer. If you don't, you are not looking. Ms. Castor. Thank you. Ms. DeGette. Thank you. The gentleman from Virginia is recognized for 5 minutes. Mr. Griffith. Thank you very much, Madam Chair. Mr. Tenpas, we have heard some of the witnesses today criticize the administration's emphasis on cooperative federalism, implying that cooperative federalism will diminish or eliminate the EPA's role in controlling pollution. Is this how you understand cooperative federalism to work? Mr. Tenpas. No, sir. I mean EPA has a significant role in first establishing the rules. It has a significant role continuing and being able to investigate both civil and criminal violations, pursuing resolution of those cases. But as the name implies, cooperative federalism also involves a substantial robust and important role for the States. Mr. Griffith. So the EPA's role is not eliminated, is it? Mr. Tenpas. No. Mr. Griffith. And in these bad cases that we were just hearing about, the EPA can take action. Isn't that true? Mr. Tenpas. I don't know the specifics of those cases but, generally, as a general matter, yes. Mr. Griffith. Well it was interesting because I was listening and it was 3, 4 years. So obviously, it is not something new that has caused those problems that were just mentioned. What do you think the benefits are of the EPA's enhancing its collaboration with State and Tribal partners to enforce the environmental laws? Mr. Tenpas. Well I think you get a variety of things. One is EPA does have a level of expertise that it can, by working with the States, transfer to officials in those States as to the best practices for inspections, as to particular areas of concern, as to what the regulatory requirements are overall in discussing and making sure there is a clear understanding of those. So I think you know on the one hand bet, you get that. On the other hand, I think part of what undermines all federalism, cooperative or otherwise, is a recognition that often local officials know their communities best and they have an appreciation for the facilities, they have appreciation for the issues in the community, and they probably have a sensitivity and a level of contact with those facilities in a more regular way that just makes them knowledgeable and effective in trying to bring compliance to bear. Mr. Griffith. And in your opinion, how does cooperative federalism help promote a higher compliance rate? Mr. Tenpas. Well, as I said, I think it primarily comes about through drawing on and making robust the capacity that the State has, those officials who are in their communities in a regular way, and making them effective in using all of the tools we have talked about, again, not just enforcement actions but inspections, self-report and auditing programs. The effectiveness comes about by making those State officials able to do their work in a sensible way. Mr. Griffith. And in many ways, I mean if you have a bad actor, they are going to be bad actors no matter what. But for those people that are struggling in the medium-sized businesses, or even in small and large businesses, if they are struggling to figure out, ``OK what are the rules here, what do I need to do?,'' if they are sensing--and you can correct me if you think I am wrong--if they are sensing that there is a no win and even if they try hard, they are not going to succeed and they are going to get fined or penalized, it just becomes an adversarial proceeding. Whereas, if you are trying to help them and say ``Look, if you do it this way, things will be better and we are not going to fine you,'' doesn't that get more cooperation as well? Isn't that part of what the EPA is trying to do right now? Mr. Tenpas. My sense is that is part of what they are trying to do. And I would say just as a general matter for some of those, as you say, smaller entities that don't have necessarily the staff and the sophistication, they are trying hard. They want to follow the rules; sometimes they can be quite complicated. And there is something to the fact that I think for a lot of folks in that situation, the Federal Government sounds big and scary. A State government agency feels like a place that they think they can go to and get that advice that they need to get them to the place they want to be, which is in compliance. Mr. Griffith. Yes. In my district you know there are a lot of people, and I don't adhere to that, and a lot of people have advocated you know just we will abolish the EPA because they feel so put down, burdened, oppressed, that they just like forget it all. And yet I think the EPA can do some good things and that is why I support what the EPA is currently trying to do and what you have advocated for here today. I appreciate it very much and I yield back. Mr. Kennedy [presiding]. The gentleman yields back. I will recognize myself for 5 minutes. I want to start by thanking the witnesses for being here, and your testimony, and your service. And I wanted to begin by touching on the importance of deterring those bad actors, some of which my colleague just mentioned. I am worried that the most recent EPA numbers, as heard about earlier this morning, may send the wrong message to polluters and that the Agency is in fact failing to deter those future violations. So Dr. Shimshack, to start with you, sir, your testimony touches on this point and you have done some academic work in this area. Can you generally speak to the importance of deterrence and what approach to enforcement may be needed by the EPA to inhibit future environmental violations? Dr. Shimshack. Sure. So deterrence, the fact that inspections and penalties have implications for deterring future violations is important not just in the sanction and inspection facility but also there are spillover effects, what we call general deterrence of interventions. Those spillover effects of inspections and enforcement activities increase compliance and reduce pollution among others. And deterrence effects can also reduce future pollution beyond compliance behavior as well. Mr. Kennedy. So for you, Doctor, and for Mr. Schaeffer, what specific tools do you believe the EPA has in its arsenal to deter would-be polluters and do you believe that they are currently effectively using them now? Dr. Shimshack first. Dr. Shimshack. So I will say that the evidence suggests that interventions with teeth, fines are most effective. I otherwise defer to Dr. Schaeffer--Mr. Schaeffer. Mr. Schaeffer. Well, EPA uses a mix of tools and they have always included giving people compliance assistance and helping them to understand the rule of the road and those are important. I think one of the most important things that EPA does as a national program is step in against, frankly, some of the biggest polluters with lots of political connections and power and take enforcement actions that States will not or cannot because they don't have the capacity. If the EPA loses that ability, then we lose something very important. Mr. Kennedy. Are you concerned they are not leveraging that capability? Mr. Schaeffer. I am concerned about the direction the Agency is going in in that way. And we have, again, examples of violations that are pretty serious at big plants that just seem to be sitting there and not getting attention. Mr. Kennedy. And why is that, do you think? Mr. Schaeffer. Well, I don't know. I think there is a reluctance to enforce in this administration. I just have to put that on the table. There is a lot of talk about cooperative federalism. It has its value but there are certain responsibilities that you can't just push on--push off, rather, to the State agencies and I think that is letting a lot of these violations just sit. Mr. Kennedy. And Dr. Nelson, I wanted to see if you could chime in. You have noted in your testimony that Texas does not penalize 97 percent of its air pollution violations. If that number is accurate, and I am sure it is, the State either lacks the will or the capacity to deal with a lot of these issues, even during nonemergency times. So Doctor, can you comment further on what it may mean if the State of Texas is failing to penalize air pollution violations and how important it is for the EPA to deter bad actors, given the State may not always do so, building off of what Mr. Schaeffer said? Dr. Nelson. So if I understand your question correctly: What are the implications of the State not enforcing? Mr. Kennedy. Yes, and any reason as to why you think a State would not enforce 97 percent of the violations that would come up. Dr. Nelson. I don't think that the culture supports the State enforcing much of the violations. I think the evidence speaks for itself. I think in terms of the implications of that, that communities on the ground are experiencing the public health impacts of the State not enforcing the laws of the Texas Clean Air Act. I don't think that it is cost-efficient in a State like Texas for industry to comply with the law, when the risk of being caught is low and, even if they are caught, the risk of penalty and the penalties are so low as well. So the State of Texas can penalize facilities for $25,000 per day, per violation. And in that most recent report, they collected $1.2 million, which is about two cents per pound of the pollution that was released. Mr. Kennedy. Doctor, going off of what I think somebody taught me in law school way back when, if you judge the strength of the law by the power of its remedy and you have got remedies in place but the State just chooses not to enforce it, is there really any regulation to begin with? Dr. Nelson. Well the regulation exists. I think the burden is on the State agency and the State legislature to make it effective. Mr. Kennedy. And if there is no cost for compliance? Dr. Nelson. If there is no cost for compliance, again, I think that industry is going to behave in a manner that maximizes its bottom line until it is forced not to. Mr. Kennedy. Thank you. I yield to Ms. Kuster. Seeing no more from the witness, Ms. Kuster, you are recognized for 5 minutes. Ms. Kuster. Thank you very much. I appreciate it. I will start with Dr. Sellers, if I could. The report you contributed to says, quote, ``EPA employees point to budgetary uncertainty and staff loss as factors that help explain the downturn in enforcement under the Trump administration.'' Given the budgetary uncertainty and loss of staff that we have been discussing here today, what did EPA employees tell you about EPA's ability to enforce environmental laws? And if you could, give us one or two examples about how EPA was unable to go after polluters because of understaffing or this approach. Dr. Sellers. Sure. Yes, all the employees that we spoke with mentioned this factor about losing staff. I mean, there has been a gradual attrition and then there is, on top of that, the buyouts and so on. Ms. Kuster. Does that cause a lack of morale? Dr. Sellers. It does. I mean, it doesn't send a positive message. I think some of the departures are because people got that message and decided to leave. In terms of the kinds of things that are being lost, I could give you an example, for instance, of someone who is in charge of the asbestos program, at the enforcement, that left in one of these departures, and there was no exchange of knowledge. There was no effort. He had been there 20 years. He was kind of the expert on this area, and it was not passed along. So EPA is now at a loss and there is a big hole there in terms of what EPA can offer, even just in an advisory capacity, to industry, much less issues of enforcement. Ms. Kuster. Thank you. And I am going to direct this at Mr. Schaeffer but, to continue on that same theme, returning to my questions this morning, we in my district, a town called Litchfield, New Hampshire, had an incident of per- and polyfluorinated compounds, PFAs, caused by a company, Saint-Gobain's. And I discussed this morning that we have had to spend millions of dollars to hook up these households in this community to clean water because their wells are contaminated. They were on bottled water the whole time while they waited for that to happen. In our case, we were fortunate that it did happen, but I noticed there was an action plan released on PFAs last week from the EPA, but it doesn't seem to include any action, despite being called an action plan. While EPA officials said they intend to move forward with maximum containment levels, there is no commitment in the plan. And I am just curious about your response to that. And if you could comment, the witness this morning talked a great deal about voluntary disclosures and we have been given charts that the voluntary disclosures are going up. How can they count on these companies to voluntary disclose what they know about the contaminants that they have put into our soil, and our water, and our air? And are we doing what is needed to keep American families safe? Mr. Schaeffer. So, Congressman, I don't know the specific facts of the New Hampshire case. I would just say in general, your fundamental to enforcement and I would say just to justice is the responsible party should pay for the problems they created and enforcement has a huge role in that. And so I would look for that in any EPA strategy to deal with these contaminants. I think that would be really, really important. The government does, and I was there, I was part of this, the government rolls out a lot of plans and makes a lot of announcements. What you should look for are deadlines, and numerical targets, and specific outcomes. And that---- Ms. Kuster. And some type of time table. And when I asked her about the time table this morning, she said oh I will have to get back to you on that. There is no time table, as far as I can tell. Mr. Schaeffer. Well and maybe they will come back with a time table and it is great that you pushed for one. I think the government benefits from that kind of push. But without deadlines, not much happens in government agencies. Ms. Kuster. And what is your experience, just in my waning time here, with companies voluntarily disclosing that they have massive incidents of pollution, knowing that if they were caught, if there was remedy, they would be on the hook to pay for that? Mr. Schaeffer. They would have to pay. Well you know I think in my experience you can get those kinds of voluntarily disclosures when you have a strong enforcement program and people understand the consequences of not coming forward. They also want to know their competitors will be treated more or less the same way. If you don't have that level playing field, then you come forward, you know cut your deal to clean the mess up, and you are looking sideways at your competitors and you don't see that happen, then your voluntary compliance will fall off the cliff. Ms. Kuster. And given Dr. Nelson's comment about State-by- State, if you are in a State with very low compliance activity, why would you? I mean you are going to put yourself at a competitive disadvantage. So well, thanks to all of you for coming in today. We appreciate it. With that, I yield back. Mr. Sarbanes [presiding]. I thank the gentlewoman for yielding back. I am going to yield 5 minutes to myself for questions. I want to thank you all for being here today. I appreciate your testimony. I want to come back, as I was this morning, and talk about injunctive relief. And obviously, this is a really critical enforcement tool. It is saying to industries, it is saying to violators, it is saying to polluters you need to adopt a different way of behaving. You have to come into compliance with certain rules, there are costs associated with that. Mr. Buckheit and Mr. Schaeffer, as former EPA enforcement officials, tell me why you view this within the toolkit that is available to the EPA as such a critical enforcement mechanism. Mr. Buckheit. The EPA's enforcement program is not about collecting money for the Treasury. It is about protecting public health. Fines are a part of that but the really important part of that is what measures are installed to reduce pollution as a result of your actions. And the surrogate for that is the dollar amount of the injunctive relief. That reflects the kinds--the amount that must be invested which is directly related to the pollution reduction. Mr. Sarbanes. Mr. Schaeffer? Mr. Schaeffer. I think that answers directly. I think injunctive relief captures the cost of cleanup. When you see bigger commitments, that tells you that you are finding the right cases. You are finding the most serious problems where you need companies to make a real long-term investment in cleanup. Mr. Sarbanes. So I want to go back to the numbers a little bit because in fiscal year 2018, the EPA enforcement actions, injunctive relief actions resulted in $3.9 billion in injunctive relief. According to the Christian Science Monitor, this figure is the lowest in 15 years. And in that same article, it was indicated that 40 percent of that total comes from cases that were settled by the EPA during the Obama administration, which means that the fiscal year 2018 numbers could have been worse. I understand that when you capture these things makes a difference. You have to look at what the window is and so forth. But in any event, given what you know, Mr. Schaeffer, Mr. Buckheit, about this and these numbers that I just read to you, I am curious just to get your thoughts on the 2018 numbers. What do you think they mean and, frankly, is it sending some kind of signal to industry, and how are they interpreting that signal? Mr. Buckheit. Obviously, to state the obvious, they mean that there is less activity to reduce pollution coming out of the air. What I think is happening here is a pipeline issue. You see a number of years of fairly robust activity under the Obama administration and you have heard different witnesses talk about how it takes a period of time to build and maintain this pipeline of cases that will go through the system. What I saw in the enforcement policies was, I think, that the administration is cutting off activity, except for matters that are already referred to the Justice Department, in the four key sectors that have been identified as priorities. And so I think that then creates a gap in the pipeline, which then leads to the lower numbers in the bigger cases. Mr. Sarbanes. Which means we could see this trend continue---- Mr. Buckheit. I think so. Mr. Sarbanes [continuing]. In the future because the number of initiatives that are being undertaken now, we will see the results or lack of results of that further down the pipeline. Mr. Buckheit. I fully agree and I note that they don't have any sectors that they are focusing on for future activities, you know which big industrial sectors. Mr. Sarbanes. Right. Mr. Schaeffer, do you have any comments on kind of how the industry is going to interpret this? Mr. Schaeffer. I think that is a complete answer. To be fair, the total value of injunctive relief in any one year can be affected by one or two very large cases. But even controlling for those outliers, it is a pretty substantial drop. And I agree with Bruce that it reflects the fact that kind of less is being put in to enforcement than used to be and, sooner or later, that plays out in declining results. Mr. Sarbanes. And again, I just want to emphasize before I close here that if this isn't being exercised properly as an enforcement tool, it is sending a signal to industry that, in a sense, the cop is off the beat. They don't have to be as conscientious about the measures that need to be undertaken here. Whether they were inclined to do that or not absent somebody is leaning on them is a different question but, overall, that is not good signaling to have. Thank you all very much. Now I would like to yield 5 minutes to Congressman Tonko. Mr. Tonko. Thank you there, Mr. Chair and welcome to our witnesses. Mr. Schaeffer, as I understand it, civil penalties are an important EPA enforcement tool. I heard some of this last exchange and find it interesting. The penalties are monetary assessments, obviously, paid by a regulated entity because of a violation or noncompliance. They are designed to recover the financial benefit a company has obtained by breaking the law and they impose added costs to deter firms from breaking the law again in the future. So my question to you is, very briefly, could you explain why civil penalties are an important enforcement tool for EPA? Mr. Schaeffer. It has to cost you more when you violate the law you know than--it has to cost you more if you violate the law and ignore it than not. If there is no sanction, nothing hits your pocketbook when you fail to comply with your pollution limits, then you have less incentive to comply. Some companies with better management will continue to try to do that but slowly, the system erodes if people realize you never have to pay anything for violating the law. Mr. Tonko. Thank you. Again, Mr. Schaeffer, according to EPA's annual enforcement report for fiscal year 2018, EPA obtained just over $69 million in Federal administrative and civil judicial penalties last year. The Washington Post noted that the number of civil penalties assessed was the lowest since the Office of Enforcement and Compliance Assurance was established back in 1994. While that seems troubling on its face, I will hold up a chart that I did in the last for Administrator Bodine that adding now 2019 to date, and most of that spike, a huge spike, but it is explained I believe by the Fiat Chrysler situation. So now we have asked for information we hope to receive relatively soon what the impact of 2019 is if you take that Fiat Chrysler out of the picture. So troubling certainly on the face, is it a legitimate concern that we ought to have about those numbers? Mr. Schaeffer. Well I think you can take Fiat out and you can also take out the very large once in a great while penalties like the one for the BP---- Mr. Tonko. BP and VW. Mr. Schaeffer. Right. Mr. Tonko. And this chart was adjusted for that. Mr. Schaeffer. Right. If you do take those outliers out, I think you will still see a decline in 2018 and perhaps continuing into 2019 as well. Mr. Tonko. And Mr. Buckheit and Dr. Sellers, do you have any thoughts on what the latest civil enforcement numbers mean like those that I just shared? It seems like we had a few cases that drove things, especially now in 2019. Mr. Buckheit. I totally agree that the reduction in numbers, these numbers reflects badly on the program. And I would just add a comment about the mobile source enforcement numbers. It is a good thing that the administration is doing this and assessing a large fine but you have to keep in mind that California has its own independent enforcement authorities and California is pursuing this and getting a per vehicle penalty associated with it. So again, kudos to the administration for getting involved in doing this but you know it is a little bit--it is led by California in terms of pushing towards those large numbers. Dr. Sellers. Yes, I would just say that it is a mistake just to focus on the kinds of enforcement numbers that do have these big penalties or these big chunks that distort the data. If you look at all the other data that is not distorted by that kind of sum, and that is most of it, then the declines are even more marked and unmistakable. So that was what---- Mr. Tonko. Thank you. And Dr. Shimshack and Mr. Schaeffer, do you believe focusing on compliance assistance is a suitable substitute? Now, I heard some of that exchange that you had but as a suitable--is it a suitable substitute for enforcement activity, such as issuing civil penalties? Mr. Schaeffer. Certainly not. Compliance assistance is very important. A serious violation, unless there is some extenuating circumstances especially by large companies with deep pockets, they should pay. There is no conflict between compliance assistance and enforcement. You need both. Mr. Tonko. OK, Dr. Shimshack. Dr. Shimshack. My view is that they are complementary and not appropriate as substitutes for one another. Mr. Tonko. OK. Well you know many of us are concerned about the mission statement of EPA taken somewhat lightly. And the improvements we have made through the years and some of the concerns coming before them, as my colleague from New Hampshire raised with PFAS, there is real concern that the enforcement of these statutes and various programs become very, very critical to the quality of life in the communities that we all represent. And so I thank you all for sharing your thoughts today. With that, I yield back. Ms. DeGette [presiding]. Thank you, gentlemen. The charts that Mr. Tonko was referring to are part of the package of charts that were provided to both Democratic and Republican staffs by the EPA when we were being briefed. Ms. Castor also referred to one of these charts. And so I am going to ask unanimous consent to put these charts into the record. Without objection, so ordered. [The information appears at the conclusion of the hearing.] Ms. DeGette. I want to thank all the witnesses for their participation in today's hearing. And I want to remind the Members that pursuant to committee rules, you have 10 business days to submit additional questions for the record to be answered by witnesses who have appeared before the subcommittee. I would ask all of you, if you do get these questions, to please respond as quickly as possible. And with that, the subcommittee is adjourned. [Whereupon, at 1:40 p.m., the subcommittee was adjourned.] [Material submitted for inclusion in the record follows:] [GRAPHIC(S) NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]